Is it time to break up the Pistons? (merged threads)

[Manocad]

Really you have to almost feel for Piston fans. Whats there to be excited about. They win 58 games next year will that get them excited. They play 2 teams in the first two rounds of the playoffs that have no shot at beating them. Still no excitement. Go back to a 7th straight ECF and hope that this is the year that they make the push back to the finals. Joe Dumars has to make some moves just to give some hope that next year will be different.

Finally someone understands what it's like to be a Pistons fan. It's hard to describe the agony of knowing that the odds are pretty darn good that your team will go to the conference finals every year.

[Hunter]

[quote="Muzzleshot"][/quote]I'd agree with you to a point that part of the blame does fall on Joe. But how we got here is almost irrelevant. The fact is we're here and Flip needs to go.

[Bucky O'Hare]

The Pistons stopped being a championship contender the day Larry Brown left town. Losing their heart and soul, Ben Wallace, a year later was the nail in the coffin. They're now a big fish in the small pond known as the Eastern Conference, and for three years running a bigger fish has eaten them alive in the ECF.

It's past due for some major changes, unless Piston fans are content with being third-tier basketball team.

[feedthebuddha]

As a Pistons fan I don't want a massive overhaul. I say listen to trade offers but only pull the trigger if it is in your favor. If you don't get that trade that you can't refuse go into next season with the same roster, different coach. This gives them an excellent chance at reaching a 7th ecf. I think as Piston fans we have been really spoiled to complain about reaching the conference finals. If it looks like things are not working out, a trade can be made at the trade deadline. Probably involving Sheeds expiring, which carries a lot of value, not to mention the player he is.

[andonewheel]

I think it'd be a HUGE mistake to start rebuilding. Right now they have a great group of players in their primes and will contend for the eastern conference title for the next few years. Boston is gonna get old before them, and Cleveland doesn't have the strongest core. I'd say Detroit has the best future in the East over the next 2-3 years. Stuckey and Maxiel both look like they will step up to be excellent rotation players for years.

Even if they rebuild, they would have a very slim chance of building a long-term future brighter than LA, NO, Utah, Portland, and even other East teams like Orlando, Cleveland, and probably Chicago now.

Their best move is to continue being a very competitive team and hope to squeeze into the Finals. I don't see the East competing with the West in the near future, but as long as you have a chance at making the finals, you don't consider rebuilding. I could understand moving one player, but you better get back another player who is all-star caliber and will fit into the system.

[Manocad]

It's past due for some major changes, unless Piston fans are content with being third-tier basketball team.

Yeah, it's our fault.

[Liqourish]

-= original quote snipped =-

Yeah, it's our fault.

I'd like to see the first two tiers

[Muzzleshot]

-= original quote snipped =-
I'd agree with you to a point that part of the blame does fall on Joe. But how we got here is almost irrelevant. The fact is we're here and Flip needs to go.

I don't think it's irrelevant because one of the people involved when Flip was coach will still be here when the next coach arrives if it comes to that.

Last summer Dumars talked about getting tough with the players and some of the attitudes on this team and how he was going to put up with them anymore. This was from a WDFN interview. One of the things he mentioned was that players were no longer going to wonder off by themselves when Flip was talking during the time outs. Anything change on that front this past season? That was an idle threat.

Dumars needs to take a stronger hand and tell the players that any disrespect of the coach that he hires is a slap in the face of himself and he's not going to put up with it, but he has to mean it and hand out punishments accordingly. If he thinks he's got players on this team that he doesn't think can fly straight then he needs to start shipping them out.

You ever observe Rip Hamilton when Flip takes him out of the game? You don't have to be a lip reader to figure out which curse words he's throwing around in his berating of Flip. Dumars needed to sit Rip down long ago and tell him to stop or he's getting suspended for a game.

[ubernathan]

The Pistons do not necessarily need to be broken up, however they need to make a significant signing or trade if they want to have a realistic chance at another championship.

[kdot99]

Some of you people don't get it, suggesting that they should keep the core intact because they will be "competitive". Being competitive isn't the point. They need to be a serious championship contender, and right now, they clearly aren't. They've lost in the ECF for the past 3 years, and have gone down hill since losing to the Spurs in the Finals in '05 (they actually had a legit chance of winning it all).

It hasn't worked in the past 3 years, why would it work next year? Sheed will be Sheed at 35, Chauncey will be 33, Rip will be 31 (though I think he'll be highly effective until the end of his career) and Dice is a 34 year old starter, who although has refined his game after serious knee surgeries, should be coming off the bench. Other teams around the league are getting better, and the Pistons aren't. It's evident that they are not going to win with this group.

[ninetyone4ever]

Rasheed Wallace needs to go... and even though he had a pretty good playoff series McDyess probably should be shipped out to get a little younger. I'd keep my backcourt intact, starting lineup and bench. This isn't the time to do anything crazy (like the '98 Bulls) and trade away the core of the team for draft picks. The east is weak enough that the Pistons may very well be back in the ECF the next couple of years regardless if they upgrade much or not. Personally I'd rather have my team in the semis or conf. finals than in the lottery, even if they dont win it all.... if you look at teams that purposely blow it up, it rarely works out and in the case of the Bulls for instance may take the better part of a decade to even get back to respectability.

I think Flip Saunders would be great in Phoenix... Detroit should bring Laimbeer in to coach the squad.

[JHTruth]

The Pistons are that one really solid squad that gets beat every year by the team with 1 or 2 great players. Detroit simply doesn't have that guy. They have defense, experience, a title, but no HOFer. Until they get one, they will go out before the Finals every year..

[triplet1984]

Joe Dumars just said that everybody's on the table, nobody is safe! BUt he will still look for good deals, not giving people away for free.

[7r5ur]

The Pistons are that one really solid squad that gets beat every year by the team with 1 or 2 great players. Detroit simply doesn't have that guy. They have defense, experience, a title, but no HOFer. Until they get one, they will go out before the Finals every year..

BS. The Pistons are not a Hall of Famer away from the finals when they've gotten to game 6 of the conference finals the last 3 years and the finals the previous 2 years.

[guy1]

They should try to trade Rasheed and McDyess and thats it. They definitely shouldn't trade Rip or Prince. If I'm Phoenix, I would be trying my hardest to trade Shaq for Sheed and Dyess. Phoenix would become a great defensive team then, but I doubt Detroit bites on that.

[Liqourish]

Rank of players on the chopping block:

1a. Rasheed Wallace
1b. Chauncey Billups
3. Jason Maxiell*
4. Antonio McDyess*
5. Tayshaun Prince
6. Rip Hamilton

Rasheed and Chauncey are the team, the team follows those two and it's the attitude of those two that have directly contirbuted to the failures of the Pistons for the past three years.

*Jason Maxiell is listed above McDyess only due to the fact that he has much more trade value than Antonio. Dumars, imo, would much rather trade Dice than Jason, but other organizations value Max higher as they should.

Tayshaun and Rip are almost guaranteed to remain. Either could be moved, but Dumars wouldn't be as eager to move them as the others.

Stuckey/Amir are untouchable. Afflalo could be included in a deal, but I don't see Dumars eager to move him.

[celticfan42487]

Rank of players on the chopping block:

1a. Rasheed Wallace
1b. Chauncey Billups
3. Jason Maxiell*
4. Antonio McDyess*
5. Tayshaun Prince
6. Rip Hamilton

Rasheed and Chauncey are the team, the team follows those two and it's the attitude of those two that have directly contirbuted to the failures of the Pistons for the past three years.

*Jason Maxiell is listed above McDyess only due to the fact that he has much more trade value than Antonio. Dumars, imo, would much rather trade Dice than Jason, but other organizations value Max higher as they should.

Tayshaun and Rip are almost guaranteed to remain. Either could be moved, but Dumars wouldn't be as eager to move them as the others.

Stuckey/Amir are untouchable. Afflalo could be included in a deal, but I don't see Dumars eager to move him.

Gata agree with this post. I really don't think you'll see a huge culture shift if you only move one of Billups and Sheed although it's possible to do so. Both are the leaders on the team and Sheed's always have the never say it's my fault attitude and Billups has picked it up the past three years with his Finals MVP. I don't fault Billups though, he was nothing but another floating PG/SG combo always wondering how long he'd be on his next team to Finals MVP on a possible dynasty... the praise got to him.

Moving Sheed I think would be enough if they get a suitable frontcourt to replace him. Someone mean. Lolz maybe a 2002 Ben Wallace?

I think once Billups becomes uncomfortable you won't see him reflecting the recent tude' he has. Once he comes to work again knowing he may have some doubters and there is some competition for his minutes on his team that he won't portray what he has recently. Guy still goes all out on the court.

Honestly something centering around a top 5 pick and a Center would be needed to get value for Sheed. idk something like SEA trades Wilkins and [Love or Lopez] for Sheed