Players should have to wear a scarlet F on their uniforms

[mistatwo mayn]

flopping is the equivolent to girls screaming rape when you're on top of them... i hate it.

[floppymoose]

We don't need any of this. The refs know who flops. They should just stop calling fouls for these guys. Let them sit there on the floor, or stand there whining to the ref, while the play goes on and there team is down a man. This is how they handle Stephen Jackson, and while it hasn't altered Stephen's behavior, it has certainly penalized his team appropriately.

[floppymoose]

As for Sleepy's idea for intentional fouls... it has problems. I've thought about the same kind of rule. Here's the problem: in late game situations now, the losing team fouls to get possession back because it's the only way to make up points in a short time. Even though it's very unlikely to work, it's better than a sure loss. Of course it seems rediculous to the fan of the game to sit through a bunch of free throws, which is why we are talking about this to start with.

But consider the alternative. If a team can't productively foul to stop the clock, then the last three minutes or so of play will be dominated by one team running out the clock on offense. The losing team will then try to score very quickly and then the winning team will run the clock again. In this scenario almost all the basketball action is just guys standing around running clock. At least in the current system, in between the fouls, the actual action is real action.

I think the real problem lies in having a game clock at all. The sport might be better if teams raced to a particular score, like first to 100. Of course, the tremendous variation this would cause in game lengths dooms the idea, but it might be a funner way to play. Then there is no incentive to run clock built into the game.

[St.Nick]

Flop=Foul

Simple as can be. I can promise that if Derek Fisher or Manu thought that they might be picking up a foul by faking it that they would not take the risk so often since they would likely foul out by half time.

[Sleepy51]

Flopping should be its own punishment... if someone's a notorious flopper, maybe they dont get as many good calls for them anymore... only extremely clear fouls.

Otherwise, just let the play go... if the flopping occurs and affects the movement of the game (say flopping in front of someone who has the ball) then they could call a delay tech... otherwise my ideal situation is to just have the refs ignore the worst offenders until they realize its negatively affecting their fouls being called.

The thing is random bodies sprawled across the floor at random moments obstructs movement on the floor. It's a disruptive behavior, like the barking dog play from that high school clip. It may not be "illegal" but it is disruptive and unsporting. There's also an injury risk. It's only a matter of time until a flopper collapses someone very expensive's knee or ankle. Of course injuries are part of the game, but throwing your body around horizontaly at knee and foot level is bad juju. People fall honestly and that hazard is part of the game, but the increasing number of prone bodies from the faking and selling will sooner or later result in a very uneccessary tragedy.

Gilbert's knee injury this year was partly the result of Wallace selling a foul. He certainly got hit, but instead of making an effort to maintain his balance and keep his feet, Wallace let the contact send him crashing to the ground - through Gilbert's leg. Wallace wasn't out and out flopping, but instead of making the effort to stay in the play, the style of play flopping has brought about had him surrendering his body to the floor to sell the foul.

[GSWhoopfan]

i hope Derek Fisher has another talent. take away the flop...hes got no job.

Al Harrington needs to stop that **** too.

[Sid the Squid]

I hate PG flopers too.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=MTdERYOtqsg

[azwfan]

I dont like flopping but its not unsportsmanlike in the least. Whats unsportsmanlike is refs guessing and giving the benefit of the doubt to the highly marketed players.

Kobe gets calls. He doesnt need to flop. Vlade Divac never gets calls... so he HAS to flop to get any kind of call his way. Its a situation the officials have brought upon the game, not the players. If the refs dont call the flop foul calls, there wont be so much flopping... period.

What really needs to be eliminated is the -automatic- blocking foul if the defender is within that stupid circle in the key AND the nearly automatic charge call if the defender gets his feet out of that circle.

The game has been sissified in the name of higher scoring and marketing... flopping is a part of this sissification.

Hack a Shaq is terrible for the game. But lets face it, the best way to stop teams from employing "hack a shaq, hack a boone, hack a chandler, hack a foyle" is for these PROFESSIONAL basketball players to make their freaking free throws. Isnt that the real problem? That these guys cant make 7 out of 10 FREE SHOTS in a game?

Please stop the sissification of this sport.

[GSW2K4]

Hack a Shaq is terrible for the game. But lets face it, the best way to stop teams from employing "hack a shaq, hack a boone, hack a chandler, hack a foyle" is for these PROFESSIONAL basketball players to make their freaking free throws. Isnt that the real problem? That these guys cant make 7 out of 10 FREE SHOTS in a game?

Please stop the sissification of this sport.

But it seems that those that appreciate the game of basketball would want teams to buckle down and play honest defense rather than taking the easy way out....

[azwfan]

-= original quote snipped =-



But it seems that those that appreciate the game of basketball would want teams to buckle down and play honest defense rather than taking the easy way out....

Sure it would... but it would seem that those that appreciate the game of basketball would want players to be able to hit a freaking free throw.

I guess since pietrus cant keep his feet in bounds to save his life, we should expect the league to widen the court rather then make the player learn how to keep his freaking feet in bounds when he's going to make a move.

I guess since Steve Nash cant play defense the league should allow a "designated defender" who subs in for Nash anytime the opponent has the ball (not just dead ball opportunities).

Thats about as ridiculous as this call for "hack a shaq" strategy to be punished. It isnt the "easy way out". Its the "easy way in" for your opponent, all he has to do is make some FREE THROWS. We're not talking about half court or even 3 pt shots here... FREE THROWS. Its time we grow some balls and hold these terrible ft shooters accountable for their lack of skill. They are proffessional basketball players, not little kids.

[GSW2K4]

-= original quote snipped =-

I guess since pietrus cant keep his feet in bounds to save his life, we should expect the league to widen the court rather then make the player learn how to keep his freaking feet in bounds when he's going to make a move.

I guess since Steve Nash cant play defense the league should allow a "designated defender" who subs in for Nash anytime the opponent has the ball (not just dead ball opportunities).

Nice.

Yes, players need to hit free ones...and held accountable if they cant. They're being paid for it after all.

But it's the off ball fouling that bothers me most. Between being held accountable for free throws and playing tough team defense, I'll take defense.

[GSW2K4]

Well... here's the verdict on the flopping problem...

The Scarlet F was a better idea to me...

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=3416579

The NBA announced to its teams this week at its annual pre-draft camp that fines will be imposed on players starting next season for clear cases of "flopping," ESPN.com has learned.

The league office has yet to determine exact fine amounts for offending flops and how fines might escalate for repeat offenders, but in-game arena observers and video reviewers will be instructed to report instances of theatrical flopping for potential punishment as part of postgame reports on officiating and other matters.

[cdubbz]

players that are caught flopping should be executed

[Sleepy51]

Players who are caught flopping should be repeatedly punched in the snatch by Ed Hoculi.

[Subaculta]

Players who are caught flopping should be repeatedly punched in the snatch by Ed Hoculi.

how about just forcing them to show up and play in some "game of shame" event during the all star weekend?

[floppymoose]

I'll definitely be lobbying for adding "# of flop fines" as a point category for fantasy nba leagues.

[floppymoose]

Here was my all time, bar none, favorite flopping sequence... check out the last bit of this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8uRa8k746g

[Subaculta]

Here was my all time, bar none, favorite flopping sequence... check out the last bit of this vid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8uRa8k746g

he was one of a kind wasn't he?

[old rem]

Refs should also have a "red card" power. The refs should be able to suspend someone for a future game on the spot for unsporting conduct of any kind. I realize Joey Crawford would have summarily executed Duncan for clapping, but I'll live with that risk. The refs need to have real control of the game, a suspension power would serve as a giagantic deterrent to bad behavior on the court.

Well...to some extent the refs can nail you on Flagrants,double T's etc.

THIS year was supposed to have "anti-flop" but then consider the rules for taking a charge. You pretty much have to be totally defenseless and fall like a tree. Otherwise what? We have small forwards blasting in like Larry Csonka,heck,we'd have SF's that LOOK like Larry Csonka...and it would become rugby with dribbling. The Charge/block call is the place where refs can really tilt the table. At best...they call it wrong 20% of the time. At worst...60%. You can't object..that's a T or a fine. Do refs get graded? I guess but on what scale and what seems to change? Catching one crooked ref-of several,did seem to make refs overall a bit more inclined to make their calls seem to mostly have a basis. That will wear off.

The "Rules" are.....what? In baseball,football, there's a link between the official rules and how games are officiated. in the NBA the rulebook is a relic of the past. Whatever the 3 guys in charge of THIS game think the rules SHOULD be at any moment--that's the rules.

The Ref's mutated version of the rules--and their lazy tendency to guess at a foul they never saw--is what created flopping. It ain't something guys practice as kids on the playground.

So..rather than get the refs to call it by the book-or update the book...the NBA adds a little circle-the No Flop Zone which eliminates the charge if the target is too near the basket. That gives the refs another detail to miss.

Eventually there may be so many rings the court looks like an onion with a no handcheck circle and a 4 point arc way out there...and who knows.