Best Summer Move: Artest?

itstheiryear · Post #1 » by **itstheiryear** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 1:33 am

I posted this on the Bucks board but wanted to see what some Rockets fans thought. Stock Lemon lists the Bucks getting Richard Jefferson as the best offseason NBA move, followed by Artest to the Rockets.

http://stocklemon.blogspot.com/2008/08/ ... moves.html

I tend to think Brand to Philly was bigger than both of these, but no doubt the Rockets and Bucks should be much improved. What do you think?

Alex_De_Large · Post #2 » by **Alex_De_Large** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 2:51 am

I think the Rockets did give less in comparison to the Bucks for Ron, Donte+low first pick < Yi. But both are great moves.
P76'S move is obviously the best in the summer, they bring Elton Brand and keep the same team.

Post #3 » by **TMU** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 3:51 am

On paper, the Artest trade is currently the best trade that has happened this off-season. But I agree, the best acquisition goes to the Clippers for signing Elton Brand.

HTown_TMac · Post #4 » by **HTown_TMac** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 4:57 am

T-Mac United wrote:On paper, the Artest trade is currently the best trade that has happened this off-season. But I agree, the best acquisition goes to the Clippers for signing Elton Brand.

Philly?

Post #5 » by **TMU** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 1:35 pm

HTown_TMac wrote:
T-Mac United wrote:On paper, the Artest trade is currently the best trade that has happened this off-season. But I agree, the best acquisition goes to the Clippers for signing Elton Brand.

Philly?

Yeah Sixers.

jove9 · Post #6 » by **jove9** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 2:36 pm

The best summer move so far was the Clippers getting Novak.

Western Finals for sure.

Post #7 » by **TMU** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 3:44 pm

jove9 wrote:The best summer move so far was the Clippers getting Novak.

Western Finals for sure.

Yeah, Baron and Camby should complement him nicely.

franchise73 · Post #8 » by **franchise73** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 4:11 pm

jove9 wrote:The best summer move so far was the Clippers getting Novak.

Western Finals for sure.

ANd they got Ridoff Brand just so he can get his usual number of shots. And they got him a good pg and forward in Davis and Camby. I just hope we dont face them in the Western Finals!!!

DraftBoy10 · Post #9 » by **DraftBoy10** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 4:13 pm

1. Novak
2. Brand.
3. Artest

Jefferson? The verdict is out in 3 years if they lost that trade or not, we'll see how Yi turns out. For a rookie, he was pretty good.

HTown_TMac · Post #10 » by **HTown_TMac** » Sun Aug 24, 2008 5:07 pm

T-Mac United wrote:
HTown_TMac wrote:
T-Mac United wrote:On paper, the Artest trade is currently the best trade that has happened this off-season. But I agree, the best acquisition goes to the Clippers for signing Elton Brand.

Philly?

Yeah Sixers.

I was just correcting you, you said Clippers

But

1. Brand
2. Artest
3. Jefferson

moofs · Post #11 » by **moofs** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 1:07 am

Whoa crap.
Marreese Speights is on a 6 year rookie contract.

Iggyemu · Post #12 » by **Iggyemu** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 3:19 am

I don't think Brand puts the Sixers over the top. I think Artest puts us over the top. Comparing a team with cap space to team without. Comparing a missing piece to a championship....to a missing piece for a legit playoff seed.

I am sorry..in no way shape or form is the Sixers signing Brand a better move than the Rockets trading scrubs for Artest.

moofs · Post #13 » by **moofs** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 4:56 pm

Agree with Iggy. It's much harder for a contender to add a big piece than for a rebuilding team to add one. All a rebuilder has to do is not sign too many bad contracts and wait for a big name free agent to show up within 3 years, but I don't currently see too much difference between the way the sixers are heading and the 2005-2006 Clippers. If Bogut keeps improving, the Bucks might be good (even though I've always thought RJ was kinda overrated).

A couple side notes:
- Hollinger's PER stat seems iffy, but we have 4 of the top 51 players from 2007-08 on our team now.
- Look right above Shaq lolllzzz - http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinge ... start%3d75

MaxRider · Post #14 » by **MaxRider** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:21 pm

best summer move so far is Clippers getting Camby for a 2nd round pick
i guess not able to keep Brand give them enough salary cap room to do that

PocketRockets · Post #15 » by **PocketRockets** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 6:45 pm

How do we know this doesn't put the Sixers "over the top"? What is "over the top"? We aren't guaranteed to win the championship...heck we aren't even guaranteed to make the playoffs. I think Elton Brand, if he can play 85-90% of what he did pre-injury, they are going to go to the 2nd round, at least. With Ron Artest, depending on the seeding, we might only make the 2nd round (The West is tough). I anticipate a steep learning curve with Artest, and when he does go AWOL halfway through the season, I think it will hurt our seeding. I see us going 1/2 if Artest doesn't repeat his "cultural" antics, and 4/5 maybe even 7/8, if he doesn't work out.

People say we would just "cut" him off and in theory that's all good, but for a team it's damaging to say the least. With T-mac's weak mental status, he might even give up b/c in his mind, T-mac only plays when he thinks he has a chance. What a professional.

Iggyemu · Post #16 » by **Iggyemu** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 7:29 pm

PocketRockets wrote:How do we know this doesn't put the Sixers "over the top"? What is "over the top"? We aren't guaranteed to win the championship...heck we aren't even guaranteed to make the playoffs. I think Elton Brand, if he can play 85-90% of what he did pre-injury, they are going to go to the 2nd round, at least. With Ron Artest, depending on the seeding, we might only make the 2nd round (The West is tough). I anticipate a steep learning curve with Artest, and when he does go AWOL halfway through the season, I think it will hurt our seeding. I see us going 1/2 if Artest doesn't repeat his "cultural" antics, and 4/5 maybe even 7/8, if he doesn't work out.

People say we would just "cut" him off and in theory that's all good, but for a team it's damaging to say the least. With T-mac's weak mental status, he might even give up b/c in his mind, T-mac only plays when he thinks he has a chance. What a professional.

This is a funny argument b/c you argue on positive 'what ifs' for the Sixers and negative 'what ifs' for the Rockets to try and prove a point. I don't think I'll even respond to that..but just think about your argument. Think about if everything went well for us and for the Sixers and think about who would end up further. Or if things went well for us and not for them...who would drop further.

Post #17 » by **TMU** » Mon Aug 25, 2008 9:22 pm

Iggyemu wrote:I don't think Brand puts the Sixers over the top. I think Artest puts us over the top. Comparing a team with cap space to team without. Comparing a missing piece to a championship....to a missing piece for a legit playoff seed.

I am sorry..in no way shape or form is the Sixers signing Brand a better move than the Rockets trading scrubs for Artest.

But that's not the comparison we're making here. I agree with you that signing Brand will not put the Sixers over the top. That team lacks experience and needs to acquire at least 2 solid players to contend at the championship level. However, based on the availability of the players on the trade block/free agency this offseason, Brand was arguably the best player.

Rome wasn't built in one day, but the Sixer did a terrific job this off-season. They have laid a strong foundation with Brand. Now, they need the right pieces to build around him.

moofs · Post #18 » by **moofs** » Wed Aug 27, 2008 2:28 am

I think they did ok with Brand, but also agree that they need to acquire 2+ solid players to be lower-tier contenders. Since Brand is 29, they have about a 3-4 year window with him (if he recovers from his injuries, which he should), but a 5 year contract (not too bad because he'll be expiring after 4 years if he drops off after 31-33) and not much cap space. It's possible, we've built our team up from Steve Francis and Juwan Howard in 4 years, but they've got a shallow window with a ceiling that doesn't look all that high. After this year, they may have a point guard situation if Miller leaves. ... You have to start somewhere, I guess. Too bad that "somewhere" includes a $11 million 8/8 guy who's at his peak and signed for 3 more years.

Strictly based on talent acquired for this year from what was available this year, yeah, they got the best guy out there. Past that it's hard to tell, but I don't like the short-sided window.