What if Speedy showed he actually was healthy?(Trade value)

stayinschool33 · Post #1 » by **stayinschool33** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:00 am

Orlando needs a PG in the worst way. They have four shooting guards, including 2 that have fallen out of favor with their coach. We could give the speedy and the rights to david anderson for Keith Bogans and Brian Cook(started with reddick here, but no one here wants him-I think he could still become a nice player in this league). Then we would have depth at the 2 and 4 with shooters to come off the bench. This could be especially useful if we lose childress. Also wanted to ask what are the chances we s+t Josh Smith for Okafor? Don;t know if this has already been discusses and thrown out, but then we could move Al to PF, where he could REALLY shine, and give Marvin his chance to prove his worth.

PG:Bibby, Law
SG:Joe Johnson,Bogans, West
SF:Marvin Williams,Childress,Richardson
PF:Horford,Cook, Kwame Brown
C:Okafor,Pachulia,Jones
what do you think about that lineup?

Hawks · Post #2 » by **Hawks** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:16 am

I thought about that sign and trade. I wouldn't have a problem if it did happen. As for trading Speedy for those two. I have no problems with that trade either if Speedy proves he can stay healthy. A healthy Speedy on this team means no playing time for Law.

HoopsGuru25 · Post #3 » by **HoopsGuru25** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:16 am

Speey will have much more value as an expiring than as a player(regardless of if he is healthy) when people are trying to clear capspace in 2010. We just went through the two worst years of his contract...we might as well keep him now.

stayinschool33 · Post #4 » by **stayinschool33** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:23 am

I would rather win now, so the question is, does he make the team better? and the 2 players we get are expiring players THIS year, so why not?

HoopsGuru25 · Post #5 » by **HoopsGuru25** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:42 am

You really think there is a team dumb enough to give up an expiring for a player who has played like 30 games in the last 2 years?

My point I was making about Speedy is that he is expiring in the year where ALOT of teams are going to try to move caproom. I predict that there will be alot of Baron Davis and Tyson Chandler like salary dumps in 2010 in order to have caproom for Lebron/Wade/Bosh and Speedy's contract will be an asset then.

stayinschool33 · Post #6 » by **stayinschool33** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:48 am

you really think speedy will actually make it to next year?

jagstang76 · Post #7 » by **jagstang76** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:02 am

Honestly, I'd rather we just hang onto Smoove. Horford is a more athletic version of Okafor (IMO) and has more potential to have a better all around game. Smoove brings a different dynamic in that he produces more numbers than Okafor in an explosive fashion. He's a game-changer pure and simple, and those types are what fans love to see and help you win games. Josh is just coming into his own as we saw in the playoffs. He's only going to get better from everything I can see. I don't know how people can compare him to today's Kirilenko because Josh has far more drive than he ever has.

I'd love to get some solid backups like Bogans to bolster the roster. If Speedy does come back strong, that is a very tempting prospect. I can't help but think it might be beneficial to keep him though should he get back to true form. Bibby could be dealt at the deadline for a solid contributor if he's effective and Law is playing well.

How about this deal:
Bibby and Zaza to SEA for Ridnour, Wilcox, and Marshall

Works on the checker, SEA gets a ton of money to spend next offseason without losing much in terms of talent, and we strengthen our bench big time without having to take on much additional salary. The only question I can see is how well does Ridnour fill Bibby's shoes, but I think that's a wash. Also, he has two years left on his deal which only amounts to a MLE-type deal. We aren't committed to him either, so Law gets PT to develop.

JoshB914 · Post #8 » by **JoshB914** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:02 am

If Speedy somehow gets healthy again, he should be our starting PG. He is a far better fit for this team than Bibby. He's a solid defender, and can penetrate and distribute the ball.

The problem is he's not going to be healthy again. And even if he does make it back you would imagine he will have lost a step, which would kill his game.

CWell · Post #9 » by **CWell** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:07 am

No way Speedy makes it through 20 games even if he does make it through summer league.And no way should we make him our starting PG.That's not smart because it'll just be a matter of time before he's hurt a again.U try to turn an injury prone backup into a starter and u get a guy that's hurt more than he was before,which is what we have here.

JoshB914 · Post #10 » by **JoshB914** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 3:09 am

CWell's last sentence in his post describes the Speedy signing perfectly. We took a guy that had been banged up his entire career and been most effective as a backup, and then we try to make him our starting PG while he plays through all kinds of injuries.

stayinschool33 · Post #11 » by **stayinschool33** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 4:18 am

[quote="jagstang76"]Honestly, I'd rather we just hang onto Smoove. Horford is a more athletic version of Okafor (IMO) and has more potential to have a better all around game. Smoove brings a different dynamic in that he produces more numbers than Okafor in an explosive fashion. He's a game-changer pure and simple, and those types are what fans love to see and help you win games. Josh is just coming into his own as we saw in the playoffs. He's only going to get better from everything I can see. I don't know how people can compare him to today's Kirilenko because Josh has far more drive than he ever has.

I like smooth as well, but i just think okafor will make horford better than josh. He is a natural center, and would allow al to play pf, where both he and josh should be playing. Josh is a SUPER athlete, with great weakside blocking instincts. But his basketball skills are limited, and I do not know if he has a true skillset that will allow us to become much better. But Okafor and Horford make for a great frontcourt, and should allow us to have an identity as a team. I think Josh is better overall, but I just dont know what to do with him. But I will welcome him back if the alternative is nothing in return.

JoshB914 · Post #12 » by **JoshB914** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 4:40 am

Okafor is a natural center?

killbuckner · Post #13 » by **killbuckner** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 11:21 am

Speedy is untradeable. If he has to retire due to his injuries then he will come completely off of the Hawks cap. If he gets traded and has to retire then his new team doesn't get any cap relief at all.

CWell · Post #14 » by **CWell** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 1:11 pm

stayinschool33 wrote:
jagstang76 wrote:Honestly, I'd rather we just hang onto Smoove. Horford is a more athletic version of Okafor (IMO) and has more potential to have a better all around game. Smoove brings a different dynamic in that he produces more numbers than Okafor in an explosive fashion. He's a game-changer pure and simple, and those types are what fans love to see and help you win games. Josh is just coming into his own as we saw in the playoffs. He's only going to get better from everything I can see. I don't know how people can compare him to today's Kirilenko because Josh has far more drive than he ever has.

I like smooth as well, but i just think okafor will make horford better than josh. He is a natural center, and would allow al to play pf, where both he and josh should be playing. Josh is a SUPER athlete, with great weakside blocking instincts. But his basketball skills are limited, and I do not know if he has a true skillset that will allow us to become much better. But Okafor and Horford make for a great frontcourt, and should allow us to have an identity as a team. I think Josh is better overall, but I just dont know what to do with him. But I will welcome him back if the alternative is nothing in return.

um Okafor is a PF playing out of position also.Not even close to a "natural center"

evildallas · Post #15 » by **evildallas** » Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:03 pm

No interest in Okafor. His contract demands are the same range as Josh and feel Josh is a lot more likely to actually earn that salary over the course of his contract than Okafor. I think he has similarities with Josh in that he can play 2 positions (not the same positions mind you) but isn't a traditional fit for either. Physically he isn't perfect for one but he's played better there (that's the C position) and while you might say physically he'd be the other position (PF in his case, his skill set makes it less than optimal there).

I agree with killbuckner, Speedy can't prove he's healthy enough to be traded. If he looks good in the summer the concern will be how many games can he play before he breaks down. It's not an if situation it is a when situation. The rules on cap relief are fairly clear. Possibly the only situation where he could be traded is if we took a worse contract back (think Knicks) and even then they'd want it to be someone like Jerome James or Jared Jeffries. Frankly, I'd rather stick with Speedy and hope he retires than add a piece like that.