Is 08/09 another championship or fail season?

Al-Haqq · Post #1 » by **Al-Haqq** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 2:16 am

The Celtics had to win it all in 07/08 ... simply because we don't have time to get better as a unit every season. To their credit they did, despite some playoff scares. In retrospect it was such a great year and we as fans got so much success in every way. I mean how great was it to be following a team which was on pace to win 70 damn games!

The Big Three will all be 1yr older, so our window has closed a little more now. That being said, is this year another win it all or failure season?

My opinion is that this year HAS to be a championship. Anything else is a failure, even if they lose in the NBA Finals.

What are your thoughts?

Would you guys be happy with anything less than a championship after the stellar 07/08 season?

Dogen · Post #2 » by **Dogen** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 3:25 am

SonicYouth34 · Post #3 » by **SonicYouth34** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 6:54 am

Hmmm, I think if we don't win it'll be disappointing, but the season won't be a failure. We have a great young nucleus of Giddens, Walker, Powe, Pruitt, Davis, Rondo, Perk and O'Bryant so we really can grow for the future while still kickin' butt now.

GreenGrizz · Post #4 » by **GreenGrizz** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 10:33 am

We are more dangerous and formidable than ever. We don't have the same kind of pressure like last year. We just added much needed athleticism and youth.

Dave_From_NB · Post #5 » by **Dave_From_NB** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 12:28 pm

IMO the big three era is already a success. #17 was hung, and another championship would be gravy. There are 30 teams in the league, winning the championship is very difficult, and repeating even more so.

Yes, APG have aged a year, but the decline is not likely to be significant. Also, Rondo and Perk are likely to improve, offsetting any marginal decline in APG.

In spite of the loss of Posey, I believe our bench is stronger than at the same point last year (i.e. pre Cassell and Brown). House and Tony Allen are improved from where they were last year. POB is a huge upgrade for Pollard just due to health. Powe/Davis improved. Giddens/Walker added. Pruitt should provide a contribution. There will be additions to the bench (Miles, or a post trading deadline pickup).

My point of mentioning the change in starters and the bench, is that I don't believe the window closes this year, so it's not an all or nothing proposition. 08/09 and 09/10 with RA we'll contend, and I believe 10/11 with an RA contract-expiry retooling we'll still contend. 11/12 I just don't know as I expect the team will have been remade by then.

Seasonal failure 08/09 would be not making the Eastern championships.

Al-Haqq · Post #6 » by **Al-Haqq** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 1:08 pm

I just can't see how anyone can be happy if we lose in the ECF. It's not like we can say 'we're still young and getting better'. The Celtic's chances of winning a championship is much better between 07-09 than it is any time after 2009. Part of that is also due to the fact that young emerging teams, are just that ... young and emerging.

The Celtics were built to win now, and that's what they have to do, period.

I always said, as long as the big three win 1 ring, than Ainge's experiment worked.

But the Celtics need to keep winning because it'll be much harder to win a ring with a two stars in their mid-30's and one in his late-young 30's.

Post #7 » by **canman1971** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 1:15 pm

Anything less than a championship should be considered a failure. The Celtics do not settle for anything less. That is why they play. End of story.

EJay33 · Post #8 » by **EJay33** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 3:19 pm

Considering Danny and Wyc decided that this team was good enough to both win and develop youth at the same time, if it blows up in their face and they lose because they deviated from the plan that worked last year (filling out the roster with vets) - I'd say it's safe to say that anything short of a championship would be a disappointment.

Post #9 » by **ParticleMan** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 4:43 pm

I'd agree than anything less than a title will be disappointing. But let's face it, there are 3 or 4 other teams in the league who are saying the same thing. All of them have the potential. I think we are the best, but so much depends on injuries and occasionally even refs. It's just too much of a crapshoot. But it would be disappointing not to win a title. I actually thought this would be our year, not least year. For me, last year was gravy. But this year is when we SHOULD be favored.

Still, imo the Ainge/Doc era is already a success even if we don't win another title for a while.

Post #10 » by **Spin Move** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 6:41 pm

This is the year we have the best chance to win another, if we dont this year our odds get smaller the year after that and much smaller any time beyond that, we are a little lighter expieraince wise in our backups this year but that may not be true by the end of the season, Rondo, Powe, Baby, and(groans) TA all should be a little better, so if D miles or Giddens can provide the needed length in situations where its neeeded there is no reason we cant repeat, the lakers are the biggest threat but there are alot of injury prone players on that team and not enough basketballs to go around when they are healthy, it would be tough to play them in the finals again. If we win again Ray, Paul and KG are all surefire hall of famers if we doint there will be alot of debate about whether ray is HOF or not, some about paul (though I think the finals MVP seals it) KG is in if he retired today, but for him to be rememberd as a top 5 PF he needs at least 1 more ring.

So the big 3's effort will be there, and we have enough role players at the 1 4 and 5 spots, if backup wings can come through we shoulod have a very good chance to win again, there is a tommorow if we lose, we will likley have at least one more good chance, but it wont be as good as this one.

humblebum · Post #11 » by **humblebum** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 7:59 pm

The only teams that have a chance of the dethroning the Celtics are the Cavs, Lakers, and potentially the Sixers if they really get their game together. Honestly, if the C's stay healthy I really can't see them losing so in a way this is a moot point. But if I had to I'd say it would be a failure. The team is built to win championships and IMO they're set up to win a likely 2 more.

joneb · Post #12 » by **joneb** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 8:17 pm

The world is not solely defined by black and white. In real life, there are shades of gray. To say that not winning it all next year will qualify as a failure is ridiculous. If they were to make it to the finals, and play valiantly in seven games series, only to lose, one would be hard pressed to call that a failure. It's not an all-or-nothing thing. I'm mostly concerned with the effort and commitment rather than the results. And usually if you tend to the former, you're rewarded with the latter.

grantlongforpresident · Post #13 » by **grantlongforpresident** » Mon Sep 1, 2008 11:34 pm

Anything less than the ECF is a failure.

7seventynine9 · Post #14 » by **7seventynine9** » Tue Sep 2, 2008 3:43 am

This team is built to win championships now, so the season is a failure without one.

Mahoney_jr · Post #15 » by **Mahoney_jr** » Tue Sep 2, 2008 11:40 am

Spin Move wrote:This is the year we have the best chance to win another, if we dont this year our odds get smaller the year after that and much smaller any time beyond that...

I don't agree on that one. KG will earn significantly less next year and Scal will an expiring contract. We will have financial flexibility to add another reliable piece to our rotation via trade, MLE and LLE.

Al-Haqq · Post #16 » by **Al-Haqq** » Wed Sep 3, 2008 1:43 am

Mahoney_jr wrote:
Spin Move wrote:This is the year we have the best chance to win another, if we dont this year our odds get smaller the year after that and much smaller any time beyond that...

I don't agree on that one. KG will earn significantly less next year and Scal will an expiring contract. We will have financial flexibility to add another reliable piece to our rotation via trade, MLE and LLE.

I don't think a decent role player takes away from Ray and KG getting older. This season's chances are higher than next year's chances. No doubt about it. We need to win it again.

campybatman · Post #17 » by **campybatman** » Wed Sep 3, 2008 3:37 am

Al-Haqq wrote:My opinion is that this year HAS to be a championship. Anything else is a failure, even if they lose in the NBA Finals.

In my opinion, given the fact that you've a Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett and Ray Allen on your roster in their primes. There's no reason not to believe that a roster including these three All-Stars can't win at least two NBA championships from this season to the next one or two seasons. If the Lakers, lead by S. O'Neal and K. Bryant, can pull-off the rare feat of winning three consecutive NBA championships. Then I don't see why the Celtics don't have as good of a chance to win a second one in a row. They've a Hall Of Fame player in Garnett as the Lakers had one in Shaq. But, if the Celtics can't achieve the feat of winning a NBA championship in consecutive seasons like the Lakers of the early 2000s or the Bulls of the 90s or the Rockets of the mid 90s or the Pistons of the late 80s and early 90s and so forth. Then, yes I'll feel a sense of disappointment because it's tough to see why this team can't win it all at least for two years in a row when the important pieces are in place. If the coaching staff remains intact. Then I believe this point even more so.

What I'm not expecting is for the Celtics to be able to do what the Lakers of the 2000s (three straight is tough no matter who you are) and the Bulls of the 90s did. That could be too overwhelming of the odds. What they were able to accomplish was ridiculous in their dominance. This dominance not seen since the Celtics teams of the mid 50s, to 60s and 70s. I mean it was like the Celtics were constantly there competing for the championship.

Realistically, I see the Celtics as the Rockets capable of winning two straight. That is, of course, assuming that the team next season can stay reasonably healthy. Because they won't catch any breaks in the schedule so it's up to every player to avoid the injury bug so to speak. This is where I would be concern. That's asking a lot from veteran players and inexperienced players. You can't predict injures or entirely prevent them from happening. It'll be about how you're able to adjust to adversity that will help the Celtics next season.

Tricky Ricky · Post #18 » by **Tricky Ricky** » Wed Sep 3, 2008 1:11 pm

I wouldnt be able to live with a loss this past season simply because Ive never seen a championship and never thought I would, after getting to the finals seeing them lose wouldve ruined me, especially to LA. But this season I could live with a loss in the finals. Do I want to lose? Absolutly not but compared to last season I can finally breathe and have fun during the season simply because I can finally say my favorite team has won one, now lets win another!

Post #19 » by **ParticleMan** » Wed Sep 3, 2008 4:41 pm

I don't think our window is as short as the media seems to believe. KG and Paul are in their early 30's, they've had no major injuries, and they're in great shape. I think they can easily play at a high level until 35 or so. So we've got 3-4 more years. Ray in principle is the same, though he showed some signs of slowing down, but then picked it up again. So basically our window is probably the next 4 years. And then we'd have to see how Rondo + co. develop, if they can shoulder more of the load by then, our team could become more like the Pistons who have 5 quality starters even though none is MVP-caliber. That can win a title too. So we may have even longer than 4 years.

So I guess the bottom line is I'd be disappointed if we didn't win next year because I think we're in great position to do it, but I think we'll have just as good a shot for the next 3-4+ years. I wouldn't mind a Spurs-style championship-every-other-year run.

Athanacropolis · Post #20 » by **Athanacropolis** » Mon Sep 8, 2008 7:06 pm

SonicYouth34 wrote:Hmmm, I think if we don't win it'll be disappointing, but the season won't be a failure. We have a great young nucleus of Giddens, Walker, Powe, Pruitt, Davis, Rondo, Perk and O'Bryant so we really can grow for the future while still kickin' butt now.

Yeah, that's a really good way of looking at it.

Any season when a team as talented as this doesn't win the championship is disappointing, but I would only use the word "failure," if, say, they get bounced in the first round or something like that.

If the Celtics don't win it all, the 08/09 season is ....