The absolute perfect triangle Phil/Kobe pg's

Erik Eleven · Post #21 » by **Erik Eleven** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 5:43 pm

It's beyond me why we didn't snag him when we could, the last four years. Does Phil think he's too short, could that really be it?

Some of us have been told in the past that we're over rating him. I say he's one of the most under rated players in the league. Ask Nate McMillan. Sorry, miles, didn't mean to get you all revved up here... :lol:

Luke for Blake, straight up! They could use a passing forward with some strength, not just leaping and shooting ability.

Erik Eleven · Post #22 » by **Erik Eleven** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 5:46 pm

Right?

scoobs07 · Post #23 » by **scoobs07** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 7:04 pm

We could do an off season trade of Odom and Farmar for Heinrich and Gooden.

1. As mentioned, you cant get a much better fit at tri point guard than Kirk.

2. Gooden is almost as good a rebounder as Odom, so we balance it out in that regard. Thats really all we need from our back up power forward anyway. He is a decent scorer as well.

3. We could let Gooden walk in 2009 (6 million expiring), along with Ariza (3 million expiring). This would help us with giving Bynum that huge contract he has coming to him (12 million per year to start). If we simply held on to Odom and let him and Ariza walk (17 million) we would of had more then enough money to retain Bynum, without going over the luxury tax excessively. Im not sure about the numbers, but I think going with this scenario, we would go over the luxury tax by 5-10 million or so, but we would have a huge upgrade at our point guard spot, not to mention we would have to re-sign Farmar in a couple years anyway, so it would probably be the same thing.
2008-2009
PF-Gasol/Gooden
SF-Vlade/Ariza/Walton
C-Bynum/Rony/Mbenga
PG-Kirk/Fisher
SG-Kobe/Sasha

El Hardee · Post #24 » by **El Hardee** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 7:15 pm

In reality Hinrich would be my 1st choice of obtainable PG's, followed my Blake. If this was a wish list it goes like this: 1) Deron Williams 2) Chauncey Billups 3) Shaun Livingston 4) Kevin Martin.

hermes · Post #25 » by **hermes** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 8:06 pm

Erik Eleven wrote:Right?

yes
DO IT MITCH!

Dexmor · Post #26 » by **Dexmor** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 8:39 pm

Kevin Martin is not a pg he is a sg like Rip and Reggie and Redd. He plays like a mix of those guys. Billups might be a better triangle pg and Deron Williams is way better then Westbrook and Gilbert would be pretty nice to but I was talking realistic options.

Odom is better then Kirk but if you skip this year the margain is way thinner then you might think. Also like somebody said before we could probably get more then just Kirk in the trade. If they do get more that would give them an open spot at the starting sf and something to trade for to help them get a defensive specialist like a Battier type and if they had a Kirk type and Battier type Kobe could guard the worst of the 1-2-3 spot every night and that is what they should do imo if the opp presents itself although like I said I love the new Odom and Farmar is one of my favorite players.
I just think they would be a better defensive team getting a triangle pg and a defensive wing and it would truely benefit Kobe.
I also think with Bynum being 100% next year with the offense running threw Kobe or Bynum they will still be able to outscore anybody. Gasol would probably average 20 points at 60% from the field with Bynum and Kobe getting so many double teams.

Post #27 » by **tkb** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 9:08 pm

scoobs07 wrote:We could do an off season trade of Odom and Farmar for Heinrich and Gooden.

That's a horrible trade for us IMO.

scoobs07 · Post #28 » by **scoobs07** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 11:16 pm

tkb wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

That's a horrible trade for us IMO.

1. At first, it doesn't look like a very good trade for us. But when you factor in Odom making 14 million next year as a back up power forward, the up grade at point guard and Gooden's 6 million dollar expiring contract, its a pretty good deal for us.

A similar version of this deal would be Odom and Farmar for Billups and McDyss.

El Hardee · Post #29 » by **El Hardee** » Wed Apr 9, 2008 11:59 pm

Dexmor wrote:Kevin Martin is not a pg he is a sg like Rip and Reggie and Redd. He plays like a mix of those guys. Billups might be a better triangle pg and Deron Williams is way better then Westbrook and Gilbert would be pretty nice to but I was talking realistic options.

Odom is better then Kirk but if you skip this year the margain is way thinner then you might think. Also like somebody said before we could probably get more then just Kirk in the trade. If they do get more that would give them an open spot at the starting sf and something to trade for to help them get a defensive specialist like a Battier type and if they had a Kirk type and Battier type Kobe could guard the worst of the 1-2-3 spot every night and that is what they should do imo if the opp presents itself although like I said I love the new Odom and Farmar is one of my favorite players.
I just think they would be a better defensive team getting a triangle pg and a defensive wing and it would truely benefit Kobe.
I also think with Bynum being 100% next year with the offense running threw Kobe or Bynum they will still be able to outscore anybody. Gasol would probably average 20 points at 60% from the field with Bynum and Kobe getting so many double teams.

I think Martin would be a great TRI PG, he's got the length,shot and enough handles for our system. Remember Ron Harper was a all star SG for the Cavs before he met Phil. Besides you cant consider "cant dish Fish" a real PG. As pure PG's go , Fish is one of the worst in the league.

Post #30 » by **tkb** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 1:42 am

scoobs07 wrote:1. At first, it doesn't look like a very good trade for us. But when you factor in Odom making 14 million next year as a back up power forward, the up grade at point guard and Gooden's 6 million dollar expiring contract, its a pretty good deal for us.

A similar version of this deal would be Odom and Farmar for Billups and McDyss.

I don't think that trade is similar as Billups and McDyess are much better than Hinrich and Gooden.

If you think Hinrich is comparable to Billups you're severely overrating him.

Post #31 » by **tkb** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 1:46 am

Monta Ellis would also be a terrific fit as a triangle pg btw.

Mindflayer · Post #32 » by **Mindflayer** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 2:53 am

Pull up the old threads around the time we signed Fisher and you can see there were a few of us who wanted Blake as our target signing and not Fisher. Of course I wanted Banks the year before so what do I know. Blake has outplayed fisher every time they matched up this season. Oh well.

Read the Chicago board before trading for Hinrich. Farmer for Hinrich might be overpaying at this point.

ClubLakers KB8 · Post #33 » by **ClubLakers KB8** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 4:37 am

Lamar Odom, Jordan Farmar, and Luke Walton for Kirk Hinrich and Nocioni. This only has a chance if Larry Brown takes the Chicago job, he absolutely loves Odom.

Why for Chicago? Big expiring to help them rebuild, they get a young PG to replace Hinrich.

Why for LA? Perfect tri 1 and a tough as nail 3 who can tighten up the perimeter defense. Odom can fetch us a package like this that I think improves the team dramatically in terms of rounding out skill sets. They also get to rid themselves of Luke, who certainly doesn't need to be here anymore. If you count a potential re-signing of Odom (even for cheap), and Farmar only a respectable contract extension, this trade could actually save the Lakers money in the long run.

C - Bynum, Mihm (no trade clause - no way he waives it)
PF - Gasol, Turiaf
SF - Nocioni, Ariza, Vlad
SG - Bryant, Machine
PG - Hinrich, Fisher

Add a few vets and we are off.

Post #34 » by **Slava** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 5:36 am

^^I'm thinking you added Walton as salary relief but Odom and Farmar for Noc and Hinrich is a good enough deal if our frontcourt can stay healthy.

El Hardee · Post #35 » by **El Hardee** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 1:57 pm

Any chance we get to dump Luke and his salary we got to take. The trade sounds good, but how much does it really improve us, Odom is imho much better than Noc, Hinrich is better than Farmar. Odom has a big contract but so does Hinrich. The best part of this deal is dumping the Pukester. Count me in.

Post #36 » by **tkb** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 2:36 pm

If we deal Odom for Hinrich I will lose any confidence I have in our front office.

Hinrich has been horrible this season, and we're dealing big for small to boot.

I'd deal Odom for a Billups type deal, since Billups is a better player than Odom (and several tiers better than Hinrich), but for Hinrich we're severely overpaying. We'd need more than Nocioni back to make it a decent deal, especially when we're giving up our young pg in Farmar. I just really, really dislike that deal.

Erik Eleven · Post #37 » by **Erik Eleven** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 4:28 pm

tkb wrote:If we deal Odom for Hinrich I will lose any confidence I have in our front office.

Hinrich has been horrible this season, and we're dealing big for small to boot.

I'd deal Odom for a Billups type deal, since Billups is a better player than Odom (and several tiers better than Hinrich), but for Hinrich we're severely overpaying. We'd need more than Nocioni back to make it a decent deal, especially when we're giving up our young pg in Farmar. I just really, really dislike that deal.

I couldn't possibly agree more. The only (somewhat reasonable) Odom big-for-small deal I'd entertain right now would be for Billups. Billups is my number one choice PG in fit the entire league. Has been for years, and will be until he gets too old. He is made for the triangle.

islander009 · Post #38 » by **islander009** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 5:03 pm

I think Chauncey is a great PG in the League along with the perfect fit for the Triangle. Granted he is getting older and young gunners like Deron and CP3 coming along. With his current team I really dont see him leaving, he has the chemistry and confidence in his team. We might be able to get him on the end of his career but i think we should really consider a defensive minded PG...Delonte West maybe a good fit and is in his last year. I agree with Blake idea and is easily attainable. I like Marcus Banks at the 1 but I really hate his contract.

Post #39 » by **Slava** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 9:02 pm

I'm totally against trading away LO a this point and I believe that he's finally about to turn the corner in terms of consistency but if I were to make a deal with the Bulls, may be add Ariza or an '09 1st rd pick into the deal and ask for one of their young PFs? That'd make it effectively,

Odom + Farmar + '09 1st (the one we haven't traded to Memphis) for Hinrich + Nocioni + Tyrus

Post #40 » by **tkb** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:28 pm

Erik Eleven wrote:I couldn't possibly agree more. The only (somewhat reasonable) Odom big-for-small deal I'd entertain right now would be for Billups. Billups is my number one choice PG in fit the entire league. Has been for years, and will be until he gets too old. He is made for the triangle.

Agreed. I don't really get all the fuzz for Hinrich. He's not been good at all this season.