The gamble that hasn't paid off

[visions]

Hi all,

I've been a Suns fan for about 15 years...this is my first post to this board.

I don't want to harp on about the past and the woulda/shoulda/couldas...but I do think the Suns made a terrible mistake in a) firing Mike D and b) trading Marion for Shaq with both decisions basically mortgaging the team's future on Amare. As we can see so far this season, that gamble has not paid off at all!!
Amare was the most vocal about Mike D leaving and he had issues co-exisiting with Marion which poor Nash had to deal with constantly in the locker room. Remember how well the Suns still did when Amare was out hurt for 2 seasons...they still kicked ass. Yes, Marion was a constant strain in the locker room but if they had traded Amare instead of Marion, maybe that would have made him happy.

If they could have pulled off the Amare/KG trade we possibly could have won it all last year. Look at how KG brought such a winning mentality and confidence to a previously hopeless Boston team...obviously Ray Allen and Posey were big parts of the success too but not nearly as big as KG in my opinion. Plus he would have kept Marion's ego in check.

Instead they dumped a great coach and arguably the team's best defender (and certainly best rebounder) for an ageing, overrated (in my opinion) centre and new game plan which has tried to change years and years of team culture literally over night. Maybe my memories are hazy but I feel like in all the years I have watched the Suns, offense has always taken priority over defense and there has also always been some form of run 'n gun.

Say what you will about the Mike D years and the lack of defense but at the end of the day you've got to be in it to win it and Mike D took this team so close to the finals for 4 years. Last year the Suns were arguably 2 wins and some pointless suspensions away from taking the title - I think even Cavs fans would admit they would have had just as hard a time against the Suns as they did against the Spurs...
This season it looks like they won't even make the playoffs and even if they do, a first round exit is highly likely. At least with Mike D we knew at least conference semis or conf finals was always on the cards...he always had the team in a position to reach that next level.

I place most of the blame on the front office. I think another major mistake was not resigning Kurt Thomas at the start of last season. He added toughness inside and was a good veteran presence on the team. Instead he was let go for financial reasons and he helped dump the Suns out of the first round last year.

So how does all this mess get fixed???
Well for starters I think Porter and Kerr have got to go and I wouldn't mind if Sarver sold the team either. I feel bad placing blame on Porter because I think the team had already been majorly damaged by Kerr and Sarver but nonetheless he has also become part of the problem.

Then I think Shaq needs to be traded for some athletic defenders/rebounders in the mould of Marion. They could even bring Marion back if him and Amare think they can co-exist. I have nothing against Shaq - I have never been a fan of him but I just don't think he fits on this team, despite and the fact he is playing very well this year. Plus I think it is ridiculous that he has to rest every few games. The team needs consistency and players who can play at a high level EVERY game.

After that if Amare doesn't get his act together then he has to go as well...either for Marion (and Boris takes the starting PF role as he did when Amare was injured) or an athletic PF who actually rebounds and can be a presence inside.

Bring back the real running game and this team could compete again. Plus if a winning, exciting culture can be restored, then it will be easier to lure free agents down the road. I just can't see how the front office can expect this team to suddenly become a defensive juggernaut overnight. Yes, some players have been exposed for their lack of versatility without the SSOL system but the team is what it is so they may as well be playing to their strengths.

Sorry to ramble and touch on so many different points but I have wanted to say so many things since last year. I hope someone got something out of reading all this.

[JohnVancouver]

Odd, isn't it, that the Celts managed to become a great defensive team so quickly. There's a lot of knowledge involved in playing team defense, certainly, but it starts with desire and pride. You have to want to shut people down and take pride in it. This team hasn't developed that.
Did you check the Gametime whereK enny Smith and Eric Snow was pointing out defense errors in the N.O. game?
Sad -
What the hell happened to this new commitment to D we heard about? The offense has been neutered and the defense is worse than last year.

The great Celts and Lakers teams both stressed tough D and a running game. That's exactly where we should have gone - we already had one half of that equation down. Now we got .... this

[eastsidecrossover]

Its funny, but porter has not done that. He has not played to our teams strengths.

next, that is why it is called a gamble. its very risky, and many on this forum new it. most of the times gambles don't work out.

Next, even if the suns did not trade marion, they would have lost in the first round anyways. They were a sinking ship, and now they put a diesel on board and it seems to be going down even faster.

[Cash]

As much as I was against the proposed Marion+KT/Big Al+/KG 3-way at the time (because I'm gay for Marion), in hindsight, I really wish that it had gone down. You see the effect KG had on the Celtics, both in terms of on-court defense and general mentality, and you think about what that would've done for the Suns. KG really would've been the perfect complement to Amaré in Mike D's system. I didn't want the deal to happen, because I wanted Marion to finish his career with the Suns and wind up as the best all-time Sun, and by far the best Sun to never play for another team. But if I'd known that he'd get traded anyway, I'd have been all for moving him for KG. That would've been enough to put us over the top. (Although grabbing Tom Thibodeaux instead of Jay Humpries would've helped a lot in any case.)

[Gorilla Warfare]

When I first saw the title of the topic i thought this was a Charles Barkley topic.....

sick burn.

[TXSun]

we needed to keep DA one more year in order for this gamble to work. Under his system and with Shaq, DA made Amar'e into an MVP candidate the last 2 months of the season. With Porter, Amar'e looks like a 6th man at best and Shaq, well Shaq is Shaq. The gamble will not pay off thanks to Kerr.

[visions]

As much as I was against the proposed Marion+KT/Big Al+/KG 3-way at the time (because I'm gay for Marion), in hindsight, I really wish that it had gone down. You see the effect KG had on the Celtics, both in terms of on-court defense and general mentality, and you think about what that would've done for the Suns. KG really would've been the perfect complement to Amaré in Mike D's system.

The trade I was referring to was the one that would have sent Amare to the Hawks and KG to the Suns. Can't remember what the Wolves got out of that rumoured deal though. A frontline with KG and Marion would have been killer and in my opinion better and more versatile than KG and Amare.

When I first saw the title of the topic i thought this was a Charles Barkley topic.....

sick burn.

HEHEHE...funnily enough Sir Charles is my fave Sun (and all round fave player) of all time. As for his gambling problem - well it's tur-rrible

[garrick]

Who knows though what would have happened if either of those trades worked out? There are just so many factors and you can't just assume that if KG came here we would have gone on to win a championship.

[-SDU-]

oh, im sorry, did someone win the 08-09 championship already?

i didnt realise this season was over................