Here, a believable scoop on "Nellie's" return

[Thugleavy34]

Most definitely, and Baron has played a big part in that as well. Just because it might be best for them to part ways in 2009 doesn't mean they aren't appreciated.

[St.Nick]

Most definitely, and Baron has played a big part in that as well. Just because it might be best for them to part ways in 2009 doesn't mean they aren't appreciated.

Not to normal people, at least

[Thugleavy34]

[Thugleavy34]

Nellie agrees...

"if it costs us some games, which it probably will, then that's what it'll do.

I'll have to prepare myself mentally for that, but I think it's the right thing to do. They're the future of the team."

[GSWhoopfan]

-= original quote snipped =-



Addressed each point in bold. Looking forward to logical responses... but I'm not seeing them at all right now. Basically what I'm seeing is a gross oversimplification of statistics. "We were at X level, and now we're at Y level. Thus, we're better". Don't you have any desire to understand why that is?

And I'm still waiting for that "Selfishly, I want to see more smallball." Once I see it, what can I counter with?

we didnt slow the ball down??? are you sure??? because in the second half that was giving us fits. teams were slowing the pace of the game on us.

glad you bring up Biedrins "1 great" game against Boston to your defense. because you are right, there was only one game this season where we had to play in a half court set. All the other 81 games nobody slowed it down on us. Man you are a genius.

On your playoff note...yeah good try buddy. Dallas tried and failed on us. They wanted to play our style. Dallas was arguably one of the best teams the league has seen in the past decade. Maybe one of the better teams in a while...hence the BIGGEST PLAYOFF UPSET EVER. Utah punished us inside.

Baron and Nellie are proven and born losers. Who cares that weve been above .500 ball? That we are back on the map and not a disgrace to the league. If we arent championship material and we arent playing like championship style whats the purpose? We should just forfeit the next couple of seasons and let the Lakers, Spurs, Celtics, and Pistons duke it out. Why should we praise this gimmick ball?

I really dont care what style we play...ive always been about playing to our strenghts.

And as far as me being Selfish that i want this style...How did you know i called Don Nelson in Maui and said...you know what GSWhoopfan wants us to run and gun. I forget that i call Don Nelson and tell him that I want us to play this style of ball. Ive got Don Nelson on my fingertips like a puppet. You indeed are the almighty one.

[FNQ]

You can see the hostility as your own baseless, and again, oversimplified logic is looking worse and worse

Of course... it was teams slowing us down. It couldn't have been Baron and Jax's chucking. Couldn't have been that we played no defense because our concern was to run. Nevermind the fact that teams did this exact thing the previous season, and the reason we got past it was unfathomably hot shooting. And also nevermind the fact that the one time the reins were given to Monta and Biedrins against the best team in the league (then), we carved them up in a halfcourt set. But again, way to use hyperbole (all other 81 games we didnt?) to really weaken an argument

Dallas was one of the best teams in a while... ... they had zero staying power. No post presence, no interior defense. They were a dream matchup for us... but quickly, lets hinge every decision we make based on that one series. It was over a year ago. Its over, done, and irrelevant now.

The rest of your post is just basically as irrelevant and as childish as I've seen on the board... you whine constantly about being attacked and then when you get people refuting your hollow points based on empty stats, this comes out?

Good for you bud... hoorah for empty winning and zero basketball improvement. Cohan enjoys each and every sucker like you out there

[Sleepy]

Good for you bud... hoorah for empty winning and zero basketball improvement. Cohan enjoys each and every sucker like you out there

I'll ignore this whole ad hom. stuff and just ask what empty winning is. Is it what the Spurs do? Playing old farts, drafting non factors and letting them rot in Europe? Oh, these pitiful Spurs...

Seriously, I'm coming late to the party. What is this about? Again this halfcourt vs. gimmick style thing? Well, isn't it pointless to keep on argueing about it? We played a style that fit us, and we did it well. It was the reason we crushed Dallas and it was the reason Utah sent us home. So what?
How's this an on going argument, even after one whole year passing by, as you wrote yourself.


My fuss with your post is that I still don't see what you want. I would be really pleased (no sarcasm here!) if you could explain your way to manage the Ws.
I know you did a offseason, but it was to descriptive in it's nature for me to understand what kind of style you were aiming at. For example, you signed Corey Maggette and when I raised an eyebrow you said that he wasn't a first choice, just a productive player these days. That get's a in terms of realism, but I still would like to know what kind of role model you have for the Warriors? Spurs? Detroit? If no gimmick style, what else? Tearing everything down again and hope to get lucky in the lottery and drafting the next Duncan?
I honestly can't say...

[FNQ]

Well I've repeated it a lot, so I don't know how you've missed it, but the Hornets are the model I'd like to follow.

They were roughly in the same place we are, 2 years ago. They had CP3 (a lead guard - Monta), Chandler (a defending and rebounding C - Biedrins) and a solid PF in West (which we all think Wright can be). They signed Peja to get a pure shooter to spread the defense for the team. After a bad luck injury year, they dipped into the late lottery (like we are now) and grabbed Julian Wright, who will be in their rotation.

They had also used their MLE to sign Mo Peterson, another shooter. They used previous draft picks like Hilton Armstrong as role players, regardless of their ups and downs, so they'd be ready to take 10 min or so a game.

They were a perfect example of what we should have done. If Baron can net us an asset like Marvin Williams, or a mid-lotto pick, absolutely we should take it, add it to the core, and drop the gimmick. Hell, even adding Bass would do it.

I feel the Mavs scenario fits the best as it toes the line of the "Monta the PG" debates and banger down low... so Kidd/Bass would be in. Draft Rush #14, and then we have a lineup that splits Monta at PG/SG and gives him an all-time great as a mentor, we have 2 great wing defenders in Jax/Rush, have our down low D and rebounding in Bass/Wright/Biedrins, and then still have Al and whoever else.

I'm pretty confident a team like that would take better shots and play better D... I wouldnt be surprised to be as high as a 5 seed either, with the potential of that team.

[Sleepy]

Well, that's great. Really. At least we're on the same page. I agree that I'd be great if we could model ourselves after the Hornets, perhaps even avoid some of their mistakes (Azu@2mio >>> Peja@12mio).

I'm not totally down on the Kidd trade, as it doesn't solve our depth problem. And Bass is not enough to offset the Baron-Kidd difference in production next year... but if we could find a way to sneak Howard into the talks, I'm all for it. But all in all, I also think that a good Baron trade (there are a few out there) would improve the franchise.

Just one thing that bugs me... what's this aversion against gimmicks? Isn't running the best way to approach the game if you're starting Kidd-Monta-Jack-Wright-Andris? I can't really picture Monta&Wright&Andris in a grind-it-out/slow-the-$hit-down half court style. We can run the whole league into the ground for 82 games IF we get enough production from the guys 5-9. Why give that advantage up?
But perhaps I'm just misunderstanding your term gimmick... for me, gimmick = chaos, and if I'm the first one to admit that I like to watch that style, then so be it. But I also think that it's the best way for the Ws to be successful, at least as long as Monta and Andris are running the show.

[FNQ]

The running aspect of the team isn't the gimmick. I'm all for having a running team, especially since we are starting to get equipped for it.

The gimmick is allowing these shots by Baron and Jax to go completely unpunished, to put Pietrus/Buke/Barnes at PF and C. The purpose of using smallball lineups is to gain advantages on the offensive side in terms of quickness and speed - but if we're hoisting 3pters from one of our worst 3pt shooters (Baron), whats the point?

And no, we cannot run other teams into the ground... others teams have depth and good coaching and this style is easily defended. But the W's have a good running team core that can also be successful in the halfcourt in Tay/Wright/Beans.

[turk3d]

I'm all for the New Orleans model bandwagon. After I gave up on the Warriors (when they got bumped out of the playoffs), they became my favorite team. They should have beaten the Spurs. They probably could have been the most difficult matchup for the Lakers had they got in (their youth and speed would have matched up perfectly).

As you point out Reggae, Biedrens = Chandler (but slightly better imo)
Baron should = Paul (just dumber, slower but stronger and shoud be more experienced but doesn't act it)
The difference is between West and Harrington (but not by as much as you'd think, believe it or not Al matced up very well against him, just take a look at the last couple of games against him, keeping in mind that a lot of those minutes which Al played against NO was at the Center position, when directly against West, he performed quite well).
Monta gives us the edge against Mo Pete. Jack and Peja a wash if Jack decides to play.

The truth of the matter is that we are already pretty strong matchup wise against the #1 team in the West. The only reason they lost to the Spurs was because of their inexperience and they would have had a very good chance I believe against the Lakers THIS SEASON (sans Bynum). I'm really disappointed that we didn't make it this year, as next year will be tougher. If you recall it was NO that we all were hoping we would matchup with if we made it to the playoffs and the liklihood we would have was pretty good since they wound up 1st seed I believe.

We had the personal we needed, they just weren't properly utilized.

[Thugleavy34]

Run-n-gun fits your roster when you have players playing their natural position and they happen to be able to run. It's a gimmick when you put players out of their natural position so that you can run. A team that plays Pietrus at PF and Wright at C will never win a championship, sorry.

[GSWhoopfan]

you really have no respect for most teams or other people. Dallas was a great team last year. A great team. What happened when dallas went big? They beat us up. They failed to execute their game plan and went through with the Warriors game plan. (Was Clelveland really a better team than the Pistons last season?)

Play to the teams strength thats what Nellie does...This team is spontaneous. Nobody knows what the Warriors are going to do, thats why we are dangerous. That includes "chucking". Its part of the Warriors success. When Jack shoots 3 for 9 from beyond the arc, the 2nd and 3rd ones are clutch. Nellie promotes/encourages them to take the open shot.

You dont respect Baron or Nellie no matter what they do. Its so easy to bring up weaknesses, because those stand out. You make it seem like you take the harder side of the argument, but you actually are on the easier, more memorable side.

Youre hatred is similar to that of mine about Foyle and Fisher. Donate money to the homeless, build a school...im still saying FFF them. I dont give a schit,

edit: i want Tyson to them both while i on the sidelines.

Buts thats real.

had to edit in case Tyson just happens to beat them both up randomly.

[Thugleavy34]

It's also immature.

[Sleepy51]

And a bit psychotic.

If anything happens to Fish or Foyle, we all would have to testify that you're a loon.