Poll: Do the Hawks need to do more than re-sign free agents?

[Rod700]

With the Sixers and Raptors improving, should the Hawks be satisfied with merely resigning their free agents?

My thinking is that we need to move forward in order to remain competitive in the face of the improvements the Sixers and Raptors have made. Granted, I'm proud of what our guys did in the playoffs, but I'm wouldn't let that pride cloud my judgment. To me, we have 3 guys that are the heart and soul (and future) of our team in JJ, Smoove, and Hortford. Having Bibby has helped us, but having any credible point guard would have helped us. He is getting older, he didn't shoot well in the playoffs, and if we thought we could get someone who up the tempo for our young, athletic, somewhat small team, I would concede to trade him. I'm just using him as an example, because his addition to our team obviously helped us, but I believe we need to remain open to the fact that trading him or some other players could help us improve further. It seems that some people on this board are attached to even our role players and unproven players. I know that some people didn't like the trade I posted with Chill + Law for Barbosa, but I think we are a board that over-values our players that perform supporting roles. Aside from Bibby, Chill runs around without the ball and gets some easy buckets and opportune baskets, which is great, but his defense against SF's and his overall numbers and impact on the team aren't huge. Likewise, Law could develop into something, but with Bibby aging, and the little time that Law has gotten, I consider him too big of a question mark for stepping in as the starting point when needed. Marv too, although he is young, and getting better, might command his highest trade value now, while he can still be seen as having some potential for future growth.

[MikeRice]

I would love to trade Marvin... don't know exactly what he's worth or what we could get back. Bibby is nice because his deal is expiring and next year has a good free agent market. Depending on how much he signs for, I think Childress is undervalued. I think we are at our best when Childress is out there instead of Marvin. We probably won't be serious title contenders next year but in the course we are going I think we could really make noise in the following year. Hopefully we will ride out Bibby's contract, try to get some more playoff experience and let our young guys develop another year and then bring in an impact free agent to make our push.

[Rod700]

One other comment: With the Clippers falling apart and losing Brand and Maggette, I would actually make them an offer on Kahman for two reasons:

1. After losing two of their best players, they may have to enter a rebuilding period anyway. If we gave them the right pieces (including Marv and/or a 1st), they might bite.
2. It serves as a bit of a minor distraction from them trying to sign Smoove. They might not be willing to offer him as much if we can offer them an more affordable option to rebuild quickly with a Kahman trade.

EDIT: Unless the Clippers sign Baron Davis, that would undermine the statement directly above. Does anyone know if that is final yet?

[td00]

We might end up along with Detroit and Cleveland, as teams that make the least changes to our roster. That isn't what Detriot wants, but as you say we do, they value their players quite a lot to where they won't give up anything unless they get younger doing it.

What I expect us to do and I wrote this elsewhere is we add perhaps a journeyman big man like a Steven Hunter or Francisco Elson and detemine if Speedy can help us at all. To me, that is the most that will happen with this roster when the Josh*2 scenario finally gets resolved.
If Speedy comes back, and we suit up 13 players, we will have one slot available to fill.
Like Orlando, we still need a shooter to come off the bench, someone who doesn't rub Woody the wrong way.

[td00]

IMO, one guy who would make us a much better team despite his antics would be Ron Artest. I still think he has something very valuable for a team to succeed. HIs numbers may decline here with all of our young talent, but i would take him for Marvin in a moment's notice.
To win in this league, you have to play to win now....it takes way too long to depend on young talent to develop. Give the reins to Acie this season and move Bibby (if possible). Bring us a cheaper shooter solution.
A couple of starting lineup changes would do this roster well. Not many vets are going to come in here and play behind Marvin/Al and Smoove.

[Rip2137]

You could probably talk Sacramento into that deal also. i think the Hawks could get it done. But of course you run into Artest vs Bibby's no defense pt. 2. But hey...i want to move Bibby so....


I think the Hawks should be focused on the Nets for a quality back up big. Right now they have Ryan Anderson, Josh Boone, Nenad Krstic, Brook Lopez, Stromile Swift, Sean Williams and Yi Jianlian occupying 2 positions (although you can play Yi at the 3).

Thats alot of bodies. I don't see them giving up Williams, Lopez, Anderson or Yi, but Krstic, Swift or Boone might be there to be had. I would prefer Boone of course as he would be cheap and is a tough player that Woody would like(or put on the bench like Batista...one of the two).

[killbuckner]

The first question is what the chances are that the Hawks make the playoffs if they don't add any additional talent. I sure don't see them as a lock. But the next question is how they can add talent without exceeding the luxury tax since there is no way in hell the ASG pays that. The funny thing is that Speedy is pretty much the key piece to the offseason. Either he plays and they get a strong backup PG or he retires and they get some breathing room to use the MLE without exceeding the tax.

It would take a large set of cojones for Sund to trade Marvin for artest- I am guessing he won't make any major moves until after the season starts though.

[HoopsGuru25]

I'm not happy with Sund. When he took over he's basically said he's content with bringing back the same exact team that won 37 games this year and hasn't done anything to suggest otherwise . I was disappointed in bringing back Woodson and was somewhat disappointed by our inactivity during the draft(in which Sund said he wouldn't do anything unless someone "made him a great offer"). It seems like he thinks that our young players will just become good enough to the point where we just won't need to fix any actual flaws on the roster. If we can even afford to bring the Joshes back at this point...I think the Hawks are going to fail miserably by trying to build off the momentum of last years playoff series and miss the playoffs. Remember...the East was even weaker than usual and the Hawks were one of the healthiest teams in the league yet we still won 37 games. The Hawks needed someone like Pritchard who was aggressive and would actively make moves but it seems like they've hired a "yes guy" who is just an extension of the BK era until we bring in someone else. I guess it's just the ASG's fault more than anything...

[jagstang76]

I like the idea of getting Artest too. IMO, he would bring a lot to this team that would push us further in the playoffs. I'm not sure what sort of deal could get it done, but Marvin or Chill + something else makes sense. He and Bibby would pick up where they left off, and JJ would benefit greatly having another solid scorer to share the load with. We get stronger and harder to push around. We get much better defensively as well. He only have one year left on his contract, so we can go any number of directions after it expires.

I'd have a hard time giving up Marvin straight up for Artest though. Considering the short time he could be with us, is it really worth giving up on Marvin? Of course we might not be able to keep him around either, but we will likely have to cap room to keep whoever is here. I only fear that RA will negatively effect things should we not play up to his expectations. I worry a little about losing out on any potential Marvin has too.

[Rip2137]

Artest has a strange loyalty to teams. I know that might sound odd after asking to get traded by the Pacers, but that was because he HONESTLY felt he was making the team worse by sticking around. He has that kind of mentality. People were talking about him saying he wished he had opted out now, but that was because the Kings FO told him he wasn't in their long term plans after he pointed out that the Kings gave him a chance and he would stick with them.

And Hoops, Sund has been notoriously stagnant in his time in Seattle. The way he let guys like Watson and Ridnor just sit there when he could have gotten something for them was just plain ridiculous. The only moves he ever makes are when a team is looking for a salary dump. Of course he is going to stand pat because that is what he does.

[Rod700]

I understand your concern Jagstang, but I'd do a Marv for Artest trade straight up in a heart beat. I think that if we made the playoffs, and with the cap room we will have with Bibby and Zaza coming off the books, he would re-sign with us. Better teams in title contention would likely value him less and offer him less due to his past dramatics. I don't think Kings would do that trade straight up though. Marv is an all-around solid player, but he doesn't do anything special. He's numbers are fairly average, and while the whole idea of youth and potential adds to his trade value, I don't think it's enough to get Artest straight up by any means. I would be they would want a first rounder too.

[Rod700]

I'm not happy with Sund . . . it seems like they've hired a "yes guy" . . . I guess it's just the ASG's fault more than anything...

My thoughts exactly.

[MikeRice]

I'm not happy with Sund. When he took over he's basically said he's content with bringing back the same exact team that won 37 games this year and hasn't done anything to suggest otherwise . I was disappointed in bringing back Woodson and was somewhat disappointed by our inactivity during the draft(in which Sund said he wouldn't do anything unless someone "made him a great offer"). It seems like he thinks that our young players will just become good enough to the point where we just won't need to fix any actual flaws on the roster. If we can even afford to bring the Joshes back at this point...I think the Hawks are going to fail miserably by trying to build off the momentum of last years playoff series and miss the playoffs. Remember...the East was even weaker than usual and the Hawks were one of the healthiest teams in the league yet we still won 37 games. The Hawks needed someone like Pritchard who was aggressive and would actively make moves but it seems like they've hired a "yes guy" who is just an extension of the BK era until we bring in someone else. I guess it's just the ASG's fault more than anything...

I was also pretty disappointed we reupped Woodson for two years, even in the playoffs I wasn't too impressed by the coaching. As far as the draft picks go, however, I don't blame Sund for not trying to get in there. Honestly, the draft is very hit or miss (2000 absolutely terrible 2003 one of the best) and I don't think this draft was very good top to bottom (plus Sund's drafts in Seattle were more busts than not with Petro, Swift and Sene we would've been a lock to take that crappy french big guy). We have enough youth at this point and I think we should start trading more draft picks if thats what it takes to bring in some vets. I will not say I approve or disapprove of Sund at this juncture but as far as trading talent for draft picks go I think that is a step in rebuilding we have finally passed.

[evildallas]

My worry on Artest is that he and Bibby hate each other (maybe that's too strong, but it is in the ball park). The chemistry risk there is great.

As far as the overall question, I like our core, but feel we lack the necessary complimentary skill sets to thrive.
#1 Starting SF needs to stretch the floor. This can either be Marvin developing range on his shot or going in a different direction. You either get a low post threat that opens up the perimeter shooters or you get perimeter shooters who can open up room for your low post people. Al and Josh Smith will be much more effective on the block if we had another legitimate 3 point threat in the main lineup.
#2 A Defensive shot blocking C to back up Al/Josh. One of the biggest reasons we can't lose Josh Smith is his defense. When he's not in the paint, we don't have a realistic deterrent to penetration. A player like Diop or Pryzbilla might be overpaid, but they greatly enhance team defense the 15-20 minutes they are on the floor. A 7 footer would be preferable, but guys like Maxiell and Sean Williams do a good job on protecting the paint as well. Solomon might be able to provide this if he could stay on the floor without racking up rapid fouls.
#3 Bulk off the bench. Al needs to get stronger in the starting lineup and I believe he will. Behind him we have only Zaza who isn't quite as bulky as necessary. We are committing to a pair of lean athletic starting forwards and that's fine, but we need a change of pace for certain matchups like the Celtics have Leon Powe and Big Baby for example. Garnett is the starting PF, but they are able to throw some bulking guys in for minutes to wear an opponent down. We currently don't have adequate counter.
#4 Overall we need viable depth at multiple positions to alleviate the coaching trap we always fall into. By using Josh Childress as a multiple position primary sub, we alter our play like someone is holding up cue cards for Woodson. We need to have more imagination with our depth so that we don't have situations where we have Josh Smith standing at the 3 point line (possibly chucking bad shots) so that Josh Childress can take his man down low for the rebounding edge. That strategy hurts more than it helps and will continue to do so until Josh Smith develops a dead-eye jumper. Use actual backups at each position and don't switch players just because you can.

I think if we stand pat we're going to have problems overcoming these deficiencies over the course of the season.

[HMFFL]

I like to think we improved our team this past season when we traded for Mike Bibby. It'd still be nice to add another quality bench player or even more size, but I'm not getting my hopes up, and just hope we sign both of the Joshes.

[MikeRice]

someone mentioned a marvin for mike miller trade a few weeks ago... I think that trade would work out nicely for both teams

[HMFFL]

someone mentioned a marvin for mike miller trade a few weeks ago... I think that trade would work out nicely for both teams

The ASG would need to be willing to take on roughly 3.5 million more and I don't see them doing that.

[JoshB914]

The Spurs are going to sign Roger Mason. There goes a guy we could have used.

[MikeRice]

someone mentioned a marvin for mike miller trade a few weeks ago... I think that trade would work out nicely for both teams

The ASG would need to be willing to take on roughly 3.5 million more and I don't see them doing that.

touche sir

[evildallas]

The other thing about Miller that I didn't consider when he got sent to Minnesota is that being from South Dakota it's the closest he can get to playing at home. As such he might not even be pushing for a trade to a contender.