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http://www.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic. ... 4#16364224
Ray
Scalawag
Pruitt
probably #30 and future picks
for
Miller
Milicic
Cardinal
Lowry
That is a strong package and I would do that deal. It replaces Ray with a younger Miller and gives us an immediate backup PG. We also get Darko, who would probably be our starting C. So basically, we improve our backup C and PG spots without giving up anything.
OT: 7 player deal?
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OT: 7 player deal?
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P2
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wigglestrue
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Why on freaking earth would Memphis do that???
0:01.8 A. Walker makes 3-pt shot from 28 ft (assist by E. Williams) +3 109-108
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_9qvmXiEuU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_9qvmXiEuU
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bruno sundov
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Tricky Ricky
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Tricky Ricky
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CelticsWhat! wrote:I could've sworn we won game 7 against the Hawks. Oh well. Congrats to them on being up 1-0 to the Cavs.
Whats wrong witht this trade? Id hate to be the one to tell you but Ray is getting old. Im a huge Ray fan and I know he does a lot more than just shoot the ball but to get a shooter in Miller to replace Allen in the starting lineup Lowry to be our backup point and Darko to be our backup Center. With Ray another year older you get a quality player to replace him and your bench automatically gets better.
I know its a weird time to suggest it but honestly what is wrong with this trade?
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Tricky Ricky
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ermocrate wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Yes!And he traded a franchise player for some coconuts.
Ya I was being sarcastic lol, I love it when the TNT broadcasters say they traded a some nice young prospects for Gasol and make it look to be an even fair trade. Van Gundy had the best response when he said you make it out to sound like a good trade for Memphis lol
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ermocrate
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I think we can ask some more for Ray, Gay, Warrick and Milicic for Ray or PP would be fine to me, maybe they bite.Tricky Ricky wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Ya I was being sarcastic lol, I love it when the TNT broadcasters say they traded a some nice young prospects for Gasol and make it look to be an even fair trade. Van Gundy had the best response when he said you make it out to sound like a good trade for Memphis lol
"Negativity in this town sucks"
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screwedupmaniac
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how bout we let this topic sit and wait until after game 7 of the nba finals when we're down by two, the lakers have the ball, rondo steals the inbounds pass, and then gets it to a wide open ray allen in 3 point land, and he drills it, winning banner 17 for us??
seriously, these threads are (Please Use More Appropriate Word) right now! give it at least a month, seriously.
seriously, these threads are (Please Use More Appropriate Word) right now! give it at least a month, seriously.
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ermocrate
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LAL deal
Top prospects
K.Brown (born in 1982)
6ppg 6rpg
J.Critterton ( Born 1987)
7ppg 3rpg 1apg
to Memphis
for 2 Old veterans
Pau Gasol (1980)
19ppg 8rpg 3,5apg
Trevor Ariza (1985)
6,5ppg 3,5rpg 1,3apg
MY GOD! LAL gets 2yrs older in this trade and "only" earns 13points, 2,5 rebounds and 4 assists per game... What a steal for Memphis.
Top prospects
K.Brown (born in 1982)
6ppg 6rpg
J.Critterton ( Born 1987)
7ppg 3rpg 1apg
to Memphis
for 2 Old veterans
Pau Gasol (1980)
19ppg 8rpg 3,5apg
Trevor Ariza (1985)
6,5ppg 3,5rpg 1,3apg
MY GOD! LAL gets 2yrs older in this trade and "only" earns 13points, 2,5 rebounds and 4 assists per game... What a steal for Memphis.
"Negativity in this town sucks"
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RoyHobbs
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ermocrate wrote:LAL deal
Top prospects
K.Brown (born in 1982)
6ppg 6rpg
J.Critterton ( Born 1987)
7ppg 3rpg 1apg
to Memphis
for 2 Old veterans
Pau Gasol (1980)
19ppg 8rpg 3,5apg
Trevor Ariza (1985)
6,5ppg 3,5rpg 1,3apg
MY GOD! LAL gets 2yrs older in this trade and "only" earns 13points, 2,5 rebounds and 4 assists per game... What a steal for Memphis.
They got Ariza from Orlando, right? For Brian Cook?
Regardless, though, it was still an absolute steal, and yeah, it's not like the Lakers traded for an aging superstar.
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Pogue Mahone
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P2, while I have no problems trading Ray Allen for Miller, you do realize that Darko's performance is just not that good, right? Secondly, where is the salary relief that Memphis would be interested in?
If you are looking to get Miller (and I would be), I think you would wait until Hinrich is no longer BYC and attempt a 4-team with Denver as the other entry.
In that scenario, the components would break down like this:
Celtics
Trade Ray Allen and Glen Davis
Receive Mike Miller and Nene
Bulls*
Trade Kirk Hinrich, Thabo Sefolosha and Cedric Simmons
Receive Ray Allen and Glen Davis
Nuggets
Trade Nene
Receive Kirk Hinrich
Grizzlies
Trade Mike Miller
Receive Thabo Sefolosha and Cedric Simmons
The Skinny:
BOS: Get a player who will most likely work better as a third option than Ray Allen. Also better off the catch and shoot. Better team defender, ball-handler and decidedly cheaper, as well. Get a solid PF/C who is cost-controlled. Has the offensive ability to play without Garnett, the versatility to play with Garnett, Perkins or Powe and the defensive ability, size and quickness to present match-up nightmares for opposing offenses.
CHI: Rid themselves of Hinrich's contract in the short-term. Get a player who can create his own shot and, if need be, could be employed with either Deng, Hughes or both. Shed long-term salary. Get a super-sized prospect.
DEN: Get a big PG, who can hit the three, to pair with Iverson in the backcourt. Actually shed some long-term salary because of the way the Hinrich deal is structured.
MEM: Get what amounts to two expiring deals and close to $5.5M in savings. Each of the expiring contracts is in the form of a young player that may have upside that intrigues Chris Wallace. Wallace, at least indirectly through Danny Ainge, was rumored to have had interest in each previously.
Likelihood: I actually think that this deal satisfies all parties pretty fairly. It is unlikely that Boston would want to break-up the triumvirate this early but, then again, going into the off-season of 2009-10, Ray Allen is an expiring. Keep in mind, Rivers absolutely loves Mike Miller. I don't think it is all that far-fetched.
Memphis may feel a bit aggrieved but hell, they would be saving $15M+ over the next two seasons, get two youngsters and could continue to build for the future.
*The deal, as stipulated. could not be made official until the 1 Jul 08 because of Hinrich's BYC status.
--------------------------------
Now, I don't really know about the availability of Nene. I did read that Camby was available and perhaps Denver would look into some long-term salary savings and the filling of a position of need as a viable solution. I don't think so, though. Here's why:
As long as Bret Bearup has Stan Kroenke's ear, Nene isn't going anywhere. In fact, don't be surprised if Denver attempts to make a play for Miller because Bearup is a wicked Miller fan. I may be wrong but from what I gather, Nene is the heart and soul of that Denver team. He is the bridge between the coaching staff and the players on the floor. He has the size to keep players away from the weakside shotblockers and can step out onto the perimeter and guard in space. Nene is also very underrated offensively, imo.
On the other hand, Chicago may not be inclined to jettison Hinrich, either. If I am Chicago, I am more worried about losing Sefalosha but whatever.
Hinrich costs the Bulls a combined $17M for 2010-11 and 20011-12. Ray Allen expires after the 2009-10 season. Chicago wouldn't be giving up very much, all things considered.
As I mentioned above, Hughes can run the point, Allen slots into the two and you can play Deng at the three. Or (this is what I would do) you could run a three guard line-up with Gordon, Hughes and Allen paired with Deng at PF and Noah at C. That line-up would cause all sorts of match-up problems if they played quick. In my mind's eye, Chicago needs a shot-maker who can also create his own shot. Allow him to absorb a lot of the possessions (with low turnover rates in the process) so that the supporting cast can just play their respective games. Right now, Hinrich isn't using many possessions (relative to his teammates) and he is turning the ball over the in process (relative to his teammates.)
In all seriousness, if Chicago is looking to get rid of anybody it should be Nocioni but I digress. I think they would come away from this deal with good overall value. I think Deng would be absolutely fantastic playing PF in a lot of lineups. He has the ability to post, take off the dribble and hit the mid-range shot. His athleticism, strength and quickness would be even more apparent against perimeter PFs on the defensive end.
I think for our current team, Mike Miller is better suited for the role of 3rd option than Ray Allen. There is no doubt that Ray is the more talented overall player but Miller's skillset, most notably his ability to shoot off the catch, to facilitate without ball-pounding, to cover Pierce's man to give Pierce a breather on defense, etc. For the role I perceive, Miller is many times over 'better'. Ray needs the ball to be effective; Miller contributes much better off the ball than Ray. Defensively, Miller's length is very disruptive in help defense. I have said it before but he reminds me a lot of Eric Williams v2001 in help defense. He is similar to Garnett in that he roams and plugs holes. Not as well, of course, but I do see a similarity.
If Ainge could somehow swing this deal, my gosh. That would set this team up long-term with plenty to still contend in the interim.
If you are looking to get Miller (and I would be), I think you would wait until Hinrich is no longer BYC and attempt a 4-team with Denver as the other entry.
In that scenario, the components would break down like this:
Celtics
Trade Ray Allen and Glen Davis
Receive Mike Miller and Nene
Bulls*
Trade Kirk Hinrich, Thabo Sefolosha and Cedric Simmons
Receive Ray Allen and Glen Davis
Nuggets
Trade Nene
Receive Kirk Hinrich
Grizzlies
Trade Mike Miller
Receive Thabo Sefolosha and Cedric Simmons
The Skinny:
BOS: Get a player who will most likely work better as a third option than Ray Allen. Also better off the catch and shoot. Better team defender, ball-handler and decidedly cheaper, as well. Get a solid PF/C who is cost-controlled. Has the offensive ability to play without Garnett, the versatility to play with Garnett, Perkins or Powe and the defensive ability, size and quickness to present match-up nightmares for opposing offenses.
CHI: Rid themselves of Hinrich's contract in the short-term. Get a player who can create his own shot and, if need be, could be employed with either Deng, Hughes or both. Shed long-term salary. Get a super-sized prospect.
DEN: Get a big PG, who can hit the three, to pair with Iverson in the backcourt. Actually shed some long-term salary because of the way the Hinrich deal is structured.
MEM: Get what amounts to two expiring deals and close to $5.5M in savings. Each of the expiring contracts is in the form of a young player that may have upside that intrigues Chris Wallace. Wallace, at least indirectly through Danny Ainge, was rumored to have had interest in each previously.
Likelihood: I actually think that this deal satisfies all parties pretty fairly. It is unlikely that Boston would want to break-up the triumvirate this early but, then again, going into the off-season of 2009-10, Ray Allen is an expiring. Keep in mind, Rivers absolutely loves Mike Miller. I don't think it is all that far-fetched.
Memphis may feel a bit aggrieved but hell, they would be saving $15M+ over the next two seasons, get two youngsters and could continue to build for the future.
*The deal, as stipulated. could not be made official until the 1 Jul 08 because of Hinrich's BYC status.
--------------------------------
Now, I don't really know about the availability of Nene. I did read that Camby was available and perhaps Denver would look into some long-term salary savings and the filling of a position of need as a viable solution. I don't think so, though. Here's why:
As long as Bret Bearup has Stan Kroenke's ear, Nene isn't going anywhere. In fact, don't be surprised if Denver attempts to make a play for Miller because Bearup is a wicked Miller fan. I may be wrong but from what I gather, Nene is the heart and soul of that Denver team. He is the bridge between the coaching staff and the players on the floor. He has the size to keep players away from the weakside shotblockers and can step out onto the perimeter and guard in space. Nene is also very underrated offensively, imo.
On the other hand, Chicago may not be inclined to jettison Hinrich, either. If I am Chicago, I am more worried about losing Sefalosha but whatever.
Hinrich costs the Bulls a combined $17M for 2010-11 and 20011-12. Ray Allen expires after the 2009-10 season. Chicago wouldn't be giving up very much, all things considered.
As I mentioned above, Hughes can run the point, Allen slots into the two and you can play Deng at the three. Or (this is what I would do) you could run a three guard line-up with Gordon, Hughes and Allen paired with Deng at PF and Noah at C. That line-up would cause all sorts of match-up problems if they played quick. In my mind's eye, Chicago needs a shot-maker who can also create his own shot. Allow him to absorb a lot of the possessions (with low turnover rates in the process) so that the supporting cast can just play their respective games. Right now, Hinrich isn't using many possessions (relative to his teammates) and he is turning the ball over the in process (relative to his teammates.)
In all seriousness, if Chicago is looking to get rid of anybody it should be Nocioni but I digress. I think they would come away from this deal with good overall value. I think Deng would be absolutely fantastic playing PF in a lot of lineups. He has the ability to post, take off the dribble and hit the mid-range shot. His athleticism, strength and quickness would be even more apparent against perimeter PFs on the defensive end.
I think for our current team, Mike Miller is better suited for the role of 3rd option than Ray Allen. There is no doubt that Ray is the more talented overall player but Miller's skillset, most notably his ability to shoot off the catch, to facilitate without ball-pounding, to cover Pierce's man to give Pierce a breather on defense, etc. For the role I perceive, Miller is many times over 'better'. Ray needs the ball to be effective; Miller contributes much better off the ball than Ray. Defensively, Miller's length is very disruptive in help defense. I have said it before but he reminds me a lot of Eric Williams v2001 in help defense. He is similar to Garnett in that he roams and plugs holes. Not as well, of course, but I do see a similarity.
If Ainge could somehow swing this deal, my gosh. That would set this team up long-term with plenty to still contend in the interim.
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eitanr
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The original trade is an obvious one to do from a C's stand point. You fullfill all needs for the future, backup C, backup PG and get a younger Ray Allen in Mike Miller.
Why does Memphis do this again? I now they have Chris Wallace making the moves, but still...it's not like we're giving him Vin Baker and Colt 45.
Why does Memphis do this again? I now they have Chris Wallace making the moves, but still...it's not like we're giving him Vin Baker and Colt 45.
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threrf23
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I have nothing against trade proposals right now, but Mike Miller IMO is not an upgrade over Ray Allen - or completely conservatively - not enough of an upgrade over Ray Allen to justify the change in team chemistry. Milicic and Lowry are respectable, but aren't much of an upgrade over what we would have anyway. No way I trade Pruitt or our pick for that deal.
Pogue's deal....better. I like Nene. But he's always injured. I also think the trade sucks from Chicago's standpoint, but don;t necessarily think that would stop CHI's management for going ahead with it.
Pogue's deal....better. I like Nene. But he's always injured. I also think the trade sucks from Chicago's standpoint, but don;t necessarily think that would stop CHI's management for going ahead with it.