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Sam Cassell killed ubunto

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Post#41 » by tombattor » Wed May 7, 2008 6:19 pm

MyInsatiableOne wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
I'm surprised this is what you think. I think last night he was even WORSE...he would literally just dribble around and then take a shot...no flow, no offense, no involvement for the other 4 guys, nothing!

Well, there was some pounding the ball, but Doc started putting Pierce or KG in the game with Sam. So he has to at least make one pass to Pierce or KG. And none of his shots came on pull-ups, but on open shots. I still don't like to see him in there because of the way he slows down the offense, but with the way the Cavs were playing Rondo, giving him jumpers, they had to bring in Cassell or House to keep the defense honest.
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Post#42 » by celticfan42487 » Wed May 7, 2008 6:25 pm

He got open looks in the fourth quater stretch. But he played essentially the same as before especially in the first. His shot just happen to be falling yesterday. The story is the same though it's his shot, not Pierce's not KG's, not Ray's he game essentially makes him our Lebron.
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Post#43 » by MyInsatiableOne » Wed May 7, 2008 6:30 pm

tombattor wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


Well, there was some pounding the ball, but Doc started putting Pierce or KG in the game with Sam. So he has to at least make one pass to Pierce or KG. And none of his shots came on pull-ups, but on open shots. I still don't like to see him in there because of the way he slows down the offense, but with the way the Cavs were playing Rondo, giving him jumpers, they had to bring in Cassell or House to keep the defense honest.


True, there were some flashes. There was only one shot Sam took that was too contested to be a good, legit look at the hoop (the one where he badly front-rimmed a turnaround, but got fouled and got the call). He definitely slows down the offense, which on one hand is OK since Cleveland is so plodding, but on the other hand we should be running this **** team off the court, so it's a hindrance.
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Post#44 » by Fencer reregistered » Fri May 9, 2008 1:53 am

Two moments from the middle of the fourth quarter (around when the score was 80-60).

1. On a fast break where any shot would be a gimme, Pierce leaves it for Sam. He happens to clank it. But the incident illustrates that his teammates are still happy with Sam.

2. Sam has a contested jumper at the FT line, with Posey wide open on the left. He takes and clanks the jumper. NOT the best decision.

Bottom line: Sam is not passing nearly as much as he should be. But this hasn't rotted the spirit of the team.
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Post#45 » by Rocky5000 » Fri May 9, 2008 2:00 am

Espn showed a stat this game:
Sam Cassell @ home:58%(I think)
Sam Cassell on the road: 20%

So it's no wonder people are angry at him, in the games we've lost he's been pretty bad, in the games we've won he's been great.
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Post#46 » by MyInsatiableOne » Fri May 9, 2008 1:04 pm

Fencer reregistered wrote:Two moments from the middle of the fourth quarter (around when the score was 80-60).

1. On a fast break where any shot would be a gimme, Pierce leaves it for Sam. He happens to clank it. But the incident illustrates that his teammates are still happy with Sam.

2. Sam has a contested jumper at the FT line, with Posey wide open on the left. He takes and clanks the jumper. NOT the best decision.

Bottom line: Sam is not passing nearly as much as he should be. But this hasn't rotted the spirit of the team.


Yet...and I don't think it will, but it can be **** frustrating. However, he even had some nice passes last night. Last night was definitely his best game as a Celtic so far.
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Post#47 » by tombattor » Fri May 9, 2008 2:23 pm

WHY DOESN'T DOC REIGN IN CASSELL?

He starts out well, passing, and taking shots the defenders give him and go 3-3. Then his ego takes over and starts pulling up for garbage shots and go 1-9 rest of the way.

Yes, he does make some contributions in short stints, but how can Doc let this MOFO play 10~12 straight minutes when in 8 of those, he's being a selfish ***** and jacking up shot after shot?

12 shots for this *****!!! You kidding me? Our backup PG had the 2nd most shots on the team and shot 33%? Don't you see something wrong here?

Doc needs to go. WHAT A MORON this guy is!!
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Post#48 » by sully00 » Fri May 9, 2008 3:27 pm

What don't you people get? He isn't in there to pass the ball, while he doesn't need to take the first shot availble he is in there to shoot the ball. Rondo is a pass first point guard, teams slack off of him and play him to pass Sam is the change up. He is replacing what Eddie House did for this team. While not the same caliber of 3pt shooter Sam can handle the ball and create his own shot, he is also deadly from 18ft and Doc loves that. Sam's job is to provide scoring and draw some defensive attention so that whichever of the 3 stars are still in there with the second unit can find some room to operate.

Do some of you even watch the games or just look at the box score and decide what happened from that?
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Post#49 » by tombattor » Fri May 9, 2008 3:38 pm

sully00 wrote:What don't you people get? He isn't in there to pass the ball, while he doesn't need to take the first shot availble he is in there to shoot the ball. Rondo is a pass first point guard, teams slack off of him and play him to pass Sam is the change up. He is replacing what Eddie House did for this team. While not the same caliber of 3pt shooter Sam can handle the ball and create his own shot, he is also deadly from 18ft and Doc loves that. Sam's job is to provide scoring and draw some defensive attention so that whichever of the 3 stars are still in there with the second unit can find some room to operate.

Do some of you even watch the games or just look at the box score and decide what happened from that?

I don't know. Did you see the game? I said, he was playing well, until he made his 3rd shot, then went into his I'm-getting-my-shots-up mode. Or maybe you didn't see that from the box score you are referring to. Yes, he's in there to score, but those shots have to come from within the offense and he has to take shots defense gives him.

I don't care if you are Michael Jordan, you shouldn't be taking shots you don't have. I dont' mind Cassell taking shots, if they are open shots given to him by the defense. But under no circumstances, should he just pull up with a man in his face. He even launched a shot with 2 men on him before anyone really got down the floor. Do you consider that his role, even when Pierce and KG are in there and are in offensive groove?

As you said, he's in there to play a role. And that role is not "the Savior" like the one Lebron's playing.

If you go into a game thinking that you're going to take 3's all night, but the defense throw 2 guys playing tight and giving you the lane, do you keep taking the 3s because that's what you're in there to do? Or do you take the driving lane and take it to the hoop for a better shot? Basketball isn't an absolute game. You have an opponent and you have to deal with them.
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Post#50 » by sully00 » Fri May 9, 2008 7:08 pm

Sam is who he is, yes you take the good with the bad. I also think that he understands his role better than you do. He was +16 last night better than any of the starters. He wasn't jacking up 3's. I don't even really understand what it is you are complaining about how he played in the 4th quarter of blow out?

I have to ask when did this ill advised shot with two men on him and no one down the court happen?
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Post#51 » by The Rondo Show » Fri May 9, 2008 7:19 pm

Sam's shot selection was fine. He shot 33%, but that's because he was 0-4 in the 4th quarter of a 20 point game. Garbage time.

He took one shot that was forced IIRC, a pull up 3 pointer in the 1st half with 20 on the shot clock and he wasn't open on it either, but he hit it. The rest were good looks and he was 4-8 in the 1st half with 4 or 5 very good passes (didn't get assists for all of them, because Powe blew one layup and got fouled on the other one...but they were great looks).

Last night was the first time I saw him run the offense very well as a Celtic. Even when he has had good games in the past, it wasn't because he made lots of good passes and ran the offense well...it was because he was hitting his shots. He was very good last night and I don't know how anyone could complain about his performance.
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Post#52 » by tombattor » Fri May 9, 2008 10:34 pm

sully00 wrote:I have to ask when did this ill advised shot with two men on him and no one down the court happen?

The shot I'm talking about... I don't remember exactly when, but he was bringing a ball down on a fast break and pulled up and got his shot blocked... Or something like that.

The bottom line is, he played well in the first 5~6 min period, but once he made a few shots, he started to go on one of his trigger happy mode. Any of these bench guys can make a few baskets, but this guy's ego makes him go nuts. It's nice when he's at least making shots, but can you really have this guy keep launching shots when they're not falling? That's why/when you bring House or Rondo back in. You gotta reign this guy in and Doc doesn't seem to be able to, for some reason...
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Post#53 » by grantlongforpresident » Fri May 9, 2008 11:32 pm

I think the offense changes for the worst when cassell enters the game. The ball quits moving around.

And unlike TA, who i'm often quite critical of, Cassell isn't doing anything special on the defensive side of the ball.

Look, Cassell is a solid player, but so far i'm not impressed with the way he fits in. And talking about overall, not just last two games where he wasn't bad. I hope he plays awesome to shut me and the other cassell questioners (not really haters) up.
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Post#54 » by celtxman » Sat May 10, 2008 2:31 pm

This has to be the most stubborn post I have ever read. It starts with the premise of hating Cassell and it will just perpetuate itself through this whole process. I can see it now - Cassell hits the game winning shot at the buzzer to win a one-point game against the Lakers in Game 7 and I'll flip to this post. I'll read how Cassell is such an arrogant SOB that he took the shot instead of 3 All Stars....or they would have swept the Lakers had they stayed with House.....or you name it.
I have no profound love for Cassell I just know what I've seen. In Game 1 I saw a backup PG get clutch, much needed baskets in a game that easily could have been lost and Pierce and Allen were getting 4 points between them. In Game 2 with the score 21-9, Celtics losing, I saw the backup PG once again hit big shots, steady the ship, and I really didn't care that he missed 4 shots in a meaningless 4th quarter. When it was clutch and needed to score - he scored. Think how different things would feel right now with the Celtics going into Cleveland 1-1. In any situation if you can get a backup to be vital in winning playoff games, you are doing well. This is a different season and House would have difficulty getting his shot off like Daniel Gibson has.
I have no vision of Cassell's role beyond this year. To me the ideal backup PG would be someone like Antonio Daniels. But the pickup of Cassell has already been a stroke of genius. The Celtics paid the veteran minimum to a player who has already been crucial. If he stays planted on the bench for the remainer of the playoffs it has worked out. The Celtics wind up playing Orlando and the situation calls for House instead - fine with me. But let's not keep trying to put negative spins on what obviously has been a positive performance.
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Post#55 » by cavsfan_osiris » Sun May 11, 2008 2:54 am

I have to admit at first I dismissed the idea that Boston needed to play House, but I'm not so sure anymore. IMO Doc should at least try him as the first guard off the bench instead of Cassell for game 4. It sends a message to Cassell and the whole team that everyone has to be accountable.

I also think Ray's minutes should be cut in favor of more Posey.
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Post#56 » by dbodner » Sun May 11, 2008 3:07 am

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Post#57 » by Spud34 » Sun May 11, 2008 3:08 am

Someone needs to commit murder on Sam Cassell's minutes. Just shoot them, stab them, steal them anything... as long as he doesn't have them.
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Post#58 » by tombattor » Sun May 11, 2008 3:47 am

Watching the Pistons and the Celtics play today made me realize we probably are a year away from the title. And I'm not so sure we can get by Detroit. One of the biggest reason is team work.

Pistons play team game to perfection. Everyone knows his role and never gets away from what they need to do.

Celtics on the other hand used to have that, but since the arrival of one Sam Cassell, that all went out the window. If he's not the most selfish SOB, I don't know who is. He has single-handedly destroyed Ubuntu. As spud34 said, we gotta do something. If murdering his minutes doesn't get it done, just deactivate this guy. What he brings as a backup PG doesn't compensate for all the negatives he also brings.

It's too bad because the amount of ball pounding he does never shows up on box scores and therefore novice fans will never understand...

If the name of the backup PG that brings so much negative wasn't Sam Cassell, will people be so ready to defend him and call the move for him "a stroke of genius?" I don't think so.

It has also exposed Doc, for he can't reign in his BACK UP PG. We're not talking about Paul Pierce, a big 3, here. We're talking about a backup PG here!!! Come on!
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Post#59 » by cavsfan_osiris » Sun May 11, 2008 3:55 am

I think it's obvious after being now 0-4 on the road that Doc has to try something different. I read someone said this is 100% on the players, whoever said that is absolutely wrong. .

Maybe if this was a one time thing this would be on the players, but it's an 0-4 thing. It's time for some adjustments by the staff and I'm not seeing any. In fact they regressed tonight against Cleveland.

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