Mr. Anderson

[TheGrowth]

Surprisingly good. Very smart and I never knew he was so deadly a 3pt shooter. Thorn did well this draft.

[rag-time4]

I'm not buying Anderson as a 'smart' player at all. What a load of crap.

Vs Cleveland he shot 1-4 for 2 points, with no blocks, no steals. Worst on the team with a -22 +/-

Williams played fewer minutes and had 3 blocks in 15 minutes. Had a -7 in +/-

Where's the consistency for Anderson? Or does he get a free pass on consistency? If you're gonna criticize Mr. Swift for consistency despite his inconsistent and limited role, hold others to the same standard.

Williams had more blocks in those 15 minutes than Anderson has produced all season. That's a joke considering Anderson's playing time.

[Preludepunk27]

I'm not buying Anderson as a 'smart' player at all. What a load of crap.

Vs Cleveland he shot 1-4 for 2 points, with no blocks, no steals. Worst on the team with a -22 +/-

Williams played fewer minutes and had 3 blocks in 15 minutes. Had a -7 in +/-

Where's the consistency for Anderson? Or does he get a free pass on consistency? If you're gonna criticize Mr. Swift for consistency despite his inconsistent and limited role, hold others to the same standard.

Williams had more blocks in those 15 minutes than Anderson has produced all season. That's a joke considering Anderson's playing time.

Swift is 28 and been in the league the better part of a decade. Anderson is 21 and been in the least 10 games. Stro, you gotta be kidding me that you're complaining about his consistency. Looking at the stat sheet and basing your logic solely off that is ignorant. Basing your argument on 1 game against one of the best teams in basketball is also ignorant. Lay off the pipe.

[rag-time4]

Swift is 28 and been in the league the better part of a decade. Anderson is 21 and been in the least 10 games. Stro, you gotta be kidding me that you're complaining about his consistency. Looking at the stat sheet and basing your logic solely off that is ignorant. Basing your argument on 1 game against one of the best teams in basketball is also ignorant. Lay off the pipe.

Well after being in the league 10 games, Mr Anderson has certainly earned the title of basketball genius!!

If my reading of the stat sheet is ignorant, then why did he suck in the Cleveland game? Were his shots not open? Did he not get touches? Did he fail to play aggressively and attack the basket?

Nobody mentioned his play in the game thread. Though I did notice you said Yi = Ben Wallace At least you're consistent... you don't seem to have much of a use for athletic big men who block shots in your basketball worldview...

[jerseyjac]

rag-time...you are truly unable to talk Nets basketball...If you're really going to bring Swift into every post you make, you will see me start to delete posts...this is not only immature...it borderline......, I'll leave that alone...

as far as Ryan...he had a typical rookie game vs a team lead by the NBA's leading scorer...and superstar...you could say the deer in headlights look was present...

[Preludepunk27]

Swift is 28 and been in the league the better part of a decade. Anderson is 21 and been in the least 10 games. Stro, you gotta be kidding me that you're complaining about his consistency. Looking at the stat sheet and basing your logic solely off that is ignorant. Basing your argument on 1 game against one of the best teams in basketball is also ignorant. Lay off the pipe.

Well after being in the league 10 games, Mr Anderson has certainly earned the title of basketball genius!!

If my reading of the stat sheet is ignorant, then why did he suck in the Cleveland game? Were his shots not open? Did he not get touches? Did he fail to play aggressively and attack the basket?

Nobody mentioned his play in the game thread. Though I did notice you said Yi = Ben Wallace At least you're consistent... you don't seem to have much of a use for athletic big men who block shots in your basketball worldview...

See you're completely taking so many of this out of context. A lot of people said he's very smart and has a solid IQ. You automatically go the extreme and threw out the word "Genius" in your argument. Take a look at the top 5 picks in this draft? They're all well rounded players that are pretty smart in bball IQ. Have they had up and down games? Most certainly. Now, 8 years down the road, do you expect up and down games? You're aloud to have an off night here and there but the overall answer is NO. You're argument is atrocious.

In reference to the Cleveland game, thanks for completely ignoring my previous comments. I guess I was just wasting my time writing them. You're talking about a 21 year old kid with 9 games under his belt going up against one of the best defensive teams in basketball. Then, you're talking about a kid who is not a focal point of the offense. At best, he's a 3rd scoring option when we have a garbage lineup in. But to play, if you disregard all that, you would have an argument if he was like 2-14 from the field, but what was he 1-4 or 1-5? Flat out IGNORANCE if you consider all this and bitch about his consistency 10 games into his career.

Again man with the comment I made in the game thread, you do not understand english very well. Yes, Yi = Ben Wallace...in the impact they can have for a team. It clearly wasn't saying, "Yes, from everything I have seen, Yi is the same exact player as Ben Wallace so it's a push." At this point in both players careers, you never know which one will actually show up. Will Ben have a nice 8 pt, 12 rebound, 4 block game or will he get 2 and 5 and not really impact the game? Will Yi show his aggresiveness and drop 19 and 8 tonight or will he have one of his 2 and 3 efforts? THAT is way they're equal. What school district did you go to growing up because I want to make sure when I have kids they don't go to the same one as you.

[rag-time4]

Swift is 28 and been in the league the better part of a decade. Anderson is 21 and been in the least 10 games. Stro, you gotta be kidding me that you're complaining about his consistency. Looking at the stat sheet and basing your logic solely off that is ignorant. Basing your argument on 1 game against one of the best teams in basketball is also ignorant. Lay off the pipe.

Well after being in the league 10 games, Mr Anderson has certainly earned the title of basketball genius!!

If my reading of the stat sheet is ignorant, then why did he suck in the Cleveland game? Were his shots not open? Did he not get touches? Did he fail to play aggressively and attack the basket?

Nobody mentioned his play in the game thread. Though I did notice you said Yi = Ben Wallace At least you're consistent... you don't seem to have much of a use for athletic big men who block shots in your basketball worldview...

See you're completely taking so many of this out of context. A lot of people said he's very smart and has a solid IQ. You automatically go the extreme and threw out the word "Genius" in your argument. Take a look at the top 5 picks in this draft? They're all well rounded players that are pretty smart in bball IQ. Have they had up and down games? Most certainly. Now, 8 years down the road, do you expect up and down games? You're aloud to have an off night here and there but the overall answer is NO. You're argument is atrocious.

In reference to the Cleveland game, thanks for completely ignoring my previous comments. I guess I was just wasting my time writing them. You're talking about a 21 year old kid with 9 games under his belt going up against one of the best defensive teams in basketball. Then, you're talking about a kid who is not a focal point of the offense. At best, he's a 3rd scoring option when we have a garbage lineup in. But to play, if you disregard all that, you would have an argument if he was like 2-14 from the field, but what was he 1-4 or 1-5? Flat out IGNORANCE if you consider all this and bitch about his consistency 10 games into his career.

Again man with the comment I made in the game thread, you do not understand english very well. Yes, Yi = Ben Wallace...in the impact they can have for a team. It clearly wasn't saying, "Yes, from everything I have seen, Yi is the same exact player as Ben Wallace so it's a push." At this point in both players careers, you never know which one will actually show up. Will Ben have a nice 8 pt, 12 rebound, 4 block game or will he get 2 and 5 and not really impact the game? Will Yi show his aggresiveness and drop 19 and 8 tonight or will he have one of his 2 and 3 efforts? THAT is way they're equal. What school district did you go to growing up because I want to make sure when I have kids they don't go to the same one as you.

So if Ben Wallace doesn't get 4 blocks in a game, that means he doesn't play good defense? Didn't you say elsewhere in an argument about Boone vs Williams and Swift that defense is about more than blocking shots? Yi is nowhere near the defensive presence that Wallace is, and to expect to judge his defensive impact based on only the stat sheet is ignorant.

As for up and down games, how about Nachbar last season? http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/361 ... ?year=2007

Is he an inconsistent, low iq player, or does he not fit the profile?

[Preludepunk27]

Again, you really don't comprehend much in this argument. The point I'm trying to convey with you is that with Wallace and Yi, you have no idea what either are going to bring each night. Some nights they will have good games, some they will have bad. I'm not talking about concrete stats in this point of the argument. I am talking about what one expects of certain players from what they have done over the course of their career. You EXPECT Ben to put up those numbers. Yes the 4 blocks was a little outlandish but not as completely thoughtless like your entire argument. You are basing your argument about my Yi = Ben comment completely on 1 topic (defense) and not on the overall impact he brings on both sides of the court. Yi and Ben were a push in this game in relation to what they bring because, at this point in both careers, you don't know which will show up. And if you want to take the block argument anyway you can watch any Cavs game (I live with a kid from Cleveland and we have league pass) and know Ben lost a step in his man defense too. Cavs major weakness to me is their frontcourt depth, you would think if he hadn't lost a stop he'd be playing 32-35 minutes like he did in Detroit. But I digress, I'm talking about the whole picture whic you wouldn't understand. Learn how to break down someones argument fully before you just his "quote" and run at the mouth.

With Nachbar, I don't know why you're even bringing him up. He's never been consistent. He's never been on a team where he's had starters minutes or enough time that he would have certain things you'd EXPECT of him to be. I really don't understand what the point it here that you're bringing up. He's been in the league a while, he's never shown ANY consistancy which is why he bounced around the league for a while and never got solid minutes. The original point was you're throwing a kid like Ryan Anderson under the bus after he had played TEN GAMES and you're calling him inconsistent. Bringing Nachbar to the conversation lends nothing to your argument which would tilt the scale in your favor.

Can someone tell me if we can still block certain people's posts? This kid is drawing at straws right now and is frying my brain.

[S.I.C. GM]

I dont see why you guys waste your time arguing with Stro.

He is just worried when he gets back from injury anderson will be taking his PT.

As far as Anderson being smart or not, I really dont care. The guy gives us want we need. Very good 3pt shooting. When we need points he can score some points. The defense will get there. If he can guard 3s, it would be better for us especailly for a situational Defense like someone pushing Lebron around. It would also shut Stro up on this board, because stro MIGHT get playing time if Anderson can play a little 3.

Anderson was a great pick. he definitely makes up for us not keeping Korver and losing Boki.

[Preludepunk27]

Yeah I don't know why I waste my time. Maybe because doing it while I'm at work is a way to pass the time lol

[S.I.C. GM]

^ I totally agree with you.

You know it is unbelievable that Swift has many fans. I dont get it. He might go down as a NBA Lottery Pick Bust, but he gets some support. Who is the worse Pick Milic or Swift. Even though Bowie and Kwame Brown definitely take the cake, but Swift is not far behind. They must be Lousiana Homers.

No offense Stro or Rag-Time.

[Preludepunk27]

I personally think Darko and Swift have a place in the NBA as serviceable backups. Never a focal point, but serviceable at least. They just were taken WAAAAAAAAY to early in the draft.

I still think the Kandi Man was the biggest bust, but that's me. Bowie and Kwame are definitely up there.

[rag-time4]

Again, you really don't comprehend much in this argument. The point I'm trying to convey with you is that with Wallace and Yi, you have no idea what either are going to bring each night. Some nights they will have good games, some they will have bad. I'm not talking about concrete stats in this point of the argument. I am talking about what one expects of certain players from what they have done over the course of their career. You EXPECT Ben to put up those numbers. Yes the 4 blocks was a little outlandish but not as completely thoughtless like your entire argument. You are basing your argument about my Yi = Ben comment completely on 1 topic (defense) and not on the overall impact he brings on both sides of the court. Yi and Ben were a push in this game in relation to what they bring because, at this point in both careers, you don't know which will show up. And if you want to take the block argument anyway you can watch any Cavs game (I live with a kid from Cleveland and we have league pass) and know Ben lost a step in his man defense too. Cavs major weakness to me is their frontcourt depth, you would think if he hadn't lost a stop he'd be playing 32-35 minutes like he did in Detroit. But I digress, I'm talking about the whole picture whic you wouldn't understand. Learn how to break down someones argument fully before you just his "quote" and run at the mouth.

With Nachbar, I don't know why you're even bringing him up. He's never been consistent. He's never been on a team where he's had starters minutes or enough time that he would have certain things you'd EXPECT of him to be. I really don't understand what the point it here that you're bringing up. He's been in the league a while, he's never shown ANY consistancy which is why he bounced around the league for a while and never got solid minutes. The original point was you're throwing a kid like Ryan Anderson under the bus after he had played TEN GAMES and you're calling him inconsistent. Bringing Nachbar to the conversation lends nothing to your argument which would tilt the scale in your favor.

Can someone tell me if we can still block certain people's posts? This kid is drawing at straws right now and is frying my brain.

The point I'm trying to make with Wallace and Yi is that Wallace always provides defensive presence. It may not be manifested in blocked shot totals because to block a shot requires being tested and shot against. Shotblockers provide defensive presence regardless of the stats. Yi doesn't do that. Sometimes he is very productive offensively and scores a lot of points, but he is very inconsistent about getting to the foul line and drawing fouls. His production overall has been inconsistent, and his defense has been rather poor.

If you think I'm throwing Ryan Anderson under the bus, you're off base. What I'm disagreeing with is the quickness with which some people have labelled him a 'high IQ' ... 'competitive' .... 'consistent'.... after 10 games.

And you say that you don't understand why I even mentioned Nachbar, but you only addressed part of what I asked about him... I agree that he is inconsistent, but what about his bball IQ?

What qualifies Anderson as 'high IQ' after 10 games? How is that judged? What is the criteria? I saw Anderson get totally lost on a play during the preseason, totally losing his man in the paint and giving up an open layup because he got lost... not a sign of high IQ.

So far this season, Anderson has produced only 2 blocks, compared to 6 turnovers (negative block-turnover ratio) and 18 personal fouls

Sean Williams has produced 6 blocks, compared to 5 turnovers (positive block-turnover ratio) and 8 personal fouls (far superior blocks to fouls ratio)

Part of the root of my argument is that Williams (and Swift) consistently provide defensive presence, while Anderson does not. Yet the consistent defenders are labelled inconsistent and low IQ, while the weaker defender is seen in a much more positive light. That's not right in my opinion and I disagree with the labels.

[vincecarter4pres]

You're way off base here.
No one called Big Ben a low IQ player and if you asked this board and in general I think it would be quite the opposite, he has just broke down physically.
And again on the Ryan Anderson TO to blocks and fouls ratio, what have you proven?
Anderson has played in a majority of the games and probably averaged 15 or so minutes a game, and I believe without chekcing it is 16 and change.
Sean Williams has barely played what so ever, so how can you compare the ratios when Sean hasn't played enough minutes.
Also Ryan is not considered to be a good defensive player and he is a rookie so he is bound to make more mistakes.
His high IQ goes back to college as well, not just 10 games in the L.
Some players have it, some don't. It usually isn't something you pick up later in your career like a jumpshot, you usuallly have it back to highschool.
For someone like Swat, it is very possible his grows in leaps and bounds during his career because he has only played organized ball since he was 16, but this isn't the norm.
Williams and Swift also do not consistently provide defense because they are borderline terrible man to man defenders. They are help side shot blockers.
Anderson also looks decent on D from time to time, and also provides offense on a much more consistent basis then Sean or Swat.
Plays don't even get ran for this guy especially, he is more scoring off broken plays and dribble drives where he is wide open, or when he finds the ball very late in the shot clock.
In all reality he has a nice face up and post up game that most of us have yet to see in a Nets uniform if not at all, since most barely saw him play of at all in college.
I have never personally seen the block to TO to foul ratio used, but you show me slighlty above average role players that get 20 mpg and are invloved that are on the plus side of that equation.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say they probably don't exist.
I have a feeling there aren't many if alsmost any players in the league that play meaningful minutes that even have a positive block to TO ratio period.

[rag-time4]

You're way off base here.
No one called Big Ben a low IQ player and if you asked this board and in general I think it would be quite the opposite, he has just broke down physically.
And again on the Ryan Anderson TO to blocks and fouls ratio, what have you proven?
Anderson has played in a majority of the games and probably averaged 15 or so minutes a game, and I believe without chekcing it is 16 and change.
Sean Williams has barely played what so ever, so how can you compare the ratios when Sean hasn't played enough minutes.
Also Ryan is not considered to be a good defensive player and he is a rookie so he is bound to make more mistakes.
His high IQ goes back to college as well, not just 10 games in the L.
Some players have it, some don't. It usually isn't something you pick up later in your career like a jumpshot, you usuallly have it back to highschool.
For someone like Swat, it is very possible his grows in leaps and bounds during his career because he has only played organized ball since he was 16, but this isn't the norm.
Williams and Swift also do not consistently provide defense because they are borderline terrible man to man defenders. They are help side shot blockers.
Anderson also looks decent on D from time to time, and also provides offense on a much more consistent basis then Sean or Swat.
Plays don't even get ran for this guy especially, he is more scoring off broken plays and dribble drives where he is wide open, or when he finds the ball very late in the shot clock.
In all reality he has a nice face up and post up game that most of us have yet to see in a Nets uniform if not at all, since most barely saw him play of at all in college.
I have never personally seen the block to TO to foul ratio used, but you show me slighlty above average role players that get 20 mpg and are invloved that are on the plus side of that equation.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say they probably don't exist.
I have a feeling there aren't many if alsmost any players in the league that play meaningful minutes that even have a positive block to TO ratio period.

Last season Sean Williams started 29 games. He averaged 1.5 blocks and 1.0 turnovers per game, a positive ratio.

Here are some other players just off the top of my head, looking at their career stats:
Alonzo Mourning: 2.8 bpg, 2.6 TO
Dikembe Mutombo: 2.8 bpg, 1.8 TO
Marcus Camby: 2.7 bpg, 1.8 TO
Ben Wallace: 2.2 bpg, 1.0 TO
Steven Hunter 1.1 bpg, 0.6 TO
Samuel Dalembert 2.0 bpg, 1.5 TO

So you say that with regard to bball IQ, some players have it and others don't... but what exactly are the criteria??