Wolve's Perimeter Defense

HL Slamdunk · Post #1 » by **HL Slamdunk** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 3:24 am

With the offense of the Timberwolves finally showing some life with the resurgence of McCants, Carney, and Foye, and the continued solid play of Jefferson, there are some big defensive weaknesses on this team. The most noticeable defensive weakness to me is perimeter defense (even though our defense against bigs has been hapless).

When the Magic, and other teams for that matter, start to pull away from us late in games, it seems as though we get killed by the 3-ball. For one thing, our defense seems to be confused when the opposing offense gets some good ball movement against us. Is it because we're slow, or is it because we are caught out of position? To me it seems to be a combination of the two. One thing that needs to happen is that McHale needs to get his coaching staff together and be able to come up with some defensive schemes that will allow our defense to be at the right place at the right time in order to contest shots. I also believe that player effort needs to be greater.

john2jer · Post #2 » by **john2jer** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 4:49 am

I don't know if it has anything to do with "schemes", I think it has more to do with the fact most of our guys just flat out don't know how to play defense, period. They need someone to teach them the fundamentals of man-to-man defense and help defense.

Devilzsidewalk · Post #3 » by **Devilzsidewalk** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 12:18 pm

I like when 2 guys rotate to the same player on help D, then realize one guy was left wide open, then they both start running to that guy too :rofl2:

mandurugo · Post #4 » by **mandurugo** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 2:58 pm

You also have to recall that the wolves run out a line-up that is undersized at 4 out of 5 positions - at least. Against Orlando with Turkaglo and Lewis taking a bunch of threes that problem is accentuated. Combine that with a total lack of defensive skill from any of the bigs means that if you're an opposing guard or wing you can choose to take an easy jump shot or to drive with impunity to the rim. Good times.

HL Slamdunk · Post #5 » by **HL Slamdunk** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 3:51 pm

We will get some more height back when Miller returns, but that isn't nearly enough to make up the deficit we face. If we could get Thabeet and or sign a decent free agent that is known to be a good defender, we might be able to improve. The biggest improvement possibility is what John2jer said: We need a coach that stresses defense. I wouldn't mind Flip coming back, Jeff Van Gundy, or just another coach that is known as a defensive specialist.

john2jer · Post #6 » by **john2jer** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 4:42 pm

I don't think Flip was exactly a defensive specialist. He was an offensive specialist with his all jump shooting system. Dunks weren't allowed.

Dwayne Casey and Flip Saunders as co-coaches. Or we could stick them in a particle accelerator and slam them together at the speed of light. If it didn't work, it would at least be fun to see.

TDWOLVESFAN · Post #7 » by **TDWOLVESFAN** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:02 pm

Our perimeter defense does s-u-c-k.
Our guards constantly go under the picks instead of over / thorough the picks.
They also sag to the lane to "help" which consists of swiping at the ball or giving an OLE' to the cutter. When they realize their man is shooting a 3 or that they simply got the ball back, they over pursue or fly through the air trying to block the shot. Foye and McCants are the prime examples of this. I'd make these two watch films of Carney and Brewer playing defense, then practice what they saw. Watch the film - practice, watch-practice etc.

Our somewhat weak interior defense is over taxed by the cutters and the driving guards. Thabeet, if we get him, would help at the rim but wouldn't fix the problem.

We need to hire a defensive specialist - even if it is from the college ranks to teach these guys defensive fundamentals. It's obvious we don't have defensive minded coaches on our staff. We probably can't do this anymore this year unless there is someone who has been fired for NCAA violations etc.

john2jer · Post #8 » by **john2jer** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:17 pm

Jim Molinari! He's currently coaching at Western Illinois University, but he was a defensive specialist for the Gophers under Dan Munson. :-)

HL Slamdunk · Post #9 » by **HL Slamdunk** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:21 pm

I'm not much for x's and o's of basketball, but what are some of the ways we could fix the problem with cutters and driving guards? Is it personnel, coaching, or a combination of the two?

john2jer · Post #10 » by **john2jer** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 5:56 pm

HL Slamdunk wrote:I'm not much for x's and o's of basketball, but what are some of the ways we could fix the problem with cutters and driving guards? Is it personnel, coaching, or a combination of the two?

Defensive is almost 90% heart/motivation/will. Guys like McCants have no will to play defense, they only want to chuck. Which is sad because he has the physical ability, size, and length to be a solid defender.

We don't have the coaching staff to motivate or teach the guys how to play defense. This year is a complete waste already, they should buckle down and not play guys who won't play defense, who won't hustle, and make stupid mistakes. They need an atmosphere change, and that's not going to happen by just bringing in new rookies. They're not held accountable.

TDWOLVESFAN · Post #11 » by **TDWOLVESFAN** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:26 pm

1- You need to stay on the balls of your feet with your weight slightly forward. This allows you to move and change direction easier. Foye and McCants are flat footed so there offensive opponent already has a step on them.

2- Use your peripheral vision to its maximum. If you see someone coming up on your side, chances are they are setting a pick on you. YOUR TEAMMATES SHOULD BE TELLING YOU ABOUT THE PICK.
If you step toward your opponent before the pick is set, you may be able to go through the pick or cause the picker to set a moving screen which is a violation. You may still choose to go around the pick but you won't get bumped off first - saving a step.

3. If you are sagging to help with the double team - be aware if your player's position. If they are floating out you need to go with. Again using your peripheral vision to watch for the possible pass out which you may be able to deflect or steal.

4. If your man is cutting don't just follow him try to be along side of him or between him and the ball. If another teammate steps up to pick up your cutter - you have to put your body between their man and the ball i.e. the passing lane.

In all of these cases, you are being proactive rather than reactive. If the guard and small forward positions each did these things 5 times per game we would probably see a 4-6 point difference in games. - Less 3 pts attempts and lay-ups forcing tougher shots, thus lower the shooting % 2-3 pts per game.

HL Slamdunk · Post #12 » by **HL Slamdunk** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 6:35 pm

Thanks for the info guys (or gals if I'm wrong). When I look at a team like the Gopher's mens basketball team, I realize that the biggest difference between their defensive play under Monson and Tubby is that Tubby lit a fire under the players's rear ends. He wouldn't and still doesn't tolerate a laxidasical effort on the defensive side of the ball. Granted the players are generally slower in college ball than in the NBA, but there should still be a correlation between the motivation the coach gives to the players and the effort of the players. If we could get a guy in here that wouldn't tolerate crappy efforts on defense (i.e. bench players if there is a lack of effort).

Remember: McHale played for a team that basically outscored its opponent night in and night out. Those Celtic teams didn't play much defense. It's also interesting to note that star power goes a long way in getting other players to play tough defense. The presence of Garnett and Allen, not coaching as some may think, made the biggest difference.

Post #13 » by **Calinks** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:59 pm

Yea. I hear the argument that we simply don't have defensive players. This is true to a degree, but still, you can't tell me that NBA basketball players are incapable of playing defense. We could still be much better. A large portion of playing defense has nothing to do with elite athleticism or speed. Everyone is capable of playing decent defensive ball.

HL Slamdunk · Post #14 » by **HL Slamdunk** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 11:19 pm

Yeah, guys like McCants are a dime a dozen in the NBA as far as defense goes. Over the last couple weeks I have actually seen Foyes defense improve as far as aggressiveness goes. It's still not up to where most of us would like it to be, but it's improving, and that's always a good sign.

A1FromDay1 · Post #15 » by **A1FromDay1** » Tue Dec 30, 2008 3:45 pm

TDWOLVESFAN wrote:1- You need to stay on the balls of your feet with your weight slightly forward. This allows you to move and change direction easier. Foye and McCants are flat footed so there offensive opponent already has a step on them.

2- Use your peripheral vision to its maximum. If you see someone coming up on your side, chances are they are setting a pick on you. YOUR TEAMMATES SHOULD BE TELLING YOU ABOUT THE PICK.
If you step toward your opponent before the pick is set, you may be able to go through the pick or cause the picker to set a moving screen which is a violation. You may still choose to go around the pick but you won't get bumped off first - saving a step.

3. If you are sagging to help with the double team - be aware if your player's position. If they are floating out you need to go with. Again using your peripheral vision to watch for the possible pass out which you may be able to deflect or steal.

4. If your man is cutting don't just follow him try to be along side of him or between him and the ball. If another teammate steps up to pick up your cutter - you have to put your body between their man and the ball i.e. the passing lane.

In all of these cases, you are being proactive rather than reactive. If the guard and small forward positions each did these things 5 times per game we would probably see a 4-6 point difference in games. - Less 3 pts attempts and lay-ups forcing tougher shots, thus lower the shooting % 2-3 pts per game.

very good post