Ford:Brand on the Block; Broussard Update Pg 3

rockman0825 · Post #41 » by **rockman0825** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:02 pm

The only reason to get brand is to keep marion.... they both must opt out,,,,, then we sign and trade beasley and blount for Brand at a 3 yr 33 mill contract..... then we resign marion for like a two yr 26 mill contract... or vise versa... the point is we need to have the combo or wade marion beasley or wade marion brand so that if we need players they come in and sign for less like boston did... maybe we should just draft beasley resign wright .... or just have marion opt in.... het beasley... and then when marion expires we go for brand... or resign marion...but i think unless we get good i mean really good value we should keep beasley

Post #42 » by **GameTime_3** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 7:28 pm

rockman0825 wrote:The only reason to get brand is to keep marion.... they both must opt out,,,,, then we sign and trade beasley and blount for Brand at a 3 yr 33 mill contract..... then we resign marion for like a two yr 26 mill contract... or vise versa... the point is we need to have the combo or wade marion beasley or wade marion brand so that if we need players they come in and sign for less like boston did... maybe we should just draft beasley resign wright .... or just have marion opt in.... het beasley... and then when marion expires we go for brand... or resign marion...but i think unless we get good i mean really good value we should keep beasley

You really think Brand would sign for 3yr 33million? The guy will be looking for 4 yr 60 million, Or more. Why trade Beasley for Brand, When you can sign him next offseason and still have beasley. Who's to say that beasley wont play alot of 3 in the nba. I say,

1.Draft Beasley and Sasha Kaun 52#
2.Sign a PG.
3.Stand PAT
4. Let the season playout, See where Beasley fits in the NBA(3or4).
5.Try and Move Banks, Use Haslem as the Bait.
6.Next offseason, We sign Brand and hopefully still have Cap Room in 2010.
7.Send Gametime Money for the expert analysis that he just gave.

vincent · Post #43 » by **vincent** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 5:54 pm

From Broussard's ESPN blog....

The Sixers would love to get Elton Brand, but word is that he doesn't want to take a pay cut from the $16 million-plus he's due next season -- except to go to Miami.

...

Miami is trying desperately to find a way to get Brand, whose first choice is the Heat, but a sign-and-trade for Shawn Marion is probably the only way to get it done. Hard to see that happening.

Post #44 » by **GameTime_3** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 7:03 pm

vincent wrote:From Broussard's ESPN blog....

The Sixers would love to get Elton Brand, but word is that he doesn't want to take a pay cut from the $16 million-plus he's due next season -- except to go to Miami.

...

Miami is trying desperately to find a way to get Brand, whose first choice is the Heat, but a sign-and-trade for Shawn Marion is probably the only way to get it done. Hard to see that happening.

Thats why i dont want to see a trade. The guy wants to be in miami, Why trade for him? The guy would probley come to miami next year as a free agent.

salqaddoumi · Post #45 » by **salqaddoumi** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:45 pm

Sources say the Phoenix Suns appear poised to make a draft day deal.

They are talking with Toronto about sending Boris Diaw to the Raptors for T.J. Ford and the 17th pick in Thursday's draft. Ford, who would back up Steve Nash, played for new Suns coach Terry Porter in Milwaukee from 2003 to 2005.

The Suns are also considering a trade with Portland in which they would send Leandro Barbosa to the Blazers for Martell Webster and the 13th pick of this year's draft.

Only one, if any, of those trades will happen.

Elsewhere, some say Atlanta doesn't want to go above $11 million per year to sign restricted free agent Josh Smith. If that's the case, look for Smith to end up in Philadelphia.

The Sixers would love to get Elton Brand, but word is that he doesn't want to take a pay cut from the $16 million-plus he's due next season -- except to go to Miami.

So with Brand pretty much out of the question, Philly will look at Smith and Antawn Jamison. The Sixers can start either one at $11 million with 8 percent annual increases.

Smith, by the way, would fit perfectly in Philly's up-tempo, run-and-jump system. But I think Atlanta must match whatever offer he gets. If they don't re-sign him, they'll lose all the momentum they gained by taking Boston to seven games, not to mention a great budding young talent.

Miami is trying desperately to find a way to get Brand, whose first choice is the Heat, but a sign-and-trade for Shawn Marion is probably the only way to get it done. Hard to see that happening.

I trust Broussard the most out of any of those ESPN writers so this information is pretty legit.

Post #46 » by **DayofMourning** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 9:57 pm

The only way to get Brand would be if Marion opted out entirely or opted out and resigned for about ten million less a year than what he would get originally. If the latter happened then I could see Brand taking much less as well with both he and Marion signing five year deals. That would take so much behind the scenes, illegal maneuvering to get done that I don't see it happening.

Brand, Marion, Wade and the pick would be a tough team. With Rose most likely going to Chicago, then Brand would have to play center to provide for Beasley unless Riley looks at his talent and takes Mayo instead.

MartyConlonJr · Post #47 » by **MartyConlonJr** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:13 pm

GameTime_3 wrote:
vincent wrote:From Broussard's ESPN blog....

The Sixers would love to get Elton Brand, but word is that he doesn't want to take a pay cut from the $16 million-plus he's due next season -- except to go to Miami.

...

Miami is trying desperately to find a way to get Brand, whose first choice is the Heat, but a sign-and-trade for Shawn Marion is probably the only way to get it done. Hard to see that happening.

Thats why i dont want to see a trade. The guy wants to be in miami, Why trade for him? The guy would probley come to miami next year as a free agent.

Because to trade for him means you can use MLE, LLE, re-up Wright, trade for longer salaries and not plan 1-2 years ahead for space.

If that is the case with Brand wanting to be here, we have more leverage and maybe the #2 pick is too much to give. But trying to get Brand in a trade allows you to do a lot more over the year.

Post #48 » by **GameTime_3** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:30 pm

If this is true, Then i could see the Clippers accepting a Brand,7# for Marion,2# or Brand,Tim Thomas,7# for Marion,Banks,2#. The biggest question is not what the Clippers want to do, its what does Riley want? If Riley feels that he can have brand next off season, Then why give up pieces now. The report also says that Brand would be willing to take a paycut to come here, How much? Things should get interesting on draft night. Draft night is going to be more about after the pick then the pick it self.

Post #49 » by **DayofMourning** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:35 pm

I'd rather have the #2 and Marion than #7 and Brand.

On a scale of ten I'd rate Marion a 8 and Brand a 8.5. Not a big difference there for me.

As for the picks, ours is a ten and LA's is a 6.

I like Brand as an addition to our team, not as a trade asset.

daniel3 · Post #50 » by **daniel3** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:40 pm

What about something like this. Miami trades Marion (resigned to a 5 year deal @ $10mil in 1st year and team option on the 5th year), Udonis Haslem, and Daequan Cook for Elton Brand.

Post #51 » by **DayofMourning** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 10:49 pm

Not interested. Too much going out. Haslem has good value and Cook has potential.

Marion and Brand are pretty equal in my eyes, with Brand's shot creating ability being his major plus.

I'm fine with Marion rather than Brand. If they both opt out then we can sign Brand without giving anything up.

Post #52 » by **BFO** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:24 am

Marion for Brand is a sideways move at best IMO, unless Rose is guranteed at pick 2. I certainly wouldn't be exchanging picks in any Marion Brand deal.

Marty, what are the options to bring in Brand whilst holding onto our pick and also Marion? Is there any way possible?

I don't like the idea of giving up pick #2 in any deal to be honest but if it meant having a nucleus of Wade, Marion and Brand then perhaps I could live with that.

Would it be worth trying to get Livingston (the always injured PG) in a deal with LAC? Not sure of his standing with them any more but I do remember there being some big wraps on him a couple of years back. Could be worth a risk from our PG point of view.

vincent · Post #53 » by **vincent** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:31 am

Livingston is free to sign with any team he want...

but Shawn is still injury alas jason william types injury

Post #54 » by **DayofMourning** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 1:43 am

Livingston will be lucky to ever have an NBA career with his knee issues.

The only way to get Brand and Marion on the same team would be for both to opt out and resign for lower figures, splitting the 15 million of space between them, or sending the number two pick and some big contracts LA's way.

MartyConlonJr · Post #55 » by **MartyConlonJr** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 2:32 am

BFO wrote:Marty, what are the options to bring in Brand whilst holding onto our pick and also Marion? Is there any way possible?

Well I was assuming it would be Marion for Brand or #2 pick for Brand. One has to go I think. The rest of our trade assets suck. But a trade like the one proposed by that Sonics guy, coupled with an expirings and some youth for Brand would be a decent outcome.

Trade 1: # 2 pick + Blount + Banks for #4 pick + #24 pick + Wilcox + Marshall + 2010 First rounder (from Phoenix)

Trade 2: Marshall + Wilcox + #24 pick + Wright + Cook for Brand

C - Mourning
PF - Brand / Haslem
SF - Marion / Pietrus (MLE)
SG - Wade
PG - Bayless/Mayo (#4) / Quinn

Really, there is no point getting Brand, keeping Beasley and Marion as well. Especially if you add in Haslem too. Damnit, why couldn't the Sonics get the 3rd pick (assuming we really want Mayo). We use our 08 MLE on Pietrus, and can use our 2009 and 2010 MLE as well as a possibly high #1st rounder from Phoenix coupled with ours..

By 2010 offseason we could look like

C - (20010 #8 pick - Phoenix) / (2010 #23 pick Miami)
PF - Brand / Haslem / (2008 LLE)
SF - Marion / Pietrus (2008 MLE)
SG - Wade / (2009 MLE) / (2010 LLE)
PG - Bayless/Mayo (#4) / (2010 MLE)

or something like that. To go the route of saving money for Brand next offseason we could look like this in 2010 (we could also use Blount's expiring to net a player around 7-8 mill if someone bites):

C - (2010 #18 pick Miami) / Anthony
PF - Brand / Haslem
SF - Beasley / (2010 MLE)
SG - Wade / Cook
PG - Banks / (2010 LLE)

D'Lo · Post #56 » by **D'Lo** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 4:02 am

Come on Riley, make it happen. #2 for Brand.

Post #57 » by **BFO** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 4:10 am

Fair enough.

I like the idea of keeping our #2 pick. That gives us a legit start for the next ten years (alongside Wade for a further 5 or so) which provides a good transition over time.

I guess our options are;

1. Win now - trade #2 for Brand
2. Hedge our bets - trade Marion for Brand and keep #2
3. Prepare for 2010 - sit tight and see what happens

I actually think I like option 2 the most (especially if Bulls take Beasley) but if not then perhaps we make a trade with Minny so we get #3 and trade contracts of some crap. I can't see Riley taking option 3 so should be interesting.

Isn't Marion supposed to opt-out or in today?

MartyConlonJr · Post #58 » by **MartyConlonJr** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 4:43 am

^ We're aussies. We're a day ahead, I believe he decides Monday, which is Tuesday here. I can't imagine he opts out unless Philly wants him. His best chance of big money would be Philly offering him a contract with their space and max raises.. Actually, that would be a wicked trade.

Miami trades:
Marion

Miami recieves:
Jason Smith
#16th pick

Then Miami has max space to sign Brand, who opts out.

C - Mourning / Smith / Jordan (#16) / Blount
PF - Brand / Haslem
SF - Beasley (#2 pick) / Wright
SG - Wade / Cook
PG - ? / Banks

We still have 5-6 mill to sign a PG if we choose, or maybe try and trade Haslem for Hinrich/Mo/Ford and use the money on a reserve PF.

I doubt Philly wants Marion there at PF, but they did have Thaddeus Young there and they were one of the best defensive teams in the league after the break, with Thaddeus being a poor, poor, poor mans Marion.

Post #59 » by **BFO** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 10:42 am

Do we really need Brand?

Hypothetically....
(best case scenario)
Beasley turns out to be a bonafide PF with the ability to play from the perimeter too; this gives us one of the top inside players in the league for the next ten years. We pair this with Wade who comes back to full-strength and recaptures form close to that of 06/07. Then add in a legit third option in Marion who is arguably the most versatile defender in the league. Would there be a better 2-3-4 combo than that in the league?

So our team would look like;
PG - ?? / Banks
SG - Wade / Cook
SF - Marion / Wright
PF - Beasley / Haslem
C - Zo / Blount

I am actually pretty happy with that team as long as Zo can go for at least 28 minutes per night. Haslem becomes expendable and the only real thing that could potentially net us a PG (Mo, TJ, Hinrich). Problem is I don't see any of those teams needing Haslem. Haslem could suit Phoenix so is it too much of a stretch asking for Barbosa (I am not a huge fan)?

Either way I don't think we have a good enough PG or C to call ourselves a contender next year regardless. So I say let's not trade pick 2. And make sure the Brand deal nets us something a little more than just Marion for Brand - either dump contracts or get something better than Quinn or Blount at C.

Post #60 » by **BBallFreak** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 12:53 pm

Without involving a third team, their is no way that Marion fetches Brand, and even then it doesn't make sense as just about any third team would prefer to land Brand. To further add, Brand is more valuable than Marion, so it means someone either has to overpay for Marion, or the Clippers have to accept a lesser deal for Brand.

MartyConlonJr,

That Clipps/Sonics deal is absolutely brutal for the Clipps. Their is no way imaginable that they trade Brand without either Marion or our pick going out. None. It's not happening. Their is no conceivable way that we end up with Wade, Brand, Marion, and the 4th pick in this draft.