The "We lost because of refs" Myth

tkunit · Post #101 » by **tkunit** » Sat May 17, 2008 3:24 pm

100+ games bet on, so much for a myth.

lukeridenour · Post #102 » by **lukeridenour** » Sat May 17, 2008 4:19 pm

theTHIEF wrote:well if you are tired of it now, chances are you will be jumping off a building sometime in the future...it's been around before you, it will be here after you...welcome to sports 101...

nice, was just about to post the same thing. glad i read the first page before i did. very well put.

Philly Fresh · Post #103 » by **Philly Fresh** » Sat May 17, 2008 4:42 pm

Tim Donaghy would like to have word with the ppl in this thread.

carrottop12 · Post #104 » by **carrottop12** » Sat May 17, 2008 4:59 pm

I'm not here to say the Jazz lost because of the refs alone, but the Jazz certainly didn't get any favors, in the last two fourth quarters I can count about 8 points in each game that the refs took away from the Jazz and gave to the Lakers all on bad foul calls.

But with that said the refs are a part of the game, probably the worst part of the game but part of the game none the less.

Nebroc · Post #105 » by **Nebroc** » Sat May 17, 2008 5:15 pm

-SDU- wrote:if you people dont think refs can cost teams games then you are obviously a fan of a winning team and not a fan of a pathetic bridemaid squad like the Suns.

JoshB914 · Post #106 » by **JoshB914** » Sat May 17, 2008 5:18 pm

Just so you all know, Donaghy didn't officiate a game this season. So can we please put that stupid theory to rest?

tkunit · Post #107 » by **tkunit** » Sat May 17, 2008 5:40 pm

JoshB914 wrote:Just so you all know, Donaghy didn't officiate a game this season. So can we please put that stupid theory to rest?

You mean to tell me that no on has ever blamed the refs before this season.

JoshB914 · Post #108 » by **JoshB914** » Sat May 17, 2008 5:51 pm

^^^ All I'm saying is using one guy to say there is some sort of fix going on is crazy. Donaghy is an idiot who messed up the intergrity of the game, but there is absolutely no evidence whatsoever that multiple officials are purposely effecting the outcomes of games.

Philly Fresh · Post #109 » by **Philly Fresh** » Sat May 17, 2008 6:49 pm

It's like Donaghy alone bet on these games, and was able to alter the outcome by himself. There were definetly other refs who were in on the betting with him.

JoshB914 · Post #110 » by **JoshB914** » Sat May 17, 2008 7:18 pm

Why do you say that Philly Fresh? Do you have any evidence or are you just making accusations at random?

In these playoffs alone I have seen refs/Stern blamed in an incredible amount of games beginning with game 1 of SA/Phoenix. And I have noticed a few things. Firstly, it is ALWAYS the losing teams fans who are complaining. Secondly, they are wrong most of the time anyway (see the correct non-call on goaltending last night).

It's just ridiculous. I have never seen fans react like this across the board in sports. I wish sometimes we could just take a look at our team and just admit that the team that just beat us in a 7 game series was better. It really isn't that hard to do.

Philly Fresh · Post #111 » by **Philly Fresh** » Sat May 17, 2008 8:00 pm

Uhm...maybe because Stern admit last year that other refs were involved...

Smoke[MaxX] · Post #112 » by **Smoke[MaxX]** » Sat May 17, 2008 8:51 pm

JoshB914 wrote:It's just ridiculous. I have never seen fans react like this across the board in sports. I wish sometimes we could just take a look at our team and just admit that the team that just beat us in a 7 game series was better. It really isn't that hard to do.

So basketball fans can't be fans of every other sport? Or basketball fans are just dumber than fans of other sports? What's your argument here. Doesn't it say something when a majority of fans complain about the refereeing?

You said that refs don't bet against a team, but against the spread. What happens when a better team is dominating a series and is thus given the benefit of a doubt with the spread (See: Dallas-Miami series). Even when the Mavericks were down, Vegas still gave them a chance in their spread, but the refs took away that chance.

When two teams are equal in talent and play equally well, they should go into overtime. If a ref allows for one team to get one additional call on a last second shot, then how does this not affect the game? When a team does all it can to surmount an unpredictable run and go up 1 on a last second shot, only to see that the ref across the court called a 2 instead of a 3- how does that not affect the game?

You're ignorant to say that refs don't affect the game. You're ignorant to say that some teams should always blow out other teams. People get tired; sometimes stars' shots don't drop. Basketball isn't "life." The refs are in the game to MAKE THINGS FAIR, not to show how unfair life is. This is a game, not a philosophy class. If we wanted an unfair game, we shouldn't even have refs. Just play street ball.

Roxflynorth · Post #113 » by **Roxflynorth** » Sat May 17, 2008 9:35 pm

I am just conspiracy - do you guys wonder why those vegas line are so close to the result of the game? Are those guys god or genius and know the result in advance?

MagiChamps · Post #114 » by **MagiChamps** » Sat May 17, 2008 9:58 pm

Philly Fresh wrote:Uhm...maybe because Stern admit last year that other refs were involved...

And back when the news first came out Donaghy said he had information on a lot of other refs that gambled.

MagiChamps · Post #115 » by **MagiChamps** » Sat May 17, 2008 10:17 pm

Manocad wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
This is my favorite kind of b****ing.

"I have no idea what the answer is, but damnit--SOMETHING has to be done!"

How do you "draw the line"? Review every play of every game and start disciplining refs for making a bad call or not making a call that should have been made? I'll tell you what that will get you...low grade referees. Because it would then essentially become a job where the league is paying a ref to make a judgement call during the flow of the game (because you can't video review every single possibility for a call during the game, unless you want it to be about six hours long) then punishing him for his judgement. Who in the world would want that job?

I don't think the refs need to be punished for every little thing, especially during the regular season, but when a really controversial call happens or a game is blown in the playoffs they should be sat down and explained to what they did wrong. If they're not willing to change the way they call certain plays, they should be suspended or fired.

It doesn't bother me when refs make honest mistakes, it's the different interpretations of the rules that bother me. In general I think the NBA needs to do a better job of educating referees on the way it wants things called. It seems like every ref has a different interpretation of what an offensive foul is, or whether they should call fouls at the end of games, or whether the best players or teams should get preferential treatment. I just want some consistency.

I only said something in response to your opinion that nothing needs to be done.

JoshB914 · Post #116 » by **JoshB914** » Sat May 17, 2008 11:56 pm

[quote="Smoke[MaxX]"][/quote]

This is true. And just like shots don't always drop for the players, refs make mistakes too. It is hilarious that you are holding these guys to higher standards then the guys who make millions? Two teams should go to OT if the game is evenly played? But what if shots simply aren't dropping for one team? I don't understand what you're trying to say.

The refs make mistakes. There have definetely been some poorly officiated games. But it's ridiculous to say that bad calls are due to games being fixed or officials having a motive.

Philly Fresh · Post #117 » by **Philly Fresh** » Sun May 18, 2008 12:01 am

Are you stupid?
What does referees betting on games mean?
IT MEANS THEY BET ON GAMES, EXPECTING MORE MONEY AFTER THE GAME. HOW DO THEY EXPECT THE MONEY? BY ATTEMPTING TO ALTER THE GAME THROUGH CALLS TO HELP THE TEAM THEY BET ON.