Ford:Brand on the Block; Broussard Update Pg 3

[SJ2100]

Remember when Memphis offered Mike Miller for Outlaw + #13 and Portland turned it down? We should be able to get him for #7 + Blount. If we go the role players route, Portland would seem like a match.

[D1SGRUNTL3D]

i agree completely w/ bfresh on every issue regarding the heat

scenario 1- draft beasley, trade marion or haslem for pg help

2- trade # 2 pick, blount, banks to lac for brand

there is no scenario 3 IMO...i dont want minn or sea's garbage and mem's offer of miller and lowry and mayo is eh IMO

lol you already took our garbage last year

[DayofMourning]

So we trade Beasley, Blount and Banks for Brand....In the past that might be worth it, but getting Brand isn't such a bright spot as it used to be. I'd have to get Thornton or the #7 back as well.

[GameTime_3]

I got Chad Ford to answer my question about Brand in this afternoon's chat. Here it is:

Scott (miami): Any Elton Brand to the Heat talk? Maybe for the #2, with Blount and Banks as fillers?

Chad Ford: (2:06 PM ET ) If the Clippers offered Brand and No. 7 for Shawn Marion and No. 2 ... The Heat would have to bite, wouldn't they?

I'm not so sure that we would, but its interesting that he proposed that as opposed to the deal with Blount and Banks. If we did make Chad's deal, would we then try to deal #7? I don't see Love falling past #5, and I'm not sure we have shown interest in anyone else.

I honestly think 2 Brand for 7# marion is alittle to much. But i would say yes if it was 2# Marion,Banks For 7#(WestBrook,B.Lopez,Eric Gordan), Brand, Tim Thomas.

We then Sign Daniel Gibson,Beno or West.

C-Zo-Blount
PF-Brand-Haslem
SF-Dorrel-Tim Thomas
SG-Wade-Cook
PG-Gibson-Westbrook

2010 we would have Haslem,Blount,Tim thomas as expring, Something riley has been in love with for quiet some time. We would have a Contending team and Cap space to offer.

[MartyConlonJr]

Guys, my trade was the tits.

Brand + re-signed Maggette for #2 pick and Marion.

It's more likely to get done from the Clippers side, as we'd be doing the contract negotations with Maggette, who, if Clippers are going this rebuild route, are not interested in players in their prime NOW like him as much as they are interested in keeping their #7 pick. The also have no say in what he does, so it's a smaller loss.

For us, if we are going the Brand route are looking to rebuild quickly, so Maggette is a good fit.

Better for us not to work out an extension immediately. Give Brand a season to ensure he is fully healthy. If not, use his expiring to get someone who is. If he's healthy and productive, can't imagine him leaving a team stationed in Miami, alongside a good starting lineup with well managed cap with a history of quick rebuilds and winning that is playing in a weak eastern conference.

[perz260]

i agree completely w/ bfresh on every issue regarding the heat

scenario 1- draft beasley, trade marion or haslem for pg help

2- trade # 2 pick, blount, banks to lac for brand

there is no scenario 3 IMO...i dont want minn or sea's garbage and mem's offer of miller and lowry and mayo is eh IMO

lol you already took our garbage last year

I think we both gave each other "garbage" or did fatoine become a rotation player for minesota last year? To top it off say what u will about ricky davis but the guy played hard all year for us, didn't miss a game and from all accounts him and blount were good teammates. Miller and Lowry are garbage for the 2nd pick and the right to pick the player that in my opinion is the most talented prospect in the draft.

[perz260]

Can I ask why are some people souring on Beasley? If the Brand from 2 years ago was available, then i could see trading the pick, but now u are talking about a player coming off a major injury, who because of said injury isn't playing in the Olympics, and who hasn't shown he can stay healthy for an entire year. I am sorry i don't think he is worth the gamble, I hope we stay put and draft Beasley.

[GameTime_3]

Can I ask why are some people souring on Beasley? If the Brand from 2 years ago was available, then i could see trading the pick, but now u are talking about a player coming off a major injury, who because of said injury isn't playing in the Olympics, and who hasn't shown he can stay healthy for an entire year. I am sorry i don't think he is worth the gamble, I hope we stay put and draft Beasley.

I Love Elton brand but Beasley can be had at half the price and we dont loss any pieces. Now if we can get LA to accept a 2#,Marion,Banks for 7#,Brand,Tim Thomas...Then we would be talking. We then could trade Haslem because of the Flexiablity that Thomas brings and we would be get rid of the banks contract for thomas who has 1 year less and can be more of a rotation player.

[D1SGRUNTL3D]

i agree completely w/ bfresh on every issue regarding the heat

scenario 1- draft beasley, trade marion or haslem for pg help

2- trade # 2 pick, blount, banks to lac for brand

there is no scenario 3 IMO...i dont want minn or sea's garbage and mem's offer of miller and lowry and mayo is eh IMO

lol you already took our garbage last year

I think we both gave each other "garbage" or did fatoine become a rotation player for minesota last year? To top it off say what u will about ricky davis but the guy played hard all year for us, didn't miss a game and from all accounts him and blount were good teammates. Miller and Lowry are garbage for the 2nd pick and the right to pick the player that in my opinion is the most talented prospect in the draft.

Cept we have your 1st round draft pick rights and Fatoine becomes an expiring.

Has it occured to you yet that whatever team Ricky and Mark are on, wont win games?

[GameTime_3]

@ the time the trade was good. If we end up making the playoffs that pick is useless or mininul and Mark Blout > Walker. Expiring is overrated, How many times does some1 say we got expiring and it gets us nothing. Jason Williams? Ricky Davis? expiring contractsthat fetched us what, Nothing.Remmber expring is great but most of the time, if the team wants a expring contract it also says something about the player in question.

[MartyConlonJr]

^ Come on Game time, we got molested on that trade, anyway you look at it. We thought it was good, it was not. It was never a good trade. I hate to say it, but Walker > Blount. I can't see anyway that Blount could ever start on any championship team, and while it seems ridiculous, the proof exists that Walker can be.

We are paying close to Walkers salary in Blount, and we have to pay an extra year of salary, which is completely destroying our chances of comfortable max money, which is why we have to trade good assets with Blount and Banks for someone to take em. On top of that, Ricky Davis for all his hard work, ruined about 20 or so 4th quarter plays where we could have won games (which in retrospect for tanking purposes was ok but in no way justifies it).

On top of it we had to give them a pick, which would be valuable in making trades this offseason (teams love a future first). We can't trade a pick to 2011 due to CBA rules (Can't trade consecutive picks) and even that pick will be conditional.

Minnesota capitalised on our desperation and took us. I've never seen Riley get taken so badly on a trade.

If we suck again this year and keep our draft pick, I think we have to give them an un-conditional pick the following year, or maybe top 3 protection. If we rebuild poorly, this trade just gets worse and worse.

[GameTime_3]

Marty, But when the trade was made how many people thought we would be last in the league? Every year you can find a First rounder. At the time the first rounder was mid to late pick. Yes, Monday QB its easy to say, Why did we do that trade, But when it happened everyone here thought it was good. if some how we can make the playoffs next year then i don't see the trade being all that bad. Honestly i still think Blount has more value then walker. Walker could not get off the bench in Minny. At least we got a serviceable Center in Blount. Im not trying to defend the trade, But to say riley was had is hard to say, because at the time we all thought we would be in the playoffs.Thats like saying the Spurs got had in the Kurt Thomas deal. Why would they send 2 First rounder for a guy that is going to leave, They did it thinking they were going to the finals and needed another piece.

[D'Lo]

Marty, But when the trade was made how many people thought we would be last in the league? Every year you can find a First rounder. At the time the first rounder was mid to late pick. Yes, Monday QB its easy to say, Why did we do that trade, But when it happened everyone here thought it was good. if some how we can make the playoffs next year then i don't see the trade being all that bad. Honestly i still think Blount has more value then walker. Walker could not get off the bench in Minny. At least we got a serviceable Center in Blount. Im not trying to defend the trade, But to say riley was had is hard to say, because at the time we all thought we would be in the playoffs.Thats like saying the Spurs got had in the Kurt Thomas deal. Why would they send 2 First rounder for a guy that is going to leave, They did it thinking they were going to the finals and needed another piece.

Actually, it was the Sonics who gave up 2 1st rounders to Phoenix for KT.

[GameTime_3]

Your right, They only sent 1. Either way, If you think about it, Why would you give a first round pick for a guy that could leave the team? Its easy to talk bad about a deal after the facts. @ the time of the Joe Johnson deal, Everyone thought that the suns were riping off the hawks, They got a PF in diaw that started off on fire in PHX and a first round pick. The hawks got lucky in the lotto and ended up sending them a mid first and diaw. Now what happens if the lotto goes against them and they send the number 4 pick to the suns last year? The deal is in the suns favor. Al Horford,Boris Diaw for Joe Johnson is pretty good but it will end up being Brand Rush,Diaw for Joe Johnson.

[vincent]

Come on Game time, we got molested on that trade, anyway you look at it. We thought it was good, it was not. It was never a good trade. I hate to say it, but Walker > Blount. I can't see anyway that Blount could ever start on any championship team, and while it seems ridiculous, the proof exists that Walker can be.

Well Blount was not the start at the begin of the season Shaq was and ZO was the back-up
Center

We are paying close to Walkers salary in Blount, and we have to pay an extra year of salary, which is completely destroying our chances of comfortable max money

yes, the Heat are paying 10 million more over the life of both contract (if Minn. refused to
pick up Walker opt for 2/20mil.) and a 1st round pick ..top 10 protected in 2009 /
top 3 protected in 2010

Ricky Davis for all his hard work, ruined about 20 or so 4th quarter plays where we could have won games (which in retrospect for tanking purposes was ok but in no way justifies it).

i agree but this trade was about Ricky and getting rid of Walker not Acquiring Blount

Minnesota capitalised on our desperation and took us. I've never seen Riley get taken so badly on a trade.

10 million in extra salary and a 1 st round pick adv.Minn
but not by much .Walker is still asking to be bought-out and not playing in many games

If we suck again this year and keep our draft pick, I think we have to give them an un-conditional pick the following year, or maybe top 3 protection. If we rebuild poorly, this trade just gets worse and worse

top 10 protected in 2009 /
top 3 protected in 2010

a little spin here with Riley attempting to clear salary
having a rookie take up cap space will be avoided
unless we s K next season ..

[Flix360]

I wont even touch a Blount-Banks-Beasley for Brand deal, even if we get rid 2 bad contracts, beasley>>brand in a few years.

[MartyConlonJr]

Saying "At the time we thought it was a good trade", in no way makes it a good trade.

I hate Walker, he's terrible, and if I had my time again, I wouldn't do that trade even if we kept our pick. Without that trade we'd have

C - ? / Mourning
PF - Beasley / Haslem / Walker
SF - Marion / Wright
SG - Wade / Cook
PG - ? / Banks

We'd have a salary cap for 08-09 of 63 million, but after that season we'd have another draft pick and $35 million on the books for 09-10 season. Also, Walkers expiring would be huge value. Right now we're talking Blount and Banks + #2 for Brand, we could be giving Walker's expiring instead of Blount to make it a much more palatable trade for Clippers, expiring and potential PF for great PF. I think with an expiring and pick you could even get the 7th pick. We could just go mental on our MLE's the next two years and fill out the roster and have our own draft pick next year and Clippers this year

1) Never do the Blount + Davis for Walker + pick trade
2) Trade Walker (expiring) + #2 pick for Brand + #7
3) Draft Augustin or Westbrook at PG at #7
4) Give Marion and Brand extensions (either this year in opt outs or next year)
5) We can then use 09 1st rounder, or 08 MLE, or 09 MLE to fill out center position, or trade Haslem for a C, then use MLE or draft pick for reserve PF.

C - ? / Mourning
PF - Brand / Haslem
SF - Marion / Wright
SG - Wade / Cook
PG - Augustin / Banks

God, we'd be sitting so much prettier without making that trade, we got screwed mercilessly. The possibilities would be endless.

[Flash3]

If we can somehow get a trio of

Wade-Mayo-Brand in some manner, I'll be happy.

[Hoops23]

How about Wade-Marion-Brand? Isn't it much better?

[vincent]

Saying "At the time we thought it was a good trade", in no way makes it a good trade.

I hate Walker, he's terrible, and if I had my time again, I wouldn't do that trade even if we kept our pick. Without that trade we'd have

C - ? / Mourning
PF - Beasley / Haslem / Walker
SF - Marion / Wright
SG - Wade / Cook
PG - ? / Banks

We'd have a salary cap for 08-09 of 63 million, but after that season we'd have another draft pick and $35 million on the books for 09-10 season. Also, Walkers expiring would be huge value. Right now we're talking Blount and Banks + #2 for Brand, we could be giving Walker's expiring instead of Blount to make it a much more palatable trade for Clippers, expiring and potential PF for great PF. I think with an expiring and pick you could even get the 7th pick. We could just go mental on our MLE's the next two years and fill out the roster and have our own draft pick next year and Clippers this year

.

well I'm going to just stick to the Fact
Because we have no ideal if LAC will make that trade .
Minn. only adv is Miami has to pay 10 million more in actual dollars
asumming Minn opt out of Walker contract .

The Heat still has 30million in cap space ,it just spread out over two season
if Pat Riley play his card right .16-18 in 09 .If pat use all 16 -18 next off-season
in 2010 i see 14 million in cap space.(i like bank but get rid of Bank contract is
1000x more important than trade Blount)