MN - CLE - DET - A Rental Plan!

[the_bruce]

Ok. I don't remember the exact CLE - MN mike miller offer. I think it's something around the lines of Wally + x + their very late 1st for MM + Cardinal. Then I got to thinking about marbury to MN in a trade called Redemption where MN sends out Collins + Wally for the whack job. Then I thought hey how about bundling a small asset like Gomes to the expirings and seeing if we could play rent an Iverson?

Minnesota Timberwolves
Incoming Players: Allen Iverson, Tarence Kinsey, late pick?
Outgoing Players: Jason Collins, Mike Miller, Brian Cardinal, Ryan Gomes, Bassy

Cleveland Cavaliers
Incoming Players: Mike Miller, Brian Cardinal
Outgoing Players: Wally Szczerbiak, Tarence Kinsey, late pick?

Detroit Pistons
Incoming Players: Jason Collins, Wally Szczerbiak, Ryan Gomes, Bassy
Outgoing Players: Allen Iverson

Why for MN?
Might be to little to late, but renting Iverson for a few months could be useful and sell some tickets. A few years to late imo, but pencil in Al for 20, Ai for 25, Smith for 15, 20 from the bench! The best part is our D is so bad that having Ai isn't a liability on defense. Gives me a reason to tune in to a wolves game too!

Why for Cavs?
No brainer imo. The cavs are already a great team, just imagine the open looks MM would get on this team.

Why for DET?
No clue really. Ai is aging but still an amazing player, probably a better fit than an incoming Gomes + wally, but gomes has more actual value long term than Ai because you don't have to overpay him to stay and can be trader to virtual any team in the league since he's fairly versatile. Wally can provide some shooting, and Gomes can provide a lot of little things plus he's on a sweet little contract. Bassy can be left out entirely or kept in.

Al
Love
Carney
Ai
Foye

[_AIJ_]

yes pls... take rasheed too.

sheed
al
carney
ai
foye

[shrink]

Wow! I've never seen a deal like this -- really innovative!

The CLE deal, that Cav fans and most everyone on the trade board seems to think is a good deal for both teams, is:

Miller + Cardinal + Madsen for Wally + Kinsey + TPE + late 1st

The Kinsey addition is used financially to include Madsen in the deal, to increase the value that the Cavaliers are putting in.

The alteration here for us is .. would we include Gomes, Bassy and Collins to upgrade Wally's expiring to Iverson for the season?

I like that the deal would be more appealing to fans and spin the turnstyles a little more. However, casual fans may also come to see Wally, for their memories and his looks -- not so much for his basketball these days.

As near as I can tell, DET is just over the lux. They won't want to take on Collins (he seems unnecessary in the deal. Assuming they are willing to trade Iverson (and they are only 14-10), they may have more incentive to simply try to trade Iverson for less salary, so maybe they wouldn't want both Gomes and Telfair? Gomes is better, so the deal could go:

MIN OUT : Mike Miller, Cardinal, Madsen, Gomes
MIN IN: Iverson, Kinsey

CLE OUT: Szczerbiak, Kinsey, late 1st
CLE IN: Mike Miller, Cardinal, Madsen

DET OUT: Iverson
DET IN: Szcerbiak, Gomes, late 1st

MIN gets its cap savings, and appeases fans by using Gomes and the CLE late 1st to turn Wally into Iverson

CLE gets its Mike Miller package, and goes for a ring

DET rents out Iverson to get some youth, a late pick, and save about $8.5 mil. ($3.5 salary difference plus $3 mil in lux penalties + $2 mil in reclaiming lux share)


Pretty unique idea you've got here bruceallen .. I'd have to think about how much I'd give to make this season more palatable.

[delux55]

Good to shed some salaries but no way Iverson shows up here and even if he did do we want the Few more wins he would bring us.

[the_bruce]

your altered deal is a bit better, I sent Bassy to DET because they lack pg depth. I'm fairly indifferent to either Gomes or Bassy being sent.

I'm not certain what the extra cap gets the wolves. A shot at offering a max\near max contract to Boozer I suppose? Or perhaps the ability to aquire draft picks via giving other teams wiggle room under the lux and/or cap. This has been debated about in many threads and I don't see a huge benefit from doing this for cap room unless it results in the FO pulling the trigger on a bunch of young talent aquisition deals.

There's no great fits at any position for the wing or center spot. I'm just blah about attainable FA's in 2009/2010. Also, there arent many great guards in the next to draft classes as far as I can tell.

[the_bruce]

Good to shed some salaries but no way Iverson shows up here and even if he did do we want the Few more wins he would bring us.

Watch horrific boring games or watch Iverson light up a team for 50 and still lose a similar amount of games? He'd be green lit to shoot the ball here, It would be fun, and it would be great for him too as he's a FA next season and he can demonstrate that he still has plenty left in the tank.

[Liqourish]

From Detroits perspective, they don't want this deal. They want Iversons expiring contract to work in free agency in 2009. They have no use for Wally (Rip is better), Telfair (Stuckey is being groomed to take over) or Gomes (Rip and Tayshaun play 36-40 mpg). And Collins wouldn't be used in Michael Currys small ball rotation. All this deal would do is add around $7 million to next season salary and reduce the room Dumars cleared by trading Chauncey.

[shrink]

From Detroits perspective, they don't want this deal. They want Iversons expiring contract to work in free agency in 2009. They have no use for Wally (Rip is better), Telfair (Stuckey is being groomed to take over) or Gomes (Rip and Tayshaun play 36-40 mpg). And Collins wouldn't be used in Michael Currys small ball rotation. All this deal would do is add around $7 million to next season salary and reduce the room Dumars cleared by trading Chauncey.

Thanks for the perspective. Simplifying even farther, Iverson's expiring is $0.7 mil bigger than Collins + Wally's expiring, so that's about the same.

The AI rental from DET's perspective would be if they think the sweetner MIN added (some selection from Gomes, Telfair, Craig Smith maybe, or a late pick) is worth using small amounts of cap space. The contracts they are on all seem to be pretty cheap to me, and DET needs to fill their roster with cheap guys. However, the questions arise about fit, and it comes down to how big a contract they can offer under the salary cap, and whether they can fill around that cap with adequate, cheap players if they saved the money.

I have to note here, that I had completely forgotten DET's ability to be a player in 2009 free agency, which is more likely now that they aren't a likely contender for a ring with their lackluster start. This makes MIN's plan to clear cap space to be a contender in 2009 free agency less appealing.

[invno1]

So Billups for Szcerbiak, Gomes, late 1st
Ouch

[Liqourish]

I don't think it's bad value wise, it just doesn't fit in with the plans Dumars has for the Pistons moving forward.

Sure, Gomes is a nice player and Telfair could be useful, but right now Dumars would want that capspace to go after a free agent big man and then worry about filling in roster spots with the remaining capspace.

The only way I see Detroit being interested in this deal is if they could make a trade at the deadline for a bigman (Kaman, Amare, etc) without giving up Iverson.

[wolves_fan_82au]

it would be awesome to have AI at minnesota

i reckon hes just what we need