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Best Chance to Trade Bobby Simmons

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Best Chance to Trade Bobby Simmons 

Post#1 » by Licensed to Il » Wed May 7, 2008 10:16 pm

Not sure if this deserved its own thread, just wanted to point out that we may be up against "the perfect storm" to trade Bobby Simmons this offseason.

1) Bobcats GM Michael Jordan loves Bobby, enticed him to come out of school early (when MJ ran the Wiz) with the promise of a first round draft selection (and then took him in the second). The two have worked out together in past offseasons. MJ is famously loyal to guys that are loyal to him, etc.

2) Now that Larry Brown is the coach of the Bobcats (and already made a quote about how he would have loved to coach the Mavs!... you got to love Larry Brown) it is only a matter of time before he starts demanding a few defensive minded vets who can shoot to implement his system. Charlotte has a roster full of ncaa darlings (may, morrison, etc) who (due to injuries) are still relative youngsters to the NBA game. Larry Brown hates those guys, doesn't play them, and might lobby to trade the first pick in the draft if it would get him his precious Eric Snows and Aaron McKies of the world...

3) Charlotte actually has some talent, and has taken on some salary, but has not fielded a winner. Not saying that trading for Bobby would make them a winner, but they do have growing pressure to make the playoffs and fill the seats. I am willing to go out on a limb and say that Hammond (who stole Rip from Jordan and the Wiz because MJ hated Rip personally) is crafty enough to go to that well twice, and try to fleece MJ again.

Will the perfect storm materialize and allow us to ship off Bobby for something of value? Hard to say. But if I had to bet, I would bet anything that the Bobcats are our best chance.
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Post#2 » by europa » Wed May 7, 2008 10:20 pm

I've heard from multiple sources that there were potential trades involving Simmons at the deadline involving at least two Western Conference teams. Whether those teams would still have interest or whether Hammond would be interested is the question.
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Post#3 » by paulpressey25 » Wed May 7, 2008 10:27 pm

I say we get nothing of value for Bobby. Nothing. Maybe some cap filler in a big trade where we get back a JO or a Brand is the best we could hope for. But Yi/Redd/Mo/#7 in any combination is going out in such a deal.

The best thing we might, might be able to pull off is Bobby/#7 for Josh Howard if Cuban decides he wants to blow it up with youth around Dirk. But that is a pipe dream of mine.
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Post#4 » by Johnny Newman » Wed May 7, 2008 10:36 pm

Maybe to NY for Richardson.
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Post#5 » by Licensed to Il » Wed May 7, 2008 10:38 pm

Europa, which teams? I am guessing Sacremento, San Antonio, New Orleans, LA Clips, and Houston are five WC teams that could find minutes for him based on their offensive or deffensive schemes.
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Post#6 » by Licensed to Il » Wed May 7, 2008 10:40 pm

I'll also throw out there that Skiles is probably a coach who (depending of course on Bobby's practice habits and locker room attitude) that would use Bobby in the rotation a lot. So even if he stays, I have higher hopes for Bobby in the next two years than I did the last two.
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Post#7 » by fam3381 » Wed May 7, 2008 10:48 pm

Charlotte will pay $22 million next year to J-Rich and Wallace, and those guys have deals into next decade, so even if Jordan loves Simmons it doesn't make much sense positionally for them.

I'm guessing Bobby sticks around next season and contributes something; not $10 million worth, but I think he can still be productive. After that he'll be an expiring contract so he'll become much easier to move even if he's still not producing. But I agree that any deal for him in the short term won't bring back anything of value unless we package him with real assets (Mo/Redd or a pick).
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Post#8 » by rilamann » Wed May 7, 2008 10:54 pm

Will Perdude wrote:I'll also throw out there that Skiles is probably a coach who (depending of course on Bobby's practice habits and locker room attitude) that would use Bobby in the rotation a lot. So even if he stays, I have higher hopes for Bobby in the next two years than I did the last two.



I agree that if the Bucks get on the right track under Hammond and with Skiles as coach and start playing good basketball Simmons could very well be a good productive player for us next year if we get ''stuck with him''.

Like you said in that Yi thread about how Yi has that ''Bogut factor'' I think Bobby Simmons is kind of like that too.

I realize there has been health iussues with Simmons but I think Simmons would be more productive and more valuble on a good team than a bad.

If you are talking a trade with the Bobcats though a deal i'd like would be Simmons for May (and whoever else needed to make work for cap reasons).
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Post#9 » by EastSideBucksFan » Wed May 7, 2008 10:59 pm

fam3381 wrote:Charlotte will pay $22 million next year to J-Rich and Wallace, and those guys have deals into next decade, so even if Jordan loves Simmons it doesn't make much sense positionally for them.

I'm guessing Bobby sticks around next season and contributes something; not $10 million worth, but I think he can still be productive. After that he'll be an expiring contract so he'll become much easier to move even if he's still not producing. But I agree that any deal for him in the short term won't bring back anything of value unless we package him with real assets (Mo/Redd or a pick).



Yeah, unless something comes along where we can get something of value for him, which would have to come in a package deal moving the pick or Yi or Redd or Mo, I say we hang onto Bobby.

I still think his value has a chance to improve a bit (yeah, I know thats ridiculous going into his 4th year here).

But, this offseason he is healthy and is going to train with Tim Grover (according to BuckSkinsFan). Hopefully he can improve his quickness and bring his weight down a bit. His shot was looking great at the end of the year. It's those cement boots that need to go if hes going to be able to defend for us.

I have a feeling that Skiles would know how to utilize his outside shooting and his willingness to play D on multiple positions. When he was in better shape before the injury, Bobby could guard three positions on the floor. He can be a very versatile player. But he needs to work hard this offseason to get that explosiveness back.


In response to the original thread, I don't really think Charlotte is a very good trading partner for us.

Besides Okafor, who I think would be a very good PF next to Bogut, they don't have anything I think they would be willing to move for Simmons.

I love Gerald Wallace, but don't see them moving him. Richardson I don't have any interest in.....unless they want to take on Redd's deal, they might have the cap space. I can't remember what Richardson makes though.
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Post#10 » by Chapter29 » Wed May 7, 2008 11:04 pm

I still have hope for Simmons (dwindling hope), but he is going to be very difficult to move.

I don't want to package him with a good player just to move him as that will impact the quality of the asset in return.

Maybe a team essentially trades us a bad contract for a bad contract, but I'd likely just rather stick with Simmons if thats our option.
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Post#11 » by EastSideBucksFan » Wed May 7, 2008 11:06 pm

His best value will come as an expiring contract and I would rather sit on him and hope he contributes this upcoming season and then trade him when other teams are just eyeing his $9M expiring contract.

Then we have some leverage and might be able to nab a nice player or two.
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Post#12 » by Nebula1 » Wed May 7, 2008 11:17 pm

EastSideBucksFan wrote:His best value will come as an expiring contract and I would rather sit on him and hope he contributes this upcoming season and then trade him when other teams are just eyeing his $9M expiring contract.

Then we have some leverage and might be able to nab a nice player or two.



While I'm in favor of moving him sooner, I feel like this will be the best scenario for the Bucks to get some sort of return.
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Post#13 » by Bernman » Thu May 8, 2008 1:49 am

Buy low, sell high.

Simmons' value is about as low as it's going to get, outside of his plantar fascitis being a career ender. He has a sizable salary, yet was replacement level at best this season. Anybody just looking for a replacement level player might as well scour LLE options or low salary players on other rosters.

As a result, it wouldn't be prudent to actively pursue trade possibilities involving Simmons, because anybody trading with us would probably want to dump a liability off on us. In the NBA, one man's trash is another man's trash. We'd just be fooled into thinking we had found treasure.

We'd be much better off being patient, hoping he can recuperate with an offseason to train/rest, and then looking to trade him this deadline/next offseason, or even keeping him as a feasible bench option until he's an expiring contract.
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Post#14 » by skones » Thu May 8, 2008 1:51 am

If Bobby plays like he did in April he'll likely be our starter at the three unless we make a trade for someone.
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Post#15 » by midranger » Thu May 8, 2008 1:56 am

Yeah, Bobby looked like a basketball player again by the end of the season.

The with Bobby is that he has negative value right now, which means we'd have to give up an asset to move him. I'm unwilling to do that. I'd much rather keep him and target that summer as the summer to clear of cap woes.
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Post#16 » by El Duderino » Thu May 8, 2008 3:38 am

rilamann wrote:-= original quote snipped =-





I realize there has been health iussues with Simmons but I think Simmons would be more productive and more valuble on a good team than a bad.


That would be the case for most players in the NBA

Simmons is a good jump shooter, my guess is he'll get his form back in shape from outside by next year. Whether he'll be able to move his feet enough to not be a big liability on defense is another story.
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Post#17 » by rilamann » Thu May 8, 2008 3:49 am

El Duderino wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



That would be the case for most players in the NBA

.


No,that would be the case for guys who play to win and dont play for numbers & stats.

Guys who play to win play better and are more productive on teams that play to win,key word ''TEAMS'' that play to win.

If you put a guy who plays to win with a group of individuals who play for numbers and dont realy play to win that guy is going to look bad and kind of become a lost man.

Bobby Simmons seems to me like a team player and a guy who plays to win and puts winning ahead of his own stats & numbers.
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Post#18 » by El Duderino » Thu May 8, 2008 5:05 am

rilamann wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



No,that would be the case for guys who play to win and dont play for numbers & stats.

Guys who play to win play better and are more productive on teams that play to win,key word ''TEAMS'' that play to win.

If you put a guy who plays to win with a group of individuals who play for numbers and dont realy play to win that guy is going to look bad and kind of become a lost man.

Bobby Simmons seems to me like a team player and a guy who plays to win and puts winning ahead of his own stats & numbers.



Come on, better teammates will make most players look better. Take a few guys on the Bucks for example you don't like at all.

Put Mo or Redd on the Cavs and Cleveland wins more games this year, Mo especially. They only won 45 games this year because they desperately need a guard who can score, create his own shot, and get in the paint and dish. Put Mo in place of Gibson and the Cavs win around 50 games and have a far better shot to win the East. Plus, unlike the Bucks, the Cavs are a strong defensive team and thus would be better able to help hide Mo's biggest weakness of being a poor defender.

Put Redd on Dallas and they win more games, they were hurt alot by not having a guy that can consistently score points every night from the two guard spot.

Now on this current Bucks team, they aren't a good fit because almost nobody plays defense, plus they are teamed together which is a double whammy of bad defense. You are delusional though if you can't see that both guys could greatly help certain NBA teams that made the playoffs, way more than Bobby Simmons. Fit is very important when putting together teams, hell, look at Dallas after they foolishly traded for Jason Kidd who was a terrible fit for their roster. Cliches won't win games over talent short comings and bad fit.

Guys like Mo/Redd aren't a good fit for the current Bucks, especially together as a tandem. Both though easily could fit great on certain teams that would win a ton of games, far more so than a spare part like Bobby Simmons is after losing his ability to move his feet. The same goes for many other players in the NBA on losing teams that would be a better fit elsewhere.
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Post#19 » by NotYoAvgNBAFan » Thu May 8, 2008 9:55 am

paulpressey25 wrote:I say we get nothing of value for Bobby. Nothing. Maybe some cap filler in a big trade where we get back a JO or a Brand is the best we could hope for. But Yi/Redd/Mo/#7 in any combination is going out in such a deal.

The best thing we might, might be able to pull off is Bobby/#7 for Josh Howard if Cuban decides he wants to blow it up with youth around Dirk. But that is a pipe dream of mine.
WTH do you keep bringing up Josh Howard for!? LOL...come on PaulPressey!

He is a total scrub and has a low basketball IQ and a low toughness factor about him! Can't you see that!?

Two straight years he did not step up and got dismissed in the first round when his team needed him most. And we remember that NBA finals game.

Was he high when he made that bonehead mistake :crazy: of calling a time out in crunchtime against Miami!? They then got swept 4 straight after winning the first two mainly because of him!

Plus he smokes dope :droop: and was dumb enough and loosed tongued enough to admit. Now that was stupid :eyebrows: as hell and that is your 'leader!?' Come on man get real... :noway:

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You can get better then Josh Howard in the draft! He benefitted from that offense and the Western Conference.

Is he better then Redd is!? :confused:

He is not! He is totally overratted and you can expose him on both ends of the floor. :nod:
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Post#20 » by smauss » Thu May 8, 2008 1:30 pm

Chapter29 wrote:I still have hope for Simmons (dwindling hope), but he is going to be very difficult to move.

I don't want to package him with a good player just to move him as that will impact the quality of the asset in return.

Maybe a team essentially trades us a bad contract for a bad contract, but I'd likely just rather stick with Simmons if thats our option.


Agreed! :nod:
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