I'm going to quote two people who are much more knowledgable on the Vince Carter situation and I really hope you people with misconceptions about Carter read it. Harry Palmer wrote:For the kazillionth time:
Vince Carter did NOT admit to dogging it to get traded, or during that period at all.
When asked if he had always given it his all, he replied that, before the injuries...in years past...he hadn't realized how much work it took, because things came so easily to him, and that since the injuries he had had to work a lot harder.
In other words, he 'admitted' to exactly the opposite of the what the paranoiacs keep throwing out there, that in fact, the period when he, in retrospect, felt he could have worked harder was the earlier years, the years when he was the league's darling, and because the game had come o easily to him, he hadn't realized how much more he could have been doing, but that since then...ie, specifically during the period in question...he had worked much harder.
Here is the exact quote in response to the question about whether he had always worked his hardest, with the time-related comments in bold:
“In years past, no,” said Carter... “I was fortunate to have the talent … you get spoiled when you’re able to do a lot of things. You see that you don’t have to work at it. Now, with the all the injuries, I have to work harder. I’m a little hungrier."
It's crystal clear he was referring to the period BEFORE his injuries, years before the alleged 'dogging' it period, and yet people keep trying to use this in the exact opposite context, and it seems to me it must be done willfully.
He specifically did NOT admit to dogging it to get traded. He specifically did NOT admit to effort being the cause for his relatively poor play in the later years. He specifically said the exact opposite, that his effort was, in retrospect, an issue when he was younger and everything came so easily, but that since then he had had to work harder and be 'hungrier'.
I can't believe the duration of this completely inverse misunderstanding, but I know it is primarily fueled by bitter Raps fans who absolutely need to believe the opposite of the truth here.
All that said, I agree with those who have said Carter's off-season/off-court effort was the main issue. On court, I've always felt that his effort was actually a non-issue, but his offseason effort has always been, with the possible exception of after his rookie season and maybe in the past year or so, an major issue. Had he put the work into his body that others do, he could have been something incredible, and arguably he wouldn't have had the injury issues that eroded his natural talent.
tsherkin wrote:Just to touch on Harry Palmer's post...
Vince's last season as a Raptor was Sam Mitchell's first, and he was intent on setting a tone in his locker room for his team. Super hard work, lots of effort, etc. Vince didn't get plays run for him and when he showed up with his traditional token defensive effort, Mitchell started benching him in fourth quarters and writing him out of the offense.
His statistical nose-dive is more a result of butting heads with the n00b coach than any actual moments of active sabotage or really "dogging it." It's a given that he mailed it in at some point in the season but that's not something for which you can really hammer him; he was getting something like 8 fewer minutes per-game than his career average and only 15 shots a game (about 5 under his career average) AND he wasn't shooting well because the looks he was getting were predominantly jumpers (77% of his attempts were jumpers) and it wasn't by his own design for a change.
To whit, even in a bad year like this past season, Vince's jumper percentage is only about 67%, so that was definitely an anomalous season. He also shot about 69% from the line, which didn't help.
So yeah, he looked like corn-filled poop but it wasn't 100% his fault, or realistically even 50% his fault.
Harry Palmer wrote:To get into it more...
I personally spoke with both Doug Smith of the Toronto Star and Dave D'Alessandro of the NJ Star-Ledger, the 2 reporters who broke the story of Carter's offer to come off the bench, and both confirmed it, and also confirmed that the story didn't come from Carter's camp (though he confirmed it when asked) but from Sam Mitchell, who approved of the idea. I'll give a detailed explanation of how things broke down.
Basically what happened was Babcock had taken over with a sort of rigid idealistic view on how things should go, and wanted to bring in a new, sort of old-fashioned hard-line, team-first, rah-rah attitude, and his acquisition of Rafer Alston (of all people) was sort of his poster child for the idea. Now Babs unfortunately brought this attitude into the middle of an already developing storm wherein Carter had been promised inclusion into the GM search, only to have that promise broken, and to find out it had been broken via the press. Forgetting whether or not a franchise player should have input (It's pretty much the norm, but either way) the fact was Carter had been assured of same, and Peddie had then decided to forget that promise and bring in Babcock with Carter finding out after it was a done deal. The 'Carter's mom-parking space' thing was Peddie's release to bring public opinion around to his side on the issue, which was another source of tension.
So into this, Babs walks in and wants to establish a tone, and once Carter's trade demand floated, he decided to use that to set the tone for the team...no one's bigger than the team, everyone earns their spot, etc. etc.
Sam, who originally saw Carter as the main attraction for taking the Toronto job, was sort of caught in the middle, in that Babs was taking a hard line, and also rubber-stamping Sam's (ultimately naive) idea for a new-style of team, wherein everyone gets about the same shots, up and down, T-E-A-M, etc, but on the other hand he was pushing hard for Alston to be the new face of the team, and meanwhile Alston's ego was exploding out of proportion to his talent.
So Carter retracts the trade request, shows up to camp saying all the right things, doesn't even complain about the new we're-all-equal thing that would drive most franchise players to their nearest press conference, and actually tries to buy in, though privately he isn't happy. Alston increasingly takes over the team's flow on the court, pointedly ignores Carter in favor of his own shot or secondary players, and starts spouting off in the media about this now being his team, and making barely veiled shots at Carter, who never responds, and never complains.
Meanwhile, the fans have bought into Peddie's spin, and Alston is (seriously, as unbelievable as it is in retrospect) the fan favorite, while Carter is the villain, the complete inverse of what's happening in the locker room, where Alston's ego and antics are increasingly driving his coaches and teammates batty. Sam tries several times to settle Alston down, Alston repeatedly goes to Babcock to complain, and Babcock supports Alston and tells Sam that Rafer represents the new team attitude. This comes to a head a couple times with Rafer having public meltdowns, storming out of practice, threatening to quit, and consistently portraying himself as the victim while being the only one to publicly point fingers, usually Carter's way, though by all accounts Carter's role is more symbolic, as he has stayed out of the arguments and conflicts off-court. He's off to a somewhat slow start, but given his pt down by almost a third, his shots way down, his offensive role being a complete mystery to him and/or anyone, and the fact that his non-existent off-season regime often leads to slow starts, he's well within a normal range, and was actually putting in more effort on defense and other areas than is his custom.
Finally, Carter goes to Sam and basically says 'let's deal with the reality: Rafer won't play with me, we don't mesh, and it's hurting the team. I'm not getting the shots I need to either get into my groove or increase my trade value, and Rafer feels threatened by my presence on the court, so why don't we let him be The Man, I'll come off the bench where I can adopt my normal role of go-to guy, and everyone' happy.'
Sam agrees, and takes it to Babcock, but Babs declines, saying that the writing's on the wall, and that moving Carter is too important to the tone he's trying to establish, ie the players don't run the team, etc. Sam privately wonders why Alston seems to be the glaring exception to that 'tone', but concedes defeat, and tells Carter it's a no-go.
So by the time the trade comes, Carter is injured, knows the team has given up on him, and Sam is aware of the same facts, so it's not really much of a surprise that neither was exactly putting the peddle to the metal all the time, as both are somewhat confused and completely frustrated with the whole Babcock/Alston/tone thing, and Carter is also out of place in Sam's new 'everyone gets shots' thing.
That's the facts, that's what happened.
That Sam's new system didn't last too long past the trade, or that Alston's ego-trip lead to several implosions even after his self-created nemesis was gone, and that Babcock ultimately goes down as one of the worst GM's in NBA history despite his short run all seems to have been forgotten when the Carter/trade thing comes up, and almost no Raps fan ever acknowledges the fact that, as mentioned, Carter did the opposite of admitting to 'dogging it' to get a trade, that his time and shots were way down, and that his offer to come off the bench is exactly the opposite of what someone trying to force a trade with poor play or thinking only of himself would do.
Instead it's just 'yeah, we got screwed in the trade, but that's because Carter was dogging it to force a move, and he even admitted it!' etc. etc.
Perception > reality, I suppose.
