Official Game Thread: Nets 95 Wizards 85 Final (Game 1)

[Serpo]

Look the problem with Swift and Williams is they both have the tendency to have major brainfarts at the defensive end . I rather have a reliable boring guy then a flashy inconsistent one.

[rag-time4]

Look the problem with Swift and Williams is they both have the tendency to have major brainfarts at the defensive end . I rather have a reliable boring guy then a flashy inconsistent one.

The problem is that Boone has never been reliable. He got killed by Etan Thomas (!!) repeatedly during the Wiz game. Far too often he shows little to no effort on help defense. Opening night he actually blocked a couple shots, which was great to see and really helped the team. But he's not consistent with it. He has far too many plays like this one where Boone rotates but makes no effort at all to stop the opponent from scoring...

Williams got picked on that play by his teammate and didn't get back quick enough... but he covered lots of ground and made an aggressive attempt to stop Swift, showing great effort. Boone moved over a couple feet then got out of the way...

If you want someone reliable and consistent then Boone certainly isn't your man because he can't be counted on to really give great effort on defense on a consistent basis...

And then there's the matter of Boone's offense, which is nonexistant....

[Serpo]

Swift and Williams are too undersized and skinny to play Center against a lot of teams , even Boone is.

Thomas just outmuscled Boone and Boone unlike Lopez didn't have a size advantage either.

And btw neither Boone , Williams or Swift are great offensive players . At least Boone knows it and isn't hoisting up questionable shots . Thats especially a knock on Swift.

Stromile taking his mid-range jumpers is like Hassel taking that baseline jumper . They can hit that shot but i don't ever wanna see them take it .

[EFF]

yeah boone's a softy. even if he went up to block it im pretty sure stro wouldve shoved it in his mouth anyway. maybe that's why he didn't try.

The point of drafting anybody is to take their potential which is often messy and raw, and refine him into an consistently effective and smart basketball player. You have to let him play. From what i hear sean is not stupid so given time, he can pick up his game, but he can't do that from the bench. I think Frank overreacts to mistakes rookies make in practice and in games so he too easily disqualifies them from the rotation.

Boone was just a band aid until someone like Brook got here. With a legit big man, let the athletic guys run and complement. And yeah, Sean is a 4 not a 5 obviosuly so i'd like to see a sean/stro-lopez frontcourt. I don't hate boone. I just think we're past this guy now and we need to move forward.

[MrDollarBills]

@ this nonsense

Swift and Williams have shown little reason why they should get any minutes on this team -period-, especially over Josh Boone who has proven he can come in and be a productive player on the glass and on defense.

Just stop it. I would play Boone, Anderson, and Najera before either one of them.

And Lopez is the truth. Finally we have a legit center and people want to take pot shots at him.

[vincecarter4pres]

Swift is a defensive stalwart!
Swift has ill post moves yo!
He has like mad hops!
Mad skillz son!
Yo he be straight beastin, throwin down yams on S dot Wills bean 2 months in to his born year, and that soft fool Boone straight skated in the 2nd month of his 2nd year so he didn't pick up da foul.
Swift could be da MVP if that mark az crab Frank would give im some burn!


Wow!

You guys are in denial.

STFU!

[EFF]

Boone is productive? ok... this is just a situation where we're gonna have to agree to disagree.
Boone was a patchwork center placed in that position to be a bandaid for the fact that we didn't have a real center. Adonyl Foyle could have averaged the same numbers if put in Boone's position. Am i crazy or is adonyl foyle not the best we could hope for?

And MrDollarBills, what exactly has ryan done that you would absolutely play him over sean? he has played a single game for about 10 minutes and has hit 1 of 3 shots. He had a good training camp? So did Sean. I like Ryan too, and he probably should play, but the fact that you stuck him in that list just makes me think you just don't like sean williams. And Najera should play regardless. That one was a no brainer.

Sean makes a lotta mistakes and plays unaware sometimes but his potential shouldn't be ignored. After all, we are rebuilding. With Brook there, boone becomes all but obsolete. If not now, then later in the year when Brook gets it down. In any case, Brook frees us up to experiment with guys like sean more. Last year, we couldn't afford to do that. But now with Brook, we can go athletic to complement the big man.

And I think you guys are completely overstating my case for sean and stro. Especially vincecarter4pres with his stro show mvp chant... seriously...what? If you can't follow the discussion, stay out.

[lurkingobeiscity]

I don't particularly like Ryan Anderson. He has no real upside to speak of, though he is an intelligent hard-working player. I don't think he can become more than a valuable role player. That is not necessarily a bad thing but I'm worried that Frank will give him too much time because he likes him. I hope Sean eats into his and Boones minutes as the season goes on.

Anderson shouldn't get a free pass as an "intelligent player" just because of the color of his skin.

There was a play where he showed very low basketball IQ on defense as he totally lost the ball and gave up an easy layup to Antawn Jamison. He's a rookie, so he needs to improve his bball IQ.

They showed a replay of it on the Wiz tv broadcast.

You're funny.

[vincecarter4pres]

EFF, I was more talking to Ragtime, but you as well because you were basically agreeing with him.

Anyway, Boone is a nice player.

He is a nice 15-25mpg big to have off the bench or possibly even start on the right team.

He is a good rebounder and an improving shot blocker and defensive player.

He does make me cringe at times when he lets passes go out of bounds that he should have caught and converted into an easy layup or jam.

But does Sean Williams not do the same?

I like Sean Williams, but until he proves otherwise he really shouldn't get much more than situational minutes when the matchup truly, truly favors him, or in garbage time.
Any other way Boone or Anderson is the much better player to be out there.

They understand their roles and won't make silly turnovers, fouls or force shots out of the flow of the offense like Swat or Swift will.
They might be the more vanilla players to have out there, but that is just fine.
With guys like Yi, Devin, Hayes and Harris out there shooting the ball and making plays, it is nice to have conservative role players out there that will not demand the ball or even more important interupt, stall out or wrongly execute the plays, on offense and defense.

[EFF]

i understand but maybe this is a difference in how we view the season. I'm not looking at this season as a chance to win the championship. i'm saying, if we are high on this guy's potential, let's see if he pans out. That wont happen if he's nailed to the bench. It's not like we're risking a championship by giving these guys a chance.

It's also because I'm very low on Boone's ability to get better. There's just not much he can do about his lack of athleticism and softy play. I say, you develop the guy who is able to do those things but is at the moment not as mature a player. You can develop maturity, but you can't change someone's physical attributes.

[jerseyjac]

very nice G...I put my overall thoughts in game 2's thread...

[jerseyjac]

I was pleasantly surprised by Yi. His shot was great but he also played smart. He played tough and I feel like his rebounding numbers sell him a bit short. He showed very good defensive potential but needs work overall. The coaching staff NEEDS to put him down into the post some so he can get used to shooting from that area and making moves there.

Lopez looks very good. I love the dunks when he is under the hoop and he is going to be an excellent rebounder. He can also become an anchor for the defense. He needs to work a bit on establishing position and being willing to repost. Also see if he can't get a simple face up game so he doesn't always need to have good position. Looking like an excellent pick.

Carter played excellent and was the team leader. I loved how he was explaining the help D to Yi at one point.

Harris needs to learn what a hesitation move is. He would be deadly if he changed speeds instead of trying to go full speed all the time.

Hayes played well as a reserve but I wouldn't count on that every game. I would expect it will be a different reserve that steps up every game.

I don't particularly like Ryan Anderson. He has no real upside to speak of, though he is an intelligent hard-working player. I don't think he can become more than a valuable role player. That is not necessarily a bad thing but I'm worried that Frank will give him too much time because he likes him. I hope Sean eats into his and Boones minutes as the season goes on.

Boone played bad IMO. He was being eaten alive by Etan Thomas at one point, both in terms of rebounding and defense.

CDR played well as a glue guy and didn't press anything. I would expect him to become more comfortable with his role as the season goes on and the numbers will start to come.

Dooling looks like a serviceable backup point capable of scoring when no one else on the second unit can.

Marv and Fratello have a lot of awkward moments together.

I agree YI, Vince and Lopez had really good all around first games...Dooling proved in game was he is a backup pg, even while playing under 100%...and I look at Hayes as overachieving, but down the line Nets fans should look at Simmons and Hayes combined numbers...
Boone is probably still under 100%...CDR was a typical rook game 1, I think your a little hard on Ryan, but I can understand that...you can see he has a high basketball IQ, he's an active player and is willing mix things up on the defensive end regardless of the extent...but he's a shooter and needs to make better than 1-3 to be considered, as you said, a serviceable backup role player, we definitely see eye to eye on that...

[jerseyjac]

Caught the game late and didn't bother to look for him haha. Of course he had an inner ear infection. How crazy of me to think Hassell would be given a DNP - Coach's Decision.

But seriously, I'll be really pissed if Frank gives up on CDR early.

We dont need Hassel, unless we 're having match up problems at his position...period...he needs to be shelved as does Ager...SWill should be ahead of both...

[jerseyjac]

Lopez outplayed Boone. Got some big rebounds, had a few nice moves to score around the basket. His length and knack for the ball keeps plays alive more often than not.

Hayes played really well, if he can continue to make open shots like that, he'll have a great year.

Yi needs to keep playing just like that. Not force shots, take open shots - stretch the defense and open up the lanes for Devin to drive.

VC set the tone to begin the 3rd quarter and he and Hayes finished off the Wizards in the 4th.

I've said it all offseason, the Nets are going to surprise a lot of analysts/fans...

Devin needs to do that on his own...VC played perfectly G...he let others get involved early, before asserting himself more and more...he's in stealth mode...and his savyness continues to increase as he gets older...

[jerseyjac]

Swift is a defensive stalwart!
Swift has ill post moves yo!
He has like mad hops!
Mad skillz son!
Yo he be straight beastin, throwin down yams on S dot Wills bean 2 months in to his born year, and that soft fool Boone straight skated in the 2nd month of his 2nd year so he didn't pick up da foul.
Swift could be da MVP if that mark az crab Frank would give im some burn!


Wow!

You guys are in denial.

STFU!

\
relax!...I dont want to see the STFUs...leave them out...

here's the deal...

#1--Swift needs to take time from the rooks...and overall, between preseason and game 1...that doesnt look to easy...secondly, I'm giving my playing time to SWill over Swift any day...and #3, the Nets are better off playing the skilled rookies we have...if the Nets need more interior defense you bring in Swill...if Sean is playing smart and in control, you give him more minutes...let me rephrase my previous post

You all know the 10 we played...thats where we should really stay until a rookie, obvioulsy Ryan or CDR, show otherwise...the next Net in line, is Swill...so if the aforementioned doesnt happen, or until we need a little more defense, look at SWill and Stromile being 11 adnd 12 and I have no problem with Hassel even bein throw in to the mix (I'm just worried he gets more time than he should, I'm hoping that ear infection was a true Coache's decision)
...we bascially dont need Swift...

[jerseyjac]

Look the problem with Swift and Williams is they both have the tendency to have major brainfarts at the defensive end . I rather have a reliable boring guy then a flashy inconsistent one.

The problem is that Boone has never been reliable. He got killed by Etan Thomas (!!) repeatedly during the Wiz game. Far too often he shows little to no effort on help defense. Opening night he actually blocked a couple shots, which was great to see and really helped the team. But he's not consistent with it. He has far too many plays like this one where Boone rotates but makes no effort at all to stop the opponent from scoring...

Williams got picked on that play by his teammate and didn't get back quick enough... but he covered lots of ground and made an aggressive attempt to stop Swift, showing great effort. Boone moved over a couple feet then got out of the way...

If you want someone reliable and consistent then Boone certainly isn't your man because he can't be counted on to really give great effort on defense on a consistent basis...

And then there's the matter of Boone's offense, which is nonexistant....

bro you're out of your mind...sorry...just an FYI, Boone isnt 100% healthy...secondly the only thing inconsistent last yr while playing 70gms and starting probably over 50, I remember hearing 57...was his Ft shooting...in 25minutes last year he avged 54%fgs...brining in 8 and 7 with a block...

[vincecarter4pres]

i understand but maybe this is a difference in how we view the season. I'm not looking at this season as a chance to win the championship. i'm saying, if we are high on this guy's potential, let's see if he pans out. That wont happen if he's nailed to the bench. It's not like we're risking a championship by giving these guys a chance.

It's also because I'm very low on Boone's ability to get better. There's just not much he can do about his lack of athleticism and softy play. I say, you develop the guy who is able to do those things but is at the moment not as mature a player. You can develop maturity, but you can't change someone's physical attributes.

Here's the thing.

I doubt we win the championship this year.

I only say doubt, because you never know, there is always the slimest of slim possibilities an incredible trade comes along that Rod can't turn down, even if it comprises the chance we have room for a max FA.

But, I think this team does have a shot at the playoffs, going maybe 42-40 and proving evryone wrong.

That said, I really wanted James Harden, and unless he has a horrible season, he is a lottery pick, and without our own lottery pick.........I think you see where I'm going with this.
But we have assets, such as Sean Williams, Boone and future picks, who if not traded before the season can be traded in the offseason to move up in the draft.

Anyway, I still think we have a shot at the playoffs, but at the same time I want Sean to develop, so I think he should average maybe 10 minutes a game until he shows he deserves more.
This would mean more play off of favorable matchups, so there maybe games he gets 25 minutes and there maybe games he gets 8 minutes and there are going to be games he gets DNPs.

[rag-time4]

bro you're out of your mind...sorry...just an FYI, Boone isnt 100% healthy...secondly the only thing inconsistent last yr while playing 70gms and starting probably over 50, I remember hearing 57...was his Ft shooting...in 25minutes last year he avged 54%fgs...brining in 8 and 7 with a block...

Jac, i disagree on Boone's consistency. Last season, I often saw him making little to no effort to play help defense. When the team needed him to rotate and block a shot or put someone on the line, far too often Boone's effort level left a lot to be desired.

And his free throws were consistent, but in a bad way...

Boone does tend to shoot a high percentage but he's almost entirely dependent on his teammates drawing his man and being wide open.

Stromile can do that too, and do it better than Boone, but Stromile can also create his own shots, and he can get to the line and shoot a decent percentage. Boone, I've noticed, often does not draw attention from opposing defenses, in that he doesn't draw double or triple teams, and he doesn't draw crowds in the paint. Certainly Stromile is not a player who is constantly double teamed but his ability to drive and slash to the basket from the perimeter often results in opposing defenses trying to swarm him.

EFF, I was more talking to Ragtime, but you as well because you were basically agreeing with him.

Anyway, Boone is a nice player.

He is a nice 15-25mpg big to have off the bench or possibly even start on the right team.

He is a good rebounder and an improving shot blocker and defensive player.

He does make me cringe at times when he lets passes go out of bounds that he should have caught and converted into an easy layup or jam.

But does Sean Williams not do the same?

I like Sean Williams, but until he proves otherwise he really shouldn't get much more than situational minutes when the matchup truly, truly favors him, or in garbage time.
Any other way Boone or Anderson is the much better player to be out there.

They understand their roles and won't make silly turnovers, fouls or force shots out of the flow of the offense like Swat or Swift will.
They might be the more vanilla players to have out there, but that is just fine.
With guys like Yi, Devin, Hayes and Harris out there shooting the ball and making plays, it is nice to have conservative role players out there that will not demand the ball or even more important interupt, stall out or wrongly execute the plays, on offense and defense.

VC4pres, I can appreciate an attempt at civil discussion.

I think that your comment about Swill and Swift 'forcing shots out of the flow of the offense' is interesting. Since they see themselves as scorers, Swift probably moreso than Williams, why not put them in a situation where they can be a part of the offense?

During Swift's playoff runs with the Griz, he was usually the 1st or 2nd option in the offense with the second unit and did quite well, and even with Gasol on the court Swift would still occasionally get his touches in the offense. Coach Frank has said that his best year was in that role, during the 03/04 season. Part of Swift's success was that he got touches and was allowed to be creative in the offense and do his thing.

He's not gonna be happy in a Josh Boone role because he doesn't have as low of an opinion of himself as Boone does. (You said yourself Boone 'knows' he's not good offensively)

Also, you listed four players that you think are more qualified to shoot the ball than Swift or Williams. You listed Yi, Devin, Hayes and Harris, and while I agree that Devin and Harris, as well as Hayes and Yi are all good shooters and are more reliable perimeter shooters than Swift and Williams, Swift and Williams are better than all of them at scoring in the paint. Harris, in my opinion, is probably the best at scoring in the paint of the players you listed at his position.

I noticed in the first game that Yi pulled up and shot a jumper every time he drove. He's a good shooter but just like anyone else he shouldn't always settle. I want to see him be able to get to the line.

A big difference between Yi and Dirk Nowitzki is Nowitzki's ability to post up and get to the foul line... which is something that Swift can do better than any of the players you listed.

Swift is a defensive stalwart!
Swift has ill post moves yo!
He has like mad hops!
Mad skillz son!
Yo he be straight beastin, throwin down yams on S dot Wills bean 2 months in to his born year, and that soft fool Boone straight skated in the 2nd month of his 2nd year so he didn't pick up da foul.
Swift could be da MVP if that mark az crab Frank would give im some burn!


Wow!

You guys are in denial.

STFU!

This post was certainly interesting....

[lurkingobeiscity]

Stromile can do that too, and do it better than Boone, but Stromile can also create his own shots, and he can get to the line and shoot a decent percentage. Boone, I've noticed, often does not draw attention from opposing defenses, in that he doesn't draw double or triple teams, and he doesn't draw crowds in the paint. Certainly Stromile is not a player who is constantly double teamed but his ability to drive and slash to the basket from the perimeter often results in opposing defenses trying to swarm him.

Stromile can not do a lot of the things you attribute to him. Stromile does not draw attention in the post any more than Boone does, and even if he did, I can't recall Stromile ever passing it out of the post once he goes into one of his "moves." Furthermore, Boone exhibits some semblance of basketball IQ (the simple ability to be where you are supposed to be, the ability to make the right cut for a pass, the ability to seal out your man when a teammate drives the lane, the ability to recognize your own limitations.....). Swift plays stupid. Boone is a very limited player, but in his few years in the NBA he has already surpassed Swift in his understanding of Basketball.

[vincecarter4pres]

Stromile can do that too, and do it better than Boone, but Stromile can also create his own shots, and he can get to the line and shoot a decent percentage. Boone, I've noticed, often does not draw attention from opposing defenses, in that he doesn't draw double or triple teams, and he doesn't draw crowds in the paint. Certainly Stromile is not a player who is constantly double teamed but his ability to drive and slash to the basket from the perimeter often results in opposing defenses trying to swarm him.

Stromile can not do a lot of the things you attribute to him. Stromile does not draw attention in the post any more than Boone does, and even if he did, I can't recall Stromile ever passing it out of the post once he goes into one of his "moves." Furthermore, Boone exhibits some semblance of basketball IQ (the simple ability to be where you are supposed to be, the ability to make the right cut for a pass, the ability to seal out your man when a teammate drives the lane, the ability to recognize your own limitations.....). Swift plays stupid. Boone is a very limited player, but in his few years in the NBA he has already surpassed Swift in his understanding of Basketball.

Exactly.

I think Charles said it best on Inside the NBA the other night, "and if my aunt had onions then she would be my uncle".