Fantastic Jack McCallum Article(State of The Suns)

[rsavaj]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/w ... index.html

That made me a little sad.

[NaplesSunsFan]

I'd say that pretty much sums it up well, yeah.

I'd say we now know why Tucker was called up

Dantoni is gone for SURE from the sounds of it.

Why do I get the sense Paxton is gonna be our next coach?

Also, from that article, did I get the sense that there is a major riff between Dantoni and the /entire/ organization? Even the scouts now? Have him and Griff had beef before?

And don't forget. The most debilitating draft we had was on Danton's GM watch. Now sure, he was probably just a puppet for Sarver at that point, but still.

[enigmatics]

It is sad...........reminding us of the Joe Johnson eye injury and the suspensions - random events which didn't give the Suns their best chances. Regardless, Jack points out something I know I've been saying for a long time. D'Antoni's mild practices lend to poor defensive mechanics.

[jaypo]

Can someone please (and I'm not being smart azzed; I really want to compare) post the salaries of some less productive centers in the NBA and compare them to Shaq's? I'd love to see how they are claiming that someone averaging a double double and cancelling out TD is a bust and an albatross.

[scootfu602]

Isn't Shaqs salary void pretty much by Marions and Banks? By that I mean, there salaries combined was equal to or greater than Shaqs. If I am not mistaken.

[NaplesSunsFan]

Isn't Shaqs salary void pretty much by Marions and Banks? By that I mean, there salaries combined was equal to or greater than Shaqs. If I am not mistaken.

Well trades are always equal, salary wise.

We had more options with Marion and Banks. They could be used separately from each other. Shaq's is now just one large 20 mill elephant. We can't cut it up, or trade it. We are just stuck with it.

Marion could have been traded, Banks too. nobody will trade for Shaq.

I'm not saying that I agree it was a failed experiment though.

[eastsidecrossover]

no one wanted banks first off. marion also had a high price tag which makes it hard to trade to a point.

I like what shaq has done for this team. Yeah, we lost some steals and our best on the ball defender, but I love that we are finally out rebounding people for once.

I have heard there were some people pissed at MD due to his stubbornness and not playing his bench. That stupid comment about it is not his job to develop players was one of the stupidest things I have ever heard.

[Sun Scorched]

We would have never gotten return value for Marion. If we didn't trade him he would have walked... we weren't going to pay him waht he wanted.

I liked Banks, just not on this team. He didn't work in our system. That happens some times.

Shaq brought rebounding.

DOES ANYONE REMEBER OUR LACK OF REBOUNDING BEFORE SHAQ?!

I feel like I'm going crazy. He's doing exaclty what we brought him in for. His jump hook, passion and defense are all added benefits.

[BringinDaRuckus]

Does no one see the value of Shaq after next season??? Shaq will have one year remaining on his contract after next season. To me that seems pretty important for a team trying to dump salary or make a big trade happen.

That KG trade couldn't have happened without Theo's massive expiring contract. Just saying his value could be when he is expiring.

[The Diesel]

There's no other person I can see worth trading Amare for; maybe except Chris Bosh.

He's the only guy I would consider because he's a perfect fit for the Run 'N Gun system and he'd be a good compliment to Shaq.

If not Bosh, I wouldn't trade Amare for anybody else except...Tim Duncan.

But that will never happen.

Don't trade Amare!

And I could see Toronto being interested because Bryan Colangelo drafted Amare.

[BringinDaRuckus]

There's no other person I can see worth trading Amare for; maybe except Chris Bosh.

He's the only guy I would consider because he's a perfect fit for the Run 'N Gun system and he'd be a good compliment to Shaq.

If not Bosh, I wouldn't trade Amare for anybody else except...Tim Duncan.

But that will never happen.

Don't trade Amare!

And I could see Toronto being interested because Bryan Colangelo drafted Amare.

I would like to think we would at least strongly consider trading Amare for LBJ...

[mkot]

There's no other person I can see worth trading Amare for; maybe except Chris Bosh.

Chris Bosh's offense isn't as good as Amare's IMO and his defense is as bad as Amare if not worse. And he hasn't perform well in the playoffs.

If not Bosh, I wouldn't trade Amare for anybody else except...Tim Duncan.

and maybe Dwight Howard.

[The Diesel]

Well, I don't want to trade Amare at all (Except if it was for Duncan), but I read a post recently which said that Amare MIGHT be traded.

I was simply naming the only two players who I would consider trading him for if he were to be traded.

I love Dwight, but he's a C, not a PF. Him and Shaq would not fit in together.

Amare compliments Shaq well because he can hit the mid-range jumper; Dwight has no jump-shot.

[NaplesSunsFan]

I was only explaining to that guy about the salaries matching, and why it was more than just simply "They cancel each other out"

from a 'being able to use in trades and such' standpoint, Marion and Banks are more useful than Shaq. Thats all I was sayin

I actually think Shaq is great for this team. It isn't his fault we are down this series. And if we are up like we should be, he is getting a lot of credit right now. So BACK DA **** UP!

[rsavaj]

-= original quote snipped =-



and maybe Dwight Howard.

Take a gander at the "Young Big Men Comparison Thread" in the Player Comp board, I learned a lot about Bosh/Howard/Amare that I didn't know before.

Amare's one of the main reasons I watch basketball, but Bosh is a player that you'd have to consider as a potential candidate for trade, IMO.

However, I believe that the Nash/Amare PnR is unstoppable, so as long as we have Nash, we should keep Amare.

[mkot]

Yea rsavaj, I read that some time ago and of course one of tsherkin's post (and I stopped reading the rest of the thread after his post lol) and I know how close they are. All things aside, Bosh still hasn't step up his game in the playoffs. Although he did better this year against Dwight.

I really wouldn't consider trading Amare for Bosh. If we're to trade Amare, we're not going to make lateral move. Trading Amare for Bosh, IMO, is a lateral move at best.

[-SDU-]

amare for bosh? hell no

amare is the future of the big man in the NBA, i wouldnt trade amare for any other big in the NBA one for one

you want him, then it has to be a package deal

ie bosh and calderon

[tsherkin]

Chris Bosh's offense isn't as good as Amare's IMO and his defense is as bad as Amare if not worse. And he hasn't perform well in the playoffs.

Not true, Bosh is better than Amare on defense by virtue of effort and the fact that you are neglecting to mind that Bosh is playing defense against 5s. He's D on fours, particularly perimeter-oriented 4s, is mediocre to average, which is still better than Amare on anyone.

Remember when we discuss Amare's offense, especially as we have seen it since the Shaq trade, that he has done so in a very particular fashion and you don't want to over-pressure him (or his knee). With Bosh, the injury concerns aren't quite as great but don't ignore that he's had knee issues in consecutive seasons himself and that he's statistically similar but less efficient than Amare. A better defender and passer, though, both tantalizing options, and he doesn't give up much in terms of end-to-end speed, which is nice.

Personally, I wouldn't pull the trigger on that trade, unless I was Bryan Colangelo.

What would the Suns gain? It's at best a lateral move; they might improve defensively but would regress offensively. There's no appreciable difference in rebounding and while there is a statistical edge in Bosh's favor as a passer, mind that Amare's role has never been that of a distributor and that Bosh plays in an offense that emphasizes passing the ball... too, he starts HIS isolations while working from 20 feet away from the rim on the wing, whereas Amare more often than not touch-screens and rolls or comes across the weakside along the top of the foul line for a catch-and-dive to the rim... pops for jumpers, that sort of thing. He's rarely put into positions where he's OBLIGED to pass, let alone looking to do so, so any disparity in passing numbers is relative to style of play until Amare is pushed to show what he has in that regard.

I like Bosh, despite my prolific and vociferous criticism of him (he's on my hometeam, I'm obliged to talk about him, really), but I don't think it really changes anything about Phoenix's disposition. He's not a good ENOUGH defender to really change Amare's problem because Amare is obliged to guard and play against 5s as often as is Bosh, so it wouldn't help any to swap players.

[Go7enKs]

Bosh is WAAAAAY overrated. Not as good as Amare, not even close. Amare has the potential of being a franchise player (he's very close already). Bosh to me will always be second banana. That's why the raps can't get better now, they want him to be to go-to guy when he'll never be that type of player.

[Sarlonus]

STAT should only be traded for Dwight Howard (which the Magic would never do).

If we want to think towards the future, we do not trade anybody. Kerr set the salaries so they all pretty much expire for the 2010/2011 season. We re-tool this off-season and make a playoff push. If that doesn't work, we just keep all the expiring and try to be competitive for one season. Hopefully, we can say in the high lotto/playoffs for the 2010 draft so the Sonics don't get a high pick. After that, we can start re-building the team (possibly without Kerr too because his contract ends then) because we will have a lot of cap room.