Top FIVE Young Teams...

celticfan42487 · Post #41 » by **celticfan42487** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:23 pm

Foye a'int Roy.

As for why TOR is listed. Because no one's heard of half their players till the past 2 years.

Now you see them in the playoffs barely knowing they exsisted except for 3 games and you think wow they must have a lot of young players.

When in actuallity they have a bunch on players that are in their prime but were playing in Europe.

If Raps got a lot of time on ESPN no one would think Calderon is like 22 years old.

Wizenheimer · Post #42 » by **Wizenheimer** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 3:24 pm

revprodeji wrote:Wolves did not have Foye til the end of the season. lets see how good the blazers are without Roy for most of the season.

...or without Oden for the entire season

Post #43 » by **revprodeji** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:02 pm

Nobody knows what Oden might bring. If you say that I can say Theo Ratliff, since our biggest issue was the lack of a defensive big guy next to Al forcing Al to defend the 5.

Let's look at Randy Foye's April numbers. I know that's a very limited set of data to work with, but as a rookie he didnt play regularly early on, and this year he sat out three months. So its a bit skewed but bare with me.

Points - 18.4
Assists - 5.8
Rebounds - 3.0
FG - 46%
3P - 42%
3P made - 2.2
FTA - 1.8
FT - 89%
Steals - 1.1
Minutes - 36.1

Again, keep in mind that just April, but if you look at Brandon Roy's season the numbers are very similar.

My point is that next season, if Foye is healthy and plays a full season with regular minutes, then I'll agree to compare him with Roy. When given the opportunity, he'll put up similar numbers. If not, then the national media and other McHale bashers can trash that trade, but let's give it a chance. The way his numbers looked once he got rolling this season, it appears Foye and Roy might not be that far apart after all.

cucad8 · Post #44 » by **cucad8** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 4:18 pm

revprodeji wrote:Nobody knows what Oden might bring. If you say that I can say Theo Ratliff, since our biggest issue was the lack of a defensive big guy next to Al forcing Al to defend the 5.

Let's look at Randy Foye's April numbers. I know that's a very limited set of data to work with, but as a rookie he didnt play regularly early on, and this year he sat out three months. So its a bit skewed but bare with me.

Points - 18.4
Assists - 5.8
Rebounds - 3.0
FG - 46%
3P - 42%
3P made - 2.2
FTA - 1.8
FT - 89%
Steals - 1.1
Minutes - 36.1

Again, keep in mind that just April, but if you look at Brandon Roy's season the numbers are very similar.

My point is that next season, if Foye is healthy and plays a full season with regular minutes, then I'll agree to compare him with Roy. When given the opportunity, he'll put up similar numbers. If not, then the national media and other McHale bashers can trash that trade, but let's give it a chance. The way his numbers looked once he got rolling this season, it appears Foye and Roy might not be that far apart after all.

You just get all amped up to re-post this in any discussion of youth, don't you? This isn's just about Roy vs. Foye. Also, we are talking about youth on teams, so why would you bring up Theo Ratliff exactly? You say look at what Foye can bring, and that is true, then we can all get blue in the face discussing Al vs. LMA, and Roy vs. Foye. BUT, since we are discussing whole teams, we didn't have Oden this year, and we theoretically will next year. He is young, so he DOES get included in the discussion. And if you are trying to compare what the teams COULD HAVE done, by saying look at Foye's numbers, see, we were close to as good as the Blazers, then it fits just as well to say, well, that's great. We were missing Oden. So with BOTH teams at full health, we'll see how similar they are. Just re-posting something from a Roy vs. Foye thread doesn't exactly fit into this discussion as much as you would like. Sorry. Theo Ratliff?? :noway:

farzi · Post #45 » by **farzi** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 5:24 pm

Foye doesn't face the other team's best defender / double teams every time down the court. He's not the leader Roy is. He may be better some day (debatable), but right now Roy is on a whole 'nother level (not debatable)

kandiking · Post #46 » by **kandiking** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 6:41 pm

this is not a randy foye thread. this is a youth thread, dammit. portland has the best young core.

Hendrix · Post #47 » by **Hendrix** » Fri Apr 25, 2008 9:58 pm

celticfan42487 wrote:
When in actuallity they have a bunch on players that are in their prime but were playing in Europe.

We have 1 guy playing that was playing in Europe (Parker) and he's past his Prime. Rasho's been in the league forever. The rest don't play. Calderon's been in the league for quite a while.

may191988 · Post #48 » by **may191988** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:34 am

the biggest reason why toronto does not have that great of a young core is because their top young talent are 4 players that play 2 different positions.

Duiz · Post #49 » by **Duiz** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 10:43 am

Funny how people assume that Greg Oden won't be Sam Bowie 2.0

Jsun947 · Post #50 » by **Jsun947** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:02 pm

Duiz wrote:Funny how people assume that Greg Oden won't be Sam Bowie 2.0

You sir are an idiot. None of his injuries throughout highschool to now is related. Tonsils, a broken wrist, and knee surgery?

Hes bigger and stronger right now then he was at Ohio. Hes progessing from surgery much quicker then Amare did and hes younger.

Seems like Greg is more capable of playing in a NBA game right now then Bynum is.

farzi · Post #51 » by **farzi** » Mon Apr 28, 2008 7:09 pm

Duiz wrote:Funny how people assume that Greg Oden won't be Sam Bowie 2.0

Funny how people assume that Williams and Boozer will win more championships than Malone and Sockton.

Seems like Greg is more capable of playing in a NBA game right now then Bynum is.

This is going to get misconstrued, and you're going to get flamed.

Tekkenlaw · Post #52 » by **Tekkenlaw** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 7:20 pm

For the rebuilding teams.

1. Blazers
2. Wolves
3. Bobcats
4. Sonics
5. Bucks

For playoff teams.

1. Lakers
2. Jazz
3. Hawks
4. Sixers
5. Raptors

celticfan42487 · Post #53 » by **celticfan42487** » Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:33 pm

Hendrix wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

We have 1 guy playing that was playing in Europe (Parker) and he's past his Prime. Rasho's been in the league forever. The rest don't play. Calderon's been in the league for quite a while.

Really? I disagree.

Parker is a good example though, no one knowes about him yet past 2 years he's the starting SG on Toronto. He must be some young undrafted fella that didnt' get some hype.. maybe a second rounder no more then 23 years old. And he's 33.

Calderon played in Europe and was signed so no one knowes about him [no draft hype, no college ball, nothing so he's new to everyone]. Again same thoughts of wow he must be 20 something like the rest of the new players. He's 27 years old and in his prime.

Then you have Garbs from last year in the ROY talks but the casual fan wouldn't know he is in his prime during his rookie season.

Then you have Moon who played somewhere for his rookie years and now was signed and came out of nowhere.. in the spotlight at the dunk contest [wich is usually full of young young palyers under 23] but again is in his prime right now at 28 years of age.

And that's what I was getting at. Since no knowes about them the assumption is if they're new they have to be relatively young. Yet they're all in their primes [Parker is on the downside]

schaffy · Post #54 » by **schaffy** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:25 am

Funny how people assume that Williams and Boozer will win more championships than Malone and Sockton.

Yea, someone named Michael Jordon was playing then and winning a lot of championships. Williams and Boozer have a chance to win a championship in Utah.

None of his injuries throughout highschool to now is related. Tonsils, a broken wrist, and knee surgery

Really, knee surgery isnt related? Chris Webber, Allen Houston, Penny Hardaway, Darius Miles all would disagree with you.

blazersmaniac8 · Post #55 » by **blazersmaniac8** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:08 am

... imlbj23 (wtf does ur name mean??) he means that bowie had chronic injuries to I believe his legs meanwhile oden has had a fluke injruies, tonsils (no worry whatsoever) broken wrist (not something you see injured alot in the nba so lil to no worries) and knee surgery (yes worry but no problems before with it).

One of Shemps Kids · Post #56 » by **One of Shemps Kids** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:14 am

blazersmaniac8 wrote:... imlbj23 (wtf does ur name mean??) he means that bowie had chronic injuries to I believe his legs meanwhile oden has had a fluke injruies, tonsils (no worry whatsoever) broken wrist (not something you see injured alot in the nba so lil to no worries) and knee surgery (yes worry but no problems before with it).

Maybe its 'I'm LeBron James 23'.

Hendrix · Post #57 » by **Hendrix** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:19 am

celticfan42487 wrote:Really? I disagree.

Parker is a good example though, no one knowes about him yet past 2 years he's the starting SG on Toronto. He must be some young undrafted fella that didnt' get some hype.. maybe a second rounder no more then 23 years old. And he's 33.

Calderon played in Europe and was signed so no one knowes about him [no draft hype, no college ball, nothing so he's new to everyone]. Again same thoughts of wow he must be 20 something like the rest of the new players. He's 27 years old and in his prime.

Then you have Garbs from last year in the ROY talks but the casual fan wouldn't know he is in his prime during his rookie season.

Then you have Moon who played somewhere for his rookie years and now was signed and came out of nowhere.. in the spotlight at the dunk contest [wich is usually full of young young palyers under 23] but again is in his prime right now at 28 years of age.

And that's what I was getting at. Since no knowes about them the assumption is if they're new they have to be relatively young. Yet they're all in their primes [Parker is on the downside]

Parker tailed off quite a bit this year, and from what I've heard from European fans he was better in Europe and dropped off quite a bit Definitly not in his prime. He was the 21st pick inthe draft, and was in the NBA for 3 years but didn't get much burn before going to Europe btw.

Garbajosa doesn't play for us. He helped us last year, but he had nothing to do with this year.

Moon yeah I guess, but I woouldn't say 28 is really that old, and he hasn't been playing in Europe (not that it matters lol).

Calderon wasn't even that good in Europe, or that good when he came here. He's been here for 3 years and pretty much all of his development was in the NBA. His situation isn't much diffrent from Ginobi a vouple years ago.

Duiz · Post #58 » by **Duiz** » Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:36 am

woah woah odenistas. Let's not get too far. He has a lot to prove. Him and Morrison have a lot to prove this year if they are worth it or not. you have LaMarcus Alridge anyways, the guy is a stud.

schaffy · Post #59 » by **schaffy** » Thu May 1, 2008 12:59 am

blazersmaniac8 wrote:... imlbj23 (wtf does ur name mean??) he means that bowie had chronic injuries to I believe his legs meanwhile oden has had a fluke injruies, tonsils (no worry whatsoever) broken wrist (not something you see injured alot in the nba so lil to no worries) and knee surgery (yes worry but no problems before with it).

Yes Bowie had chronic injuries. However, knee surgery is always big and some athletes can not come back to 100%. Some can, some cant. Webber never had problems before he had surgery. Look what that did to his career. I am in no way saying that will happen to Oden, you just never know. It is still a question mark. Amare bounced back great. Kenyon Martin, not so much. There is still cause to worry and those injuries still matter. And the "he bounced back faster than Amare" thing. Amare was and still is much more athletic than Oden. And athleticism helps when recovering from surgery.

Wizenheimer · Post #60 » by **Wizenheimer** » Thu May 1, 2008 1:16 am

imlbj23 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-

Yes Bowie had chronic injuries. However, knee surgery is always big and some athletes can not come back to 100%. Some can, some cant. Webber never had problems before he had surgery. Look what that did to his career. I am in no way saying that will happen to Oden, you just never know. It is still a question mark. Amare bounced back great. Kenyon Martin, not so much. There is still cause to worry and those injuries still matter. And the "he bounced back faster than Amare" thing. Amare was and still is much more athletic than Oden. And athleticism helps when recovering from surgery.

how did you deduce that?