Official Kobe Bryant For MVP Thread (merges ongoing)

[FlawlessVictory]

Thank you Phil.

[Slava]

Wow! one of the greatest posts if not the best in my RealGm time.

Great great job!

Yes I logged in just to say that.

[FlawlessVictory]

My take on the subject... Credit to Real for a lot of the Stockton v Nash take and credit to slimjin for the MVP vs. wins list.

Kobe Bean Bryant is the MVP of NBA basketball. The dust has settled; the smoke has cleared. The Lakers sit atop the Western Conference. Based on the historical precedents set by past MVP selections, due to his outstanding statistical achievements, impact on the game, durability, winning, and leadership ability, no player other than 24 can legitimately hold up that trophy and deserve it.

First of all, LeBron can be immediately systematically eliminated. His team won 45 games. Because of that, he is automatically out of the running.

2006/07 Dirk Nowitzki 67 wins
2005/06 Steve Nash 54 wins
2004/05 Steve Nash 62 wins
2003/04 Kevin Garnett 58 wins
2002/03 Tim Duncan 60 wins
2001/02 Tim Duncan 58 wins
2000/01 Allen Iverson phi 56 wins
1999/00 Shaquille O'Neal 67 wins
1998/99 Karl Malone 61 wins
1997/98 Michael Jordan 62 wins
1996/97 Karl Malone 64 wins
1995/96 Michael Jordan 72 wins
1994/95 David Robinson 62 wins
1993/94 Hakeem Olajuwon 58 wins
1992/93 Charles Barkley 62 wins
1991/92 Michael Jordan 67 wins
1990/91 Michael Jordan 61 wins
1989/90 Magic Johnson 63 wins
1988/89 Magic Johnson 57 wins
1987/88 Michael Jordan 50 wins
1986/87 Magic Johnson 65 wins
1985/86 Larry Bird 67 wins
1984/85 Larry Bird 63 wins

As you can see, no player on this list of MVP award winners, other than Michael Jordan, ever won an MVP with less than 54 wins. MJ won the MVP in

[FlawlessVictory]

Brevity is not something I was gifted with.

I appreciate the compliments Kno and j-far. Thanks.

That said, I hope the voters make the right decision when they cast their ballot here sometime in the next week or so.

[milesfides]

i think you're right. i recall dirk accepting his award after the mavs had been eliminated.

Zing!

[milesfides]

FlawlessVictory, in my entire time on realgm, I can't remember too many posts better than the one you just wrote.

Never apologize for lengthy posts when you bring substance to the table. There's little fat to your post, it's brief enough.

And while there are some statements that are questionable or debatable, e.g., "Chris Paul just may be one of the single worst man defenders that the PG position has to offer", overall, your logic is sound, your evidence substantial, your reasoning convincing.

I like your style, I like your heart, and I hope that you'll find you have many kindred spirits here.

Welcome.

[FlawlessVictory]

I truly appreciate the high praise Miles. I spend a lot of time at other Lakers sites, but I love to come here from time to time as well. I find that anywhere you go, Laker fans are awesome.

I, myself, find CP3's help defense to be excellent. On ball, however, I've seen him struggle this year. I probably dipped my feet, maybe even jumped, into the pool of hyperbole by suggesting he might be one of the worst, but I honestly believe his man defense is lower echelon.

Here are a few pieces of data from a poster on another Lakers board named Borri:

Food for thought...something I posted in another thread:

NOH D against the Elite PG in the West's playoff teams:

Nash - 4G 49.1% FG (2nd worst out the other 7 west playoff teams) Nash season FG % is 50.8
Parker - 4G 50% FG (3rd worst out the other 7 west playoff teams) Parker season FG % is 48.9
Williams - 4G 57.5% FG (worst out the other 7 west playoff teams) Williams season FG% is 50.8

[Erik Eleven]

That's a fantastic post, FV.

And here I was going to paste some blab of mine from another thread...

Ah, what the hell? To prove that it's common practice around here to make an arse out of yourself, here it is:

In recent years, the MVP has gone to the key player of the best team. Since team record seemingly matters more than exceptional individual contributions, there should be no doubt about Kobe nudging out CP3 by virtue of his team's better record. The same goes for Dwight Howard, Deron Williams, Steve Nash, Tim Duncan, LeBron James, Dirk Nowitzki etc. That leaves KG and Kobe going head to head.

I guess it could be argued that KG notches out Kobe due to his team's better record, but in that same breath, when comparing Kobe to KG it needs to be considered that the Eastern Conference is nowhere near as competitive as the WC is this season. It could also be argued that the Celtics' record against the west is squeaky clean and thus the difference between EC and WC therefore shouldn't be taken into account.

If we add to the equation the difference in individual stats and the hypothetical speculation of sitting each candidate out, and estimating the record they would have without him. This is where it comes down to speculation and personal preference. Given the injury situation of the Lakers this season, there is no doubt in my mind that Kobe was more valuable to the Lakers record this season than KG was for the Celtics. Even without, KG the Celtics would probably win 55-60 games. Given the injury situation for the Lakers and the most competitive WC ever, without Kobe, the Lakers might have actually missed the playoffs.

The fact that KG has such a good team around him actually works against him. It could also be argued that KG has set the tone for that entire team and that the outcome of their season would be radically different had he not been there to set the tone for their defense. The same could be said for Paul Pierce and Ray Allen, who are both franchise players in their own right.

All in all, take Kobe off the Lakers and KG off the Celtics and I think it's pretty safe to say that the Lakers would miss the playoffs and the Celtics would still win the east. If true, that speaks volumes. I don't know what matters the most to the voters

[LLcoleJ]

great points too santa

[Erik Eleven]

[FlawlessVictory]

Erik Eleven, thanks and you raise solid points as well. Personally, I think Kobe and KG would have a greater basketball impact than Paul on a large majority of teams in the league. As you said, it's all very subjective when it comes to what a team might or might not be without certain players. Honestly, that isn't what I would use to determine my MVP. However, they have established criteria, starting with the days they grew tired of simply giving Jordan the MVP every year, that follows a very strange line of logic and that kind of value is considered highly.

[Erik Eleven]

Thanks. You should post here more often.

[tkb]

Here's a piece I've been working on regarding MVP + all the other awards:
Link

[Verbal]

Brevity is not something I was gifted with.

I appreciate the compliments Kno and j-far. Thanks.

That said, I hope the voters make the right decision when they cast their ballot here sometime in the next week or so.

One of the longest, and most well done posts I've seen in a long time.

Good job.

Good post.

Great work.

You should be a regular on this forum, if you're not already.

[Erik Eleven]

Nice, tkb.

[Verbal]

TKB, you've got an intimidating name.

[blix]

This year...

You gameplan for KG
You gameplan for CP3
You fear Kobe Bryant

/thread