Is the window of opportunity closed for Phoenix now?

[carrottop12]

-= original quote snipped =-



They might not be a playoff team in 2010.

Honestly, with how tough the west is.

Good be similar to the Otis Thorpe trade that landed Detroit the #2 pick.

Which ultimately resulted in Darko Milicic.

Personally I would have rather had Thorpe.

[Mr. Sun]

Spurs are showing what some people suspected: Shaq does not fit this team.

Damn good analysis there, SMRattler. However I think you made one fundamental mistake by placing too much emphasis on Shaq as a bad fit for the Suns.

The problem isn't Shaq, it's D'Antoni's inability to adapt the offense around him and use him offensively under the rim. When the Suns went on a roll it meant they were dishing him under the basket. Too often DiAntoni settled on posting him outside of the key and tossing him the ball were he is at his weakest. This doesn't make him a offensive threat which in return doesn't force double teaming. This fact doesn't bold well for spacing the floor.

[lukeridenour]

"if you cant beat them, join em"

thats what nash should do. if for the league minimum.

although who know if the spurs even want him.

[Blame Rasho]

-= original quote snipped =-



Damn good analysis there, SMRattler. However I think you made one fundamental mistake by placing too much emphasis on Shaq as a bad fit for the Suns.

The problem isn't Shaq, it's D'Antoni's inability to adapt the offense around him and use him offensively under the rim. When the Suns went on a roll it meant they were dishing him under the basket. Too often DiAntoni settled on posting him outside of the key and tossing him the ball were he is at his weakest. This doesn't make him a offensive threat which in return doesn't force double teaming. This fact doesn't bold well for spacing the floor.

Wrong, it is their inability to defend the pick and roll(with anyone) and Shaq's lack of FT ability(which blogs down their offensive flow) what is killing them.

This team a week ago was scoring in the 70's...

It is silly to think that Shaq being involved more in the offense is the solution.

[SMRattler]

-= original quote snipped =-
Damn good analysis there, SMRattler. However I think you made one fundamental mistake by placing too much emphasis on Shaq as a bad fit for the Suns.

Well, I agree D'Antoni as a coach in the playoffs is awfully weak. The playoffs are about game planning on both ends of the court. The regular season for D'Antoni is about expanding nothing. Not developing a defensive strategy. Not developing the ability to adjust to your opponent. The only thing he wants is fast pace, quick shots and great offensive players. All season long.

So, playoffs come around and you have to game plan on both ends. But you haven't done it all year long? You haven't forced your team to be discipline and tighten the defense throughout the year and now you want them to adjust during games? It's too much to ask these guys.

But the reason I kept the focus on the Shaq trade was that I think their best chance was to keep the cohesiveness and familiarity and make other teams adjust to the Suns the way they did before. In fact, they probably would have gotten a higher seed (the slid down quite a bit after the Shaq trade) and might have avoided the one team that has proven to be able to adapt to them and beat them. Or at the least, against that same team (Spurs), made them stretch themselves a lot more defensively and offensively to keep up.

D'Antoni has lost this team. Nobody seems to be buying what he's selling anymore. I kind of feel bad for him, seems like a nice guy.

[Mr. Sun]

Wrong, it is their inability to defend the pick and roll(with anyone) and Shaq's lack of FT ability(which blogs down their offensive flow) what is killing them.

The pick-and-roll doesn't succeed or die with Shaq, period. A coach protects against that by developing defensive discipline, like tight man coverage on a dribbler to prevent getting blocked out. Suns defenders are most always 3 feet from the dribbler allowing them to easily be screened out.

[Blame Rasho]

The pick-and-roll doesn't succeed or die with Shaq, period. A coach protects against that by developing defensive discipline, like tight man coverage on a dribbler to prevent getting blocked out. Suns defenders are most always 3 feet from the dribbler allowing them to easily be screened out.

I just think it was mind boggling that Shaq was left on an island on Tony Parker various times.

[Mr. Sun]

-= original quote snipped =-
I just think it was mind boggling that Shaq was left on an island on Tony Parker various times.

Exactly! He shoulda never be out swimming.

Incidently, who do you perceive will be the Spurs biggest threat, Lakers, C's?

[Blame Rasho]

Exactly! He shoulda never be out swimming. Incidently, who do you perceive will be the Spurs biggest threat, Lakers, C's?

The Suns... we have not beat them yet...

I will worry about the other teams later...

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

THey're done. They should trade Nash for the best package of young players they can get and try to rebuild around Stoudemire, Diaw, and Barbosa. It won't be pretty, but they can't afford to tank since they don't have their picks.

What teams are a veteran PG away from contending? Cleveland, perhaps; but they have no young talent to trade. Would Atlanta want Nash?

nate, Portland went after Kidd last season. I believe Nash is better than Steve Blake.

Portland has Cs to trade who could spell Shaq, as well as young PGs.

Just for grins, what about Nash and Strawberry for Blake, Rodrigues, Pryzbilla, and Portland's lottery draft pick?

[Spykes]

nate, Portland went after Kidd last season. I believe Nash is better than Steve Blake.

Portland has Cs to trade who could spell Shaq, as well as young PGs.

Just for grins, what about Nash and Strawberry for Blake, Rodrigues, Pryzbilla, and Portland's lottery draft pick?

For what it's worth, I think the Blazers would jump on that deal.

They can follow that deal up by packaging their 3 2nd round picks and cash to buy a late first rounder and pick a guy like Marion Chalmers. Either that or bring Koponen over to the states to learn from Nash.

Nash/Jack/(Koponen or a late 2008 pick)
Roy/Rodriguez/Strawberry
Webster/Jones
Aldridge/Outlaw/McRoberts
Oden/Frye/LaFrentz

Anyhow, enough day dreaming. I seriously doubt the Suns consider such a move.

[longfellow44]

Honestly I think that the Suns can reopen their window by making a couple moves this off season. But it starts with changing into a team that loves to play defense.

Move 1
TPE #15 pick
for
Artest
He gives the team what they've been missing. He's a great defender and he can take over a game on the offensive end too. Plus despite what people say about him he's a good locker room guy. His contract is actually benificial to the suns because if it doesn't work out they can let him expire or try a S&T in 09.

Move 2
Sign a defensive PG to the MLE for 2 years.

Next extend the playing rotation out to atleast 8 if not 9 players too keep everyone fresh and take pressure off.

New Lineup
Nash/MLE
Bell/Barbosa
Artest/ Hill
Amare/Diaw
Shaq/LLE

This is a last ditch effort season, Phoneix has a good mix of guys and all of the contracts are in a favorable position. If it doesn't work in that season the rebuild starts the following season by trading Nash, S&T Artest, and then keeping and signing their draft pick.

I think Kerr made a great decision to go for Shaq because either Shaq or Duncan have been in the finals each year for the last 14 years. Not to mention the Marion situation wasn't ideal either. I think that Kerr could take a chance on Artest and it very well may pay off.

[caborn]

Well, it's sad because mostly all of the picks they have traded have been good/solid... Deng, Rondo, S Rodriguez...

I agree with longfellow that they're 'wop' is not closed yet...a catch like Artest would bring them back up. Will Sarver spend that dough?

[Spykes]

With Artest, I wouldn't worry about how much Sarver is willing to spend, rather, how much it's going to take to get him from the Kings. They seem to have a pretty high price tag on him, so I don't think the TE and the #15 pick are gonna get it done. The Kings would likely rather keep him for the year, see what they can get out of him during the summer and at the trade deadline.

[caborn]

Yeah...looking at it now I don't think it's possible. Unless it's split into two seperate trades and the Kings toss out SAR or Kenny Thomas...which would be tricky.

[longfellow44]

sorry i just am a big fan of trading Artest and may want less than other kings fans. I just feel that he's not what the kings need right now. He keeps the team competitive but the Kings don't have enough overall talent to go anywhere so the fact that he wins us games doesn't do anything for us. I would rather use Artest to get the young talent that will be in the longterm plans of the Kings.

Other kings fans would want to dump one of KT or SAR in a trade like this.

Diaw #15
for
Artest

KT
for
TPE

two seperate trades but it could work for both teams as long as PHX is wiling to spend the money.

[pballa]

Kerr never should've traded Shawn Marion. He fit in so well with Nash & Amare, why mess that up? I know they didn't reach the Finals the previous seasons but you never know. They had a better team before Shaq came. Oh well, they had their chance. Time for a new team to be the "it" team.

because marion didnt WANT to be in PHO, off the court there were clashes.