Sharing Seattle's team history - yay or nay?

[Tony Plow]

Outside perspective. OKC should leave the history behind, have a fresh start and help everyone move on. Besides it makes everything they accomplish in the future mean that much more, and they won't have to spend years catching up to all the green and yellow in the rafters.

On the 'rude thing', I'm pretty sure Cleveland was 'rude', Baltimore when they lost the Colts too. Really in the modern era these are the only two teams that can really compare to what the Sonics went through. The only reason they didn't do more, was because unlike Seattle they had no legal footing to put up any fight. But you can be damn sure if they had, they would have.

edit: Wow completely forgot about Houston, yeah that wasn't pleasant either.

Seattle had no case. They would have lost the suit as Bennett did everything possible to build a new arena. He knew it would not be a good investment to build it himself, so, he chose against it. What he had in mind is selling the team for a profit to local investors had he gotten a new arena. SImple case of speculation. As it turned out, he honored his time agreement (I doubt his agreeing to give it a year for a new arena would not have legal standing. You can do what you wish once you buy a business) then moved.

[McG]

Seattle had no case. They would have lost the suit as Bennett did everything possible to build a new arena. He knew it would not be a good investment to build it himself, so, he chose against it. What he had in mind is selling the team for a profit to local investors had he gotten a new arena. SImple case of speculation. As it turned out, he honored his time agreement (I doubt his agreeing to give it a year for a new arena would not have legal standing. You can do what you wish once you buy a business) then moved.

I don't mean to beat a dead horse but let's at least analyze the facts. Bennett didn't so much propose an arena as the idea of wanting $500 million in public funding. All he presented to the state government was an artistic rendition. He didn't even go so far as to obtain on option to buy on the site he proposed to build the 'arena.' I fully understand why Seattle fans are upset about this issue, and the fact is that Judge Pechman could reasonably go either way on the Schultz case.

[Dtown84]

Outside perspective. OKC should leave the history behind, have a fresh start and help everyone move on. Besides it makes everything they accomplish in the future mean that much more, and they won't have to spend years catching up to all the green and yellow in the rafters.

On the 'rude thing', I'm pretty sure Cleveland was 'rude', Baltimore when they lost the Colts too. Really in the modern era these are the only two teams that can really compare to what the Sonics went through. The only reason they didn't do more, was because unlike Seattle they had no legal footing to put up any fight. But you can be damn sure if they had, they would have.

edit: Wow completely forgot about Houston, yeah that wasn't pleasant either.

Seattle had no case. They would have lost the suit as Bennett did everything possible to build a new arena. He knew it would not be a good investment to build it himself, so, he chose against it. What he had in mind is selling the team for a profit to local investors had he gotten a new arena. SImple case of speculation. As it turned out, he honored his time agreement (I doubt his agreeing to give it a year for a new arena would not have legal standing. You can do what you wish once you buy a business) then moved.

I didn't say Seattle had a winning case, just that they had a case. Which was more than Cleveland, Houston, or Baltimore ever had. If you had given those fans the chance to make it as hard on the owners as possible they would have. So it's hardly a matter of Seattle being especially rude.

[Farm Raid]

I am aware of that. I am only saying that I am tired of this Kumbayah (sp) attitude. Those people were VERY rude to him, so, as far as I am concerned, Seattle can kiss my (insert whatever).

Wait a minute. I think you need to back up the truck a bit here. "Rude" started happening when the people of Seattle found out that Bennett was planning on taking their basketball team away from them. What the hell kind of reaction did you expect them to have? If someone told me that one of my teams, one of the four reasons I watch professional sports, was going to get ripped away from me on some rich bastard's whim, I wouldn't be taking it lying down, I assure you. And I suspect if someone buys the team away from Bennett and pulls it out of Oklahoma City after a decade or so, you won't be interested in being polite to the man who's taking your team from you.

I think he's shown is colors enough on this board to not dignify him with a question of any kind. And I couldn't give a **** about Seattle. Tony Plow just isn't very grounded- in his next post he insinuates it's stretch to call Seattle fans "people". I mean, are you kidding? He's showing exactly the type of partisanship he's demonzing the Sonics fans of having, but without the 40 years of history behind their reasoning. It's best to ignore him if you like intelligent conversation.

[DEEP3CL]

Here's another question for everyone.

If the history for the Sonics should stay in Seattle, should the LA Lakers return any records or titles back the the Timberwolves, or that matter any team that has moved to another city return their records back to the city where they started. This starts to get complicated.

Our records don't come from the Minnesota Timberwolves, obviously your too young to know that the Lakers only moved from Minnesota to Los Angeles after the 59-60 season. Times were different then so the city wasn't in an up roar like the city of Seattle is over this situation. While at the same time many franchises have moved.

The Rockets originally started in San Diego,Ca but move to Houston in 1967, the Clippers moved from Baltimore to San Diego in the 70's, the Warriors moved from Philadelphia to San Francisco in the 60's.

So history is still with those teams and where they came from but so much time has come between them since they moved. We've had the Lakers here in Los Angeles for 60 years now. It wasn't until 2002 that the franchise even hung a banner to recognize the accomplishments from the Minnesota days. But our case along with the other teams I mentioned is entirely different than your franchise.

The the first difference being those teams KEPT the team name and didn't have to change it. So that's the only reason the history moves with the franchise. In your teams case, your fans or city had nothing to do with the Sonics winning the title in 79 or the division titles they won. It's nothing complicated about it. Your owner chose to take the team away from Seattle, was given permission to and had Oklahoma City in mind all alone from the day he bought the team.

But I'm not opposed to having OKC hang a banner recognizing the title, but as far as division title banners no it would be in poor taste if that was done.

History will always link the two cities and teams but the wound is still too fresh for you guys to want what belongs to Seattle.

[GOBlazers]

I believe the settlement reached meant that OKC keeps the Sonic history permanently, unless Seattle gets a new team within 5 years. I don't think Seattle will get a team that soon, so the history is yours. I don't think, championship banners should be hung anytime soon though, because they mean nothing to OKC fans, and would only enrage Seattle fans. Best to start fresh with a new history IMO

[gei]

Personally I think this idea is ludicrous and makes absolutely no sense. Our team history started the day that the former Sonics were released to move to Oklahoma City. This upcoming season will be our first season, and any championships we may win in the future will start with OKC's first championship.

It would feel entirely wrong to see a 1979 championship banner hanging in the rafters at the Ford Center. The people of OKC and the fans had no part in that, and it will have nothing to do with the current team.

Oklahoma City will have its own history soon enough, we absolutely do not need to steal another team's history and claim it as our own...

Do you honestly think the team will last in OKC long enough to actually build any history? let alone a championship...

[BlazertheGreek]

I am aware of that. I am only saying that I am tired of this Kumbayah (sp) attitude. Those people were VERY rude to him, so, as far as I am concerned, Seattle can kiss my (insert whatever).

Wait a minute. I think you need to back up the truck a bit here. "Rude" started happening when the people of Seattle found out that Bennett was planning on taking their basketball team away from them. What the hell kind of reaction did you expect them to have? If someone told me that one of my teams, one of the four reasons I watch professional sports, was going to get ripped away from me on some rich bastard's whim, I wouldn't be taking it lying down, I assure you. And I suspect if someone buys the team away from Bennett and pulls it out of Oklahoma City after a decade or so, you won't be interested in being polite to the man who's taking your team from you.

I have been in cities (or broadcast areas) when teams moved, and NOT ONE of the cities displayed the hostility the people (if you must call them that) of Seattle did. Maybe they were a bit upset. However, they displayed tact and professionalism. I am also aware of WHEN the rudeness started since I did not climb out from under a rock. I stand by my comments.

BTW. As the son of a large business founder, and a business owner myself, I understand these things. Granted. I may be disappointed, but FAR from rude about it. I would simply say "too bad. Now let's move on." Good advise.

Nobody is impressed that you are the son of a large business founder or a business owner! And nobody cares..
The Seattle fans have every right to be pissed. Clay Bennett said he was going to keep the team in Seattle when he showed interest in buying it. Once he bought the team, he pulled the rug from under the Seattle fans, to me, thats Bull****. If Clay hadn't misled the fans, then maybe it wouldn't have been as big of deal as it is...hell if he had been honest from the start, he probably wouldn't have gotten the team in the first place.

This post isn't a knock on the OKC fans at all.

[Heat3]

Will OKC fans/residents sport Shawn Kemp jersey's and wax poetically about the Reign Man? Will they resent MJ for getting in the way of their team winning a championship? Sounds kind of silly. One history per team. OKC should start anew and leave the Sonics' alone.

Do the Ravens share a history with the Browns? What's funny is those fans still hate the Colts but have no problem stealing from Cleveland lol

[wizkid27]

Heat3, I definitely agree with you. I think that you will probably find that most OKC fans feel badly about the situation with Seattle and that Seattle doesn't have a team anymore. While we're greatful for the talented players we're inheriting (as opposed to an expansion draft), it is hard to rob from another family.

I, personally, would feel quite akward if they honored Shawn Kemp, Gary Payton, Detlef Schrempf, etc. at an OKC game. The fans, and really the team has no connection to those guys, titles, wins, what have you.

I'm very happy to have bball in this city, very sorry that it is at the expense of anyone, but I'm going to enjoy the heck out of the NEW OKC team.

[oksportsguy]

For the most part I think this is all just legal wrangling and trying to motivate Seattle into getting something done(public as well as private).

IMO, this is a problem that sports franchises have had in Seattle, they always wait till the last minute or try to settle disputes in court. OKC doesn't want the Sonics history, as a matter of fact in a few years no one in OKC will even think about where the team came from.

Hopefully, Seattle and Washington will come together and get this worked out so that their 41 year history will not become a footnote to the rest of basketball, that would be a shame.

[McG]

I, personally, would feel quite akward if they honored Shawn Kemp, Gary Payton, Detlef Schrempf, etc. at an OKC game.

I guarantee you that NOT ONE of the players mentioned above would want to be honored in OKC. Kemp and Payton were outspoken about this before the move.

[wizkid27]

I agree... plus if they did try to honor them in OKC, I could definitely see at least someone, if not all, making a point of not being there to make OKC look bad (not that I'd blame them).

[Joe Jackson]

I, personally, would feel quite akward if they honored Shawn Kemp, Gary Payton, Detlef Schrempf, etc. at an OKC game.

I guarantee you that NOT ONE of the players mentioned above would want to be honored in OKC. Kemp and Payton were outspoken about this before the move.

How about Schrempf?
He's from Germany and he would probably be real enthused about the Wild West connotations.

[lou4gehrig]

IMO, this is a problem that sports franchises have had in Seattle, they always wait till the last minute or try to settle disputes in court. OKC doesn't want the Sonics history, as a matter of fact in a few years no one in OKC will even think about where the team came from.

Hopefully, Seattle and Washington will come together and get this worked out so that their 41 year history will not become a footnote to the rest of basketball, that would be a shame.

"This is a problem that sports franchises have had in Seattle?" Are you kidding? Spoken like a true diehard from a state that's never had a professional sports team...well say for the Arena league.

In a few months, Sonics fans won't care where the team went. Sort of like most of the players like Durant who'll be heading elsewhere to live and play.

[Joe Jackson]

IMO, this is a problem that sports franchises have had in Seattle, they always wait till the last minute or try to settle disputes in court. OKC doesn't want the Sonics history, as a matter of fact in a few years no one in OKC will even think about where the team came from.

Hopefully, Seattle and Washington will come together and get this worked out so that their 41 year history will not become a footnote to the rest of basketball, that would be a shame.

"This is a problem that sports franchises have had in Seattle?" Are you kidding? Spoken like a true diehard from a state that's never had a professional sports team...well say for the Arena league.

In a few months, Sonics fans won't care where the team went. Sort of like most of the players like Durant who'll be heading elsewhere to live and play.

Its too bad some Seattle fans and politicians can't accept the fact that they failed to properly support their team and now the team is gone. So they insist on slinking around, running their mouths and sniping at other people who are moving forward in the world.
They would be better served trying to learn how they went so woefully wrong and try to avoid meeting the same fate with the Mariners, which will be the next team pulling out of that major league sports dead-end. You might be able to hang on to the Seahawks if the stadium doesn't fall in from neglect and kill half of the fans.

In the mean time it will be fun to be here watching Westbrook, Durant, Green and the rest of the team develop into their full potential with some real major league support, which will be a new experience for them here in OKC.

[wizkid27]

^^ No reason to go there... we have a team, and we're happy, let's just leave it at that.

[McG]

They would be better served trying to learn how they went so woefully wrong and try to avoid meeting the same fate with the Mariners, which will be the next team pulling out of that major league sports dead-end. You might be able to hang on to the Seahawks if the stadium doesn't fall in from neglect and kill half of the fans.

Great points JJ. Considering the Mariners have averaged a mere 2.5 to 3.5 million fans each year since the new stadium opened they definitely seem to be on their way out the door. And to think that the Seahawks will continue to have the greatest home field advantage in the NFL is just absurd. I mean their season tickets only sold out in 10 minutes this season. If you're a real NFL town you have to sell out in at least 7.5 minutes, maybe 8 at the most. I'm with JJ, they'll both be gone by the end of 2008.

[ljp24]

Your city lost your team, boo hoo. Hey lets talk about MLB and NFL!!

No reason to come clicking over here. Just stick to the Sonics (forum).

[McG]

Your city lost your team, boo hoo. Hey lets talk about MLB and NFL!!

No reason to come clicking over here. Just stick to the Sonics (forum).

Well put LJ! This is a place to talk OKC basketball ONLY. Now if only JJ could get the message and stop bringing in trivial information to the conversation!