Good News (JO blurb)

granger05 · Post #1 » by **granger05** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 8:40 pm

From Chad Ford's chat this afternoon:

Darren (Wilburton, OK): Jermaine O'Neal getting moved? Where?

Chad Ford: I think it's likely. I don't know where. If he gets healthy this summer (and the word out of Las Vegas where he's working out is that he's totally healthy and getting into great shape) the Pacers should be able to get something good in return.

I guess I don't have any comment to provide, but it's nice to read something like this.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #2 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:00 pm

At this point I really don't want to trade him. This is looking like the first time he has truly been healthy in a long time and I would love to see what he can do with 2 great wings in Granger and Dunleavy spreading the floor for him.

fdefore · Post #3 » by **fdefore** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:13 pm

At the very least with him healthy for the first half of the season that should improve his trade value considering teams will only have to pay 1.5 years on his deal.

Post #4 » by **APerna** » Thu Jun 19, 2008 9:19 pm

fdefore wrote:At the very least with him healthy for the first half of the season that should improve his trade value considering teams will only have to pay 1.5 years on his deal.

I agree whole-heartedly fdefore. You are now PP-approved.

Post #5 » by **Grang33r** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 6:40 pm

This is what worries me. I think they gotta deal him now. if the Hinrich/Thomas for O'Neal deal is still on the table i'd do it right now. No reason to wait. His value can only drop. I don't think it will rise at all.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #6 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:03 pm

Grang33r wrote:This is what worries me. I think they gotta deal him now. if the Hinrich/Thomas for O'Neal deal is still on the table i'd do it right now. No reason to wait. His value can only drop. I don't think it will rise at all.

For once we disagree man. I think his value can only rise. I don't see how his trade value could drop much further. I mean, even if he gets injured again this year, he is still a 20 mil expiring the next. This is as low as I imagine his trade value can possibly go.

cdash · Post #7 » by **cdash** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:40 pm

DGrangeRx33 wrote:
Grang33r wrote:This is what worries me. I think they gotta deal him now. if the Hinrich/Thomas for O'Neal deal is still on the table i'd do it right now. No reason to wait. His value can only drop. I don't think it will rise at all.

For once we disagree man. I think his value can only rise. I don't see how his trade value could drop much further. I mean, even if he gets injured again this year, he is still a 20 mil expiring the next. This is as low as I imagine his trade value can possibly go.

I agree. Unless someone blows us away with an offer (not likely), I'd just assume keep him. If he plays 20 or 25 games injury free and looks spry, we deal high on him. Or if we are winning, we keep him, and we get to say "f*** you!" to all these Laker and Bulls fans who come over here saying JO is worthless.

Post #8 » by **Grang33r** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 7:49 pm

cdash wrote:
DGrangeRx33 wrote:
Grang33r wrote:This is what worries me. I think they gotta deal him now. if the Hinrich/Thomas for O'Neal deal is still on the table i'd do it right now. No reason to wait. His value can only drop. I don't think it will rise at all.

For once we disagree man. I think his value can only rise. I don't see how his trade value could drop much further. I mean, even if he gets injured again this year, he is still a 20 mil expiring the next. This is as low as I imagine his trade value can possibly go.

I agree. Unless someone blows us away with an offer (not likely), I'd just assume keep him. If he plays 20 or 25 games injury free and looks spry, we deal high on him. Or if we are winning, we keep him, and we get to say "f*** you!" to all these Laker and Bulls fans who come over here saying JO is worthless.

Couple things-

1. When is the last time there was a mid-season trade that worked so well for both teams? In the NBA, more times then not, teams make the big deals in the off-season. If O'Neal's value increases after 20-25 games as you say, why in the world would the Bulls deal a Hinrich and Thomas? They'd want O'Neal to join their team in a run for the title, ala Lakers trading garbage for Pau Gasol. If you trade for a O'Neal mid-season it means you're serious about the playoffs and won't give up too much, therefore his "value" dropped, and thats what i meant.

2. If it is true to what Larry Bird is saying that we want a 2nd first round pick, and we don't have a PG and the guys we want (Augustin and Westbrook) may be taken by the 11th pick, we'll have 2 rookies and no PG. I do think we'll find a PG somewhere even if it is a trade. So, having a new PG and 2 rookies, i'm sorry but even if O'Neal is having a great season we wouldn't be great. How many rookies actually have impact right away? Then we are into next off-season, O'Neal a year older, and Pacers ready to roll, and that would be O'Neals last season, year older, value dropped again.

I'm not saying we trade him for the sake of trading him, i'm saying if a deal like a Hinrich/Thomas/2nd round for O'Neal/whatever it was said to be, is on the table, we gotta pull the trigger.

If he's on our roster by opening day then we will either keep him for remainder of his contract or get a VERY weak return on any trade.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #9 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Fri Jun 20, 2008 8:48 pm

Well I agree we would have to do the Hinrich/Thomas trade, but thats nothing more than speculation, I don't see it actually being a real discussion.

Also, I highly doubt that Augustin is gone by our pick, especially with the way thinks have been panning out lately. Bird seemed confident the player he wants will be there, maybe more confident than he should be if he was planning on taking Augustin, but I still think Augustin will make it to 11.

cdash · Post #10 » by **cdash** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 3:39 am

I think Bird was blowing smoke up our butts. I'm not so sure he has one guy in mind with that pick. I'm sure there is a very short list of favorites, and guys he prefers, but I dont think he has his mind made up that no matter what he is picking "his guy". We'll see.

I never said if we got offered a Hinrich/Thomas/Filler package for O'Neal we shouldnt do it. The problem is, that deal is not on the table, and likely wont be on the table. Dont use the Gasol trade as the measuring stick for in-season trades. That was highway robbery. If we traded JO, like you said, the other team would want to compete for a title, but we could still get picks, a young player, and cap relief contracts. I think the Jason Kidd trade is a better barometer than the Gasol trade for O'Neal. I dont think O'Neal will fetch quite that much booty, but I think thats the type of package we would go for.

Again, I dont know how much I believe us getting another first round pick. I have little doubt that we are talking to other teams about the possibility, and that we would like to...but that doesnt mean its going to happen. Also, when I said unless we were competing...it was more of a tongue in cheek comment. I seriously doubt unless the chips fall just right (and considering how snakebitten the Pacers are, thats unlikely) that we will compete for more than maybe a 6th seed in the East.

Post #11 » by **Scoot McGroot** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 7:39 pm

The thing that struck me the most is Bird's quote about the fact he's sure that his guy will be available at #11. To me, this sounds like we're going to be reaching a bit, and maybe a guy who's projected around 15-20 will be snapped up a bit early.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #12 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 8:04 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:The thing that struck me the most is Bird's quote about the fact he's sure that his guy will be available at #11. To me, this sounds like we're going to be reaching a bit, and maybe a guy who's projected around 15-20 will be snapped up a bit early.

Thats what really worries me. If we take another swing man I am going to lose my mind.

joew8302 · Post #13 » by **joew8302** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 8:44 pm

With Bird you never know. He really reached with Williams and the early returns are not favorable. At 11 we should be able to get a decent player though, lets hope Bird doesn't reach.

dwpacer · Post #14 » by **dwpacer** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 8:47 pm

Scoot McGroot wrote:The thing that struck me the most is Bird's quote about the fact he's sure that his guy will be available at #11. To me, this sounds like we're going to be reaching a bit, and maybe a guy who's projected around 15-20 will be snapped up a bit early.

I dont' think so. Based on what I'm reading, Danilo Gallinari could easily be the guy the Pacers get at #11. He has no guarantee from the Nets he'll be selected, though some sources have disagreed.

After that certainly the Pacers can nab Chalmers or Singletary late in round one.

Post #15 » by **Grang33r** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:33 pm

DGrangeRx33 wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:The thing that struck me the most is Bird's quote about the fact he's sure that his guy will be available at #11. To me, this sounds like we're going to be reaching a bit, and maybe a guy who's projected around 15-20 will be snapped up a bit early.

Thats what really worries me. If we take another swing man I am going to lose my mind.

Although we reached when we got Danny Granger and that worked out pretty well. Idk, i'm still hoping for Speights.

MUpacersSIC · Post #16 » by **MUpacersSIC** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:40 pm

Are you saying that we "reached" for Granger? Because if I remember correctly he fell to us. He was supposed to go 4 to 5 spots ahead of us and we definitely got lucky that he was still available. I would call that a steal, not a reach.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #17 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:51 pm

Grang33r wrote:
DGrangeRx33 wrote:
Scoot McGroot wrote:The thing that struck me the most is Bird's quote about the fact he's sure that his guy will be available at #11. To me, this sounds like we're going to be reaching a bit, and maybe a guy who's projected around 15-20 will be snapped up a bit early.

Thats what really worries me. If we take another swing man I am going to lose my mind.

Although we reached when we got Danny Granger and that worked out pretty well. Idk, i'm still hoping for Speights.

We didn't reach for Granger, he was suppose to go 6, we got him at 17. He fell 11 spots into our laps.

dwpacer · Post #18 » by **dwpacer** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:22 pm

He fell 11 spots into our laps as did Shawne Williams. Williams was suppose to go in the top 3 but fell.

xxSnEaKyPxx · Post #19 » by **xxSnEaKyPxx** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:28 pm

dwpacer wrote:He fell 11 spots into our laps as did Shawne Williams. Williams was suppose to go in the top 3 but fell.

No he wasn't, what are you talking about? If anything we reached for Williams.

td00 · Post #20 » by **td00** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 5:47 pm

I don't post much here, but after looking at some of the rumors and comments, I have to agree that JO's value will never increase. He has that high salary as his main concern, and that kind of salary is very Kidd-like. You have to tear apart a roster to bring him in.
Getting what NJ picked up for Kidd won't be easy. A good option would be Portland, but JO has already been in that city. Portland just has a lot of options and some will not wait on the bench to get their chance. There is only so many slots.
I just think JO needs to be part of a Shawn Marion or Zach Randolph type of salary trade to clear his numbers off the cap. Even Rasheed might be an option, but don't know if Dumars would take on such a risk with JO's recent injuries.
JO and his value has peaked. He would have to have a monster season and the Pacers would have to be the surprise of the East for him to improve his value.