Official Countdown to Firing"NoLowPostOffense"Grunfeld

[fishercob]

Dude, honestly. Are you for real? I keep expecting you to be like "ha ha, hi guys, this is just a random college kid who loves getting baked and screwing with people by writing these books about nonsense."

[Silvie Lysandra]

If you get past the horrendous grammar and terrible sentence structure (where is WD from though honestly) he's mostly right, though kind of exaggerating.

Grunfield has been unable to get defensive talent. That is not an opinion, that is a FACT. Jamison is terrible (though he can play average in a contract year!) Pecherov is crap. Veremeenko is crap. McGuire is an undersized PF which we have plenty of. Butler doesn't have the physical gifts to be an elite defender but makes up for it with effort which equals "decent". Stevenson is good but he's two inches too short. He's great when defending guards similar to his size and body type but the LeBrons/T-Macs/Kobes of the world will be successful against him.

Songalia and Thomas speak for themselves. Daniels can't be really held against EG; you never know when a veteran will break down. (though he was a worse defender than

The problem is that all of EGs moves were geared towards a comparatively low ceiling - Eastern Conference Finals. Jamison is not a championship-caliber PF; ideally, he's coming off the bench. Butler has to give 100% effort every minute and he ends up breaking down. Arenas is a singular talent but that wasn't his move. The way the team was constructed - 3 high scorers with mediocre to bad defensive abilities, a crappy bench filled with non-athletic non-defenders (and the defenders we had, sadly, couldn't do much else), and a coach who misused the parts he had in the worst ways - could never have obtained lasting success, and it never did.

Yes, "injuries". But we weren't setting the league on fire when Butler went down in 06. Great offense, bad defense, mediocre rebounding. Not a recipe for success.

All in all, I'd give Grunfield a C-: Kwame

[hands11]

Defense wins championships and Ernie Grunfield's tenure in both Milwaukee and here have been conducted in total ignorance of that fundamental fact. (granted, he should have a ring - a healthy Ewing in the 99 finals probably beats SA that year)

The fact is, Grunfield's moves look good taken individually. Stack for Jamison. Great. Kwame for Butler. Amazing. Deshawn on the cheap. Daniels who was the best backup PG in the NBA at the time. Blatche who will stick in the NBA in the 2nd. Young who has all-star potential in the middle of the 16th.

But that's not how you win a championship - you win a championship by assembling the right mix of personnel, from stars to role-players to coachses.

Why wasn't it apparent that Jamison and Butler were a horrible combination in the frontcourt defensively? Why didn't he realize that Thomas was an average-to-mediocre center asking for a big long-term contract? Why did he not realize that Jamison did not represent real "leadership" in that he failed to show it on the defensive end, in terms of shot selection, and only improved those attributes in a contract year? Why didn't the light click on in the last few years to make him say "this team is never going to contend for a championship? Or even a ECF berth?" Why did he not see the fundamental flaws in the way the team was constructed - low-efficiency chuckers with mediocre to bad defense, held together by an elite C who wasn't getting enough minutes and with a bench that has consistently been terrlble?

Why don't you come back here in about a month and tell us all how wrong you were.

Getting ride of EJ is going to change a lot. Just wait. You''ll see.

[yungal07]

Grunfeld didn't get Jamison to play power forward. That's completely inaccurate. He traded Jamison to start next to Kwame Brown at forward. When Kwame went down due to injury, he started Jamison and Jeffries at the forward spots. At the time, there wasn't a designated "power" forward in Eddie Jordan's offense, so he had no problem making that move. Grunfeld had no say in the utilization of Jamison -- that is completely false.

And how could anyone in their right freakin mind complain about the loss of Jeffries and Hughes? Those guys got paid a combined like 18 mil a season! And look at them now -- they are flat out awful. So please STFU about that one.

And lol at WD glazing over Grunfeld's accomplishments like they were "obvious." Oh sure, picking Young and McGee were the obvious choices huh? Dude you need to put down the spiked juicy juice you're sippin on.

[mhd]

Ernie didn't hire Jordan, Abe did. Here are Ernie's moves:

1) Signed Arenas as a FA. (Eddie wanted Kevin freaking Ollie as his PG).
2) Traded for Jamison (In retrospect, a good move, though I would have picked Iggy in that draft).
3) Matched Etan's contract with the Bucks (Every inside source says this was an Abe decision. Etan is a horrible basketball player).
4) Signed Brendan Haywood to an extension (GREAT move. He's been criminally underrated for years. The Wizards defense has been statitically average when he's on the floor. Yet Eddie never saw this and refused to give him more PT. When he's off the floor, the Wizards are statistically the worst defensive team in NBA history. That is a fact). Haywood's not paid near enough in comparison to other centers. He has arguably the best contract in the NBA. ETAN MAKES MORE!
5) Traded Kwame for Butler.
6) Refused to resign Hughes at a horrid price.
7) Refused to resign Jefferies (Unseld and MJ pick) at a horrid price.
7) Signed Daniels to a five year MLE deal. GOod move. Daniels was worth every penny of his deal before this year. He's a valued though because he expires next year. Looking back to every FA who signed an MLE deal that off-season, only McDyess was a better signing by Detroit.
8) Refused to resign Hayes (Unseld pick) after years of horrid play. Did you know Eddie played Hayes over Caron when Caron first got here? Caron STARTED ON THE BENCH! What coach thinks Jarvis Hayes is better than Caron Butler? It took a Hayes injury to force Caron into the starting lineup. Moreover, Jordan constantly played a 6'5 Hayes at PF for no reason. HE ALWAYS GOES SMALLBALL!
9) Drafted Blatche in 2nd round and signed him to a dirt cheap extension. Even if Blatche has dissapointed, he's worth every penny of his contract. 3rd bigs get paid MLE money. Blatche barely makes half of that, and is signed for the next four years.
10) Drafted Pecherov (Shot for a homerun and missed. Nothing really in that draft, though hindsight is always 20/20).
11) Found Roger Mason (True proffesional, who didn't resign because Abe refuses to pay the luxary tax).
12) Drafted Nick Young (Great value. Young is a future 20 ppg scorer in this league. With Haywood out, he's also the best defender on the roster).
13) Drafted Javale McGee (GREAT PICK. He's Tyson CHandler with more offense and explosion).
14) Signed Songaila (Ernie's only true bad move. With that said, I think Songaila would be a good player, if he actually only played his true position of PF. HE"S NOT A CENTER, despit what Eddie Jordan thought).
15) Resigned Jamison (A move that had to be made. You don't lose Jamison for nothing. Philly was going to go hard after him).
16) Resigned Arenas (A move that had to be made. Brand wasn't coming with only Butler on the roster (Jamison and Arenas had to be renounced to have the cap space to sign a max FA). No FA would have come with only Caron on the roster. Don't listen to Wilbon's trade ideas of Baron Davis+Biedrins for Arenas. Biedrin's cap hold would have made such a trade impossible under the CBA. Yet Wilbon, doesn't due any actual research on the CBA).


Grunfeld has done all he can due given an owner who orders resignings of medicore players (Etan) and refuses to pay the luxary tax. Every move Grunfeld has made has been a good move, save for signing Songaila.

Great post mhd! You couldn't have broken it down any better. I'm gonna have to bookmark this and just repost it whenever I hear the mindless EG bashing.

Thanks Nate. Oh, I forgot to add that he traded Jahidi for an expiring Brevin Knight.

Everyone clamoring for Brand doesn't realize David Falk will never have his client (He doesn't have anyone worth a penny besides Brand. Everyone of his clients who are worth anything fired him. He's a non-entity in the NBA) sign with the Wizards. Abe hates Falk and Falk hates Abe.

[WizarDynasty]

Dude, honestly. Are you for real? I keep expecting you to be like "ha ha, hi guys, this is just a random college kid who loves getting baked and screwing with people by writing these books about nonsense."

I am surprised you even have anything new to say after i destroyed your position on EG lol. OH that's right...EG is not a major reason why this franchise has such a poor roster. I guess i shouldn't think those non-sense thought huh? I am sure you will explain to us why wiz are clearly on their way to ECF..or better yet maybe a ring in the next few season...we need a good laugh as we listen to support your hero EG the great GM that has lead us to an elite position in the ECF for the last few season with spectacular roster moves. We are all anxiously await for you to enlighten us with you believe are the oopposite of "nonsensical" statement relating to EG... and i guess just bury yourself in the process like others in this thread...oops did say..nonsensical.

[fishercob]

Oh well. Wishful thinking. That being the case, can someone remind me how to use the ignore
function? It was much simpler in the old version of the site.

[miller31time]

Oh well. Wishful thinking. That being the case, can someone remind me how to use the ignore
function? It was much simpler in the old version of the site.

Click on their user-name and click "Add foe".

That should do the trick.

[WizarDynasty]

I think tonight is a perfect example of why eddie grunfeld should have been fired a long time ago.

[Donkey McDonkerton]

I think tonight is a perfect example of why eddie grunfeld should have been fired a long time ago.

Why? Deshawn or NO interior Big man?

Lateral quickness? Bow legs?

[WizarDynasty]

another horrible game from Mr. Grunfeld's non defensive free agent signings.

[Kanyewest]

WIlbon is a moron. WHy doesn't he mention the fact that Abe won't pay the luxary tax. What else did he want us to do? We didn't have max salary space unless we renounced both Arenas and Jamison. Brand wasn't coming here with only Butler on the team. Then you end up signing Corey Maggette like players to 5 years, 50 million dollar deals like GSW did. I'd rather have resigned Jamison then lose him for nothing.

The Wizards still had their MLE which they could have used to go after free agents like James Posey or Louis Williams. They could have kept their 2nd round pick instead of trading it for cash. Or they could have simply re-signed Roger Mason Jr. to a reasonably cheap deal.

With Abe not paying the luxary tax, those deals were simply unattainable.

Well, maybe Wilbon is right that the Wizards don't have the power to build a contender. Perhaps a winning franchise pays the luxury tax or one that is more committed to it. I wouldn't say adopt the philosophy of the New York Knicks with Layden/Thomas. If Abe Pollin had deeper pockets like Dan Snyder, the Wizards would have had no problems overpaying to keep players that performed well here or hire a prominently well known head coach.

[closg00]

Since Tap has taken over coaching duties, Juan hasn't broken a sweat. Was JD given a contract because EJ wanted him (which is what it appears), or was it because Ernie thought that JD was > then Demarr Johnson?

[nate33]

Since Tap has taken over coaching duties, Juan hasn't broken a sweat. Was JD given a contract because EJ wanted him (which is what it appears), or was it because Ernie thought that JD was > then Demarr Johnson?

I wouldn't read much into this either way.

Dixon looked real good in preseason and over the first few games. Heck, he was our second-best guard through the first 5 games. At the time, It was completely reasonable for EJ/EG to prefer to keep Dixon around rather than Johnson.

But things have changed over time. When AD got hurt, Dixon was thrust into the starting lineup and it soon became apparent that the team was in dire need of a true PG who could push tempo and create easier shots for others. EJ, and later, Eddie T made the decision to play Dee Brown over Dixon in the starting lineup. Dixon still got some minutes off the bench while AD was ailing. Now that AD is better, Dixon got squeezed out.

Interestingly, if AD regains the starting spot, Dixon might be used again as a backup, with Brown getting squeezed out. Dixon couldn't cut it as a starting PG but he seems to do well as backup PG alongside Young.

[Dat2U]

With Abe not paying the luxary tax, those deals were simply unattainable.

Well, maybe Wilbon is right that the Wizards don't have the power to build a contender. Perhaps a winning franchise pays the luxury tax or one that is more committed to it. I wouldn't say adopt the philosophy of the New York Knicks with Layden/Thomas. If Abe Pollin had deeper pockets like Dan Snyder, the Wizards would have had no problems overpaying to keep players that performed well here or hire a prominently well known head coach.

I honestly think its perfect acceptable for an owner not to pay the luxury tax unless that team is on the cusp of competing for a championship. Most owners don't want to, so Abe is really no different in this respect than most owners.

Where my concern lies is more with Grunfeld. He honestly had to know that in building this team, he had to keep the luxury tax threshold in mind. But instead he ignored common sense and overpaid mediocre (or as this board likes to call them, average players) talent with MLE sized deals even though there was no market for those players to get those type of contracts. It's the deals for AD, Songaila & Stevenson that prevented the team from spending any money this offseason & not making an attempt to re-sign Mason.

The Wizards do have the power to build a contender, but the key decision makers (Grunfeld & Pollin) need to start making better decisions. Like holding on to Jamison like he's the greatest thing since sliced bread, although his expiring contract last year could have bought in a goldmind at the trade deadline. Selling off a 2nd round pick like its candy. Giving guaranteed money to Dee Brown when better talent off the street could be had. Refusing to make a move on Eddie Jordan for years when he obviously wasn't Ernie's guy to begin with.

Management simply needs to get smarter.

[LyricalRico]

Interestingly, if AD regains the starting spot, Dixon might be used again as a backup, with Brown getting squeezed out. Dixon couldn't cut it as a starting PG but he seems to do well as backup PG alongside Young.

Looking a little more longterm, what happens when Gil is healthy? Does AD stay the backup and Dee gets phased out? It would be kinda weird for a guy to be completely healthy and go from starter to 15th man.

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

Interestingly, if AD regains the starting spot, Dixon might be used again as a backup, with Brown getting squeezed out. Dixon couldn't cut it as a starting PG but he seems to do well as backup PG alongside Young.

Looking a little more longterm, what happens when Gil is healthy? Does AD stay the backup and Dee gets phased out? It would be kinda weird for a guy to be completely healthy and go from starter to 15th man.

Weird, but entirely advisable.

Brown is perfect for that 15th man role. Great, team-first attitude... and the speed to be useful on an as-needed basis, such as when we face a team with a super quick pg (such as Devin Harris or TJ Ford).

[nate33]

Interestingly, if AD regains the starting spot, Dixon might be used again as a backup, with Brown getting squeezed out. Dixon couldn't cut it as a starting PG but he seems to do well as backup PG alongside Young.

Looking a little more longterm, what happens when Gil is healthy? Does AD stay the backup and Dee gets phased out? It would be kinda weird for a guy to be completely healthy and go from starter to 15th man.

That bears the question: assuming Arenas, Daniels, Stevenson and Young are healthy, who do we want as our 5th guard? Do we want Dixon who might be able to bail us out on a night when both Arenas and Young are cold. Or do we want Brown who can provide a skill that nobody else on the team can: the ability to stay in front of quick PG's.

[doclinkin]

Interestingly, if AD regains the starting spot, Dixon might be used again as a backup, with Brown getting squeezed out. Dixon couldn't cut it as a starting PG but he seems to do well as backup PG alongside Young.

Looking a little more longterm, what happens when Gil is healthy? Does AD stay the backup and Dee gets phased out? It would be kinda weird for a guy to be completely healthy and go from starter to 15th man.

Not when you've won only 3 games.

And looking really long term, if the season plays out like it's started and we end up with a high draft draw we'll need two slots for the talent we draft. It's unlikely JDix/Dee stick around for the long haul, their status with the team is way down the championship checklist.

[doclinkin]

-This not the first time the Wizards were close to a trade. Sources tell me that the team was on the verge of a deal that would have sent Daniels, Etan Thomas and another player (maybe Dee Brown) to Chicago in October for Larry Hughes but the deal was put off when Hughes (shocker) injured his shoulder.