Monta Ellis re-signed by GS

[bedjaw]

Monta Ellis has holes in his game as well (please see the 23% 3pt shooting percentage), yet he warrants a deal @ 11/year? He's an undersized 2g, who has to prove he can handle the point, with the ultimate goal of winning (not being the highest scoring PG in the league)...Iguodala has to show he can handle the 2g spot, which isn't as big a transition given he played mostly on the perimeter last season...similar scenarios.

It's amazing to me the limited view we tend to have of the Sixers players when compared to others, and more specifically the matchup issues the Sixers as a team faced in the playoffs. The increased depth/length inside and development of Thad should make a huge difference for the Sixers this season, and would have created a whole different story in the Detroit series when it came to how they matched up with Iguodala. He's not a perfect player, but in the grand scheme of the league, he's as valuable to a winning franchise as Ellis is. The key will be, can Ellis be more like Isaiah (winning PG that can score) than Iverson (scoring little guard) and/or can Iguodala improve his jumper as he ages (please see Michael Jordon's 3pt shooting percentages over time...Iguodala is not Jordan, but Jordan's outside shot improved drastically through his career...he was 26 the first time he shot over 30% from 3) and handle the 2g spot. We won't know that for either player until a few years into these contracts, but neither are a sure thing.

Well said

The problem is we all see Iggy play 82 games a year and can dissect his game. Most of us se guys like ME 3-4 times a year and also see him on ESPN. The ME signing is good news for the Sixers and us fans. The Market is set for both Iggy and LWill. I got a feeling th biggest surprise is going to be LWill for he might get more money than all of us expect.

[tk76]

The Market is set for both Iggy and LWill. I got a feeling th biggest surprise is going to be LWill for he might get more money than all of us expect.

It will be interesting to see if LWill gets valued more like Ellis of more like Gibson. Ellis's starting salary is 3X Gibson's.

[philly262]

I'll offer Iguodala 70-72 million dollars over 6 years, and that would be my final offer.

He won't find anything higher than that on the open market.

[Shav]

$72MM over 6 sounds about right to me.

[Philly_King]

1) That rookie started all 82 playoff games

82 playoff games? And we still didn't win a chip?
[/quote]
2) It does when that playoff series revealed what Andre Iguodala is and what he isn't. Iguodala needs to develop 2 things to justify being handed Monta Ellis's contract. He needs some SERIOUS handles and he needs a legitimate first step.

Without those, there's no way I pay him in the class of Ellis and Howard. I hope Ed's still talking to Houston about Tmac.[/quote]
And Monta needs 4 things to justify being handed a contract larger than Iggy:
1. Play defense
2. Learn to pass the ball
3. Grow a couple of inches so he's not an undersized SG.
4. Learn to shoot 3s

[ckchen]

It was. But after his playoff series, I am VERY uncomfortable giving him a contract starting at 11.5 MILL.

Please - it was his first real playoff series (I'm not counting when we made the playoffs in 2004 when he was a rookie) - plus he was the focal point of the offense. Just because someone had a bad series doesn't negate his entire season. A 6 yr/66 M contract is far from completely unreasonable when you think that they already offered him a 5 yr/57M deal already. That's actually less on a year to year comparison. So what's the big deal.

1) That rookie started all 82 playoff games
2) It does when that playoff series revealed what Andre Iguodala is and what he isn't. Iguodala needs to develop 2 things to justify being handed Monta Ellis's contract. He needs some SERIOUS handles and he needs a legitimate first step.

Without those, there's no way I pay him in the class of Ellis and Howard. I hope Ed's still talking to Houston about Tmac.

Starting all of the playoff games as a rookie, to me, doesn't mean much - this was in the Iverson era when Iverson was dominating the entire offense - Iguodala wasn't expected to carry the team in any way whatsoever, just be a complementary (primarily defensive) piece at the time.

Again no need to rehash the idea that almost every player has holes in his game mantra, other than to say that in reality, Ellis hasn't really done anothing to "deserve" the contract he's received either. Contract values aren't entirely based on someone's pure performance, but their contribution to the team, their potential, need, etc.

[The Guilty Party]

Kevin Martin got 5 years/$55MIL

Ellis got 6 years/$67MIL

I just can't justify in my head Andre Iguodala getting anything substantially more than those 2 players. He's good.... but he's not that good.

[76ciology]

Kevin Martin got 5 years/$55MIL

Ellis got 6 years/$67MIL

I just can't justify in my head Andre Iguodala getting anything substantially more than those 2 players. He's good.... but he's not that good.

agree..

[Sixerscan]

2) It does when that playoff series revealed what Andre Iguodala is and what he isn't. Iguodala needs to develop 2 things to justify being handed Monta Ellis's contract. He needs some SERIOUS handles and he needs a legitimate first step.

Because Ellis wasn't freaking terrible in the playoffs in 06/07?

[dbodner]

Iguodala is not a better jump shooter than Ellis. He may have a higher 3pt fg%, but I'd much rather have a guy who knows his limitations. A guy taking 3.7 attempts per game while hitting 32% of them does much more damage than a guy who attempts one every other game and hits 23% of them. Ellis is a significantly superior mid range jump shooter, IMO.

[philly262]

Well defense and passing ability is better than both, but they're better scorers.

And scoring ability means more money in the NBA.

[The Sixer Fixer]

Iguodala is not a better jump shooter than Ellis. He may have a higher 3pt fg%, but I'd much rather have a guy who knows his limitations. A guy taking 3.7 attempts per game while hitting 32% of them does much more damage than a guy who attempts one every other game and hits 23% of them. Ellis is a significantly superior mid range jump shooter, IMO.

This is 100% correct. 3 pt %'s don;t mean crap when someone shoots a low % but hardly ever attempts them. As automatic as he is from 2, why would anyone care that he doesn't shoot 3's? Monta still can help spread the floor with his mid-range and quickness.

Ellis just came off a historic type season in term of FG% for a SG. I believe he was in the top 15 in the entire NBA in FG%. He's still only 22 and has improved at an incredible rate in just 3 years in the league (esp considering he came straight from H.S.). His mid-range shot is about as automatic as any other player in the league. He hasn't extended his range to 3 yet, but considering how good he is from 2 pt range, it's not like he doens't have the potential to be a good 3's guy in a few years (similar to Rip). Monta has one of the quickest first steps in the league and is an elite guard at getting to and finishing at the rim. He a fairly good passer, but like Lou he still thinks shoot first. His rebound rate is pretty good considering his size.

Anyone who compares Andre to Monta and says they are on the same level offensively is just proving that they don't watch enough of the NBA. They are probably just people who look at a PPG stat and think that tells them all they need to know. These are 2 players who have very differnt strengths. They are both versatile, but it different ways. Andre is the better defender, no question. Monta is the better all around offensive player, no question. Do they deserve to paid abotu the same...I would say yes. Fact of the NBA is the guys who usually get paid better are the one who can dominate offensively (Andre does a little of both, so he should get paid on a Monta level).

[bedjaw]

The reality is ME has never been asked to do anything other than score. The following article is a great explanation of his strength and weaknesses. A telling statement is how Nelly reduced MEs minutes during their last playoff run. The truth is much more has been asked of AI2 than ME. AI2 has proven he can be a leader of a team both on and off the court. ME has not proven anything other than he can score and he will now be asked to make the leap that AI2 made 2 seasons ago. In ME defense he has neither been asked nor required to do anything other than what he has been doing, for he was surrounded by a core of verteran players. Nobody is bashing ME in fact it is undeniable that he is a major talent. But he is neither as versatile nor as important to his team as AI2 has been. History has shown that it is very hard to build your team around undersize shooting guards, so unless he becomes an elite PG he'll be nothing more than a highlight real waiting to happen.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/07/25/SPF311UUL7.DTL

[freshie2]

Nice post.

Ellis is certainly a better scorer, but played in an offense loaded with offensive talent, a wide open system, and had very limited roles (score). Iguodala's value is not in being a #1/25ppg scorer, but in his versatility while scoring in the high teens. Both still need to improve their outside shot, but Ellis is taking on a whole new role as a PG. Again, let's see how he handles this role. Nellie knows that undersized scorers don't lead teams to championships, which is why they new Ellis had to move to the point this season. It will be an interesting season for both players.