is dj the pass first pg that we all thought we were getting?

[coy01]

in college he was primarily a pass first pg, but now in the nba he seems to be a shoot first guard, granted that the bobcats do need someone to carry the scoring load. i don't necessarily think hes been playing selfish, just that he looks for his own rather than to set up his team mates

[Rich4114]

Both of our PG's look for their own shot plenty... I'm not sure you could consider DJ a pass first PG so far. He happens to be a pretty good shooter, an outstanding FT shooter, and can create for himself. Since we've got minimal options on offense I'm not going to complain if DJ is looking to score.

[Felton for Pres]

I wish he were bigger so he could play the 2 and Ray could play 1. He's been a great shooter and general scorer, but certainly not pass first. No one likes to talk about him being a defensive liability either. He's going to be a good PG for us, although I'm not as sold as some of the guys around here the he's the next coming of Chris Paul.

[BobsBuddy]

Boy , you guys drank too much eggnod over Christmas.... DJ IS A TRUE Point and thats why Larry wanted him over Lopez. .... Consider our team lineup right now. DJs assists are going thru Diaw then to Okafore or back to Wallace or Bell. DJ has to shoot more to make up for the loss of Richardson's points at the 2.. Believe me if we had a post up power forward in the paint you wound see more DIRECT assists from DJ. Still need to make one more trade to get to that point.Trade checker# 4892655 After all the talk the last week,,,,I would trade Felton Nazr May to NYK for Curry, Lee and Roberson
Thinking for NYK
Nazr ---still good backup and 2 years remaining on contract like Curry--ready to play 10-15 minutes now per game---can cover currys rebound output..
Felton--- quality 1 or 2 either start him or bring off bench like Gordan in Chicago.--1 year remaining on contract---can cover Lees point output and increases assists for back court.. likes to run alot..
May---Find him a Topless Bar that serves prime rib Sandwichs or Feed him Subways for a month on IR and you might get 5-10 mpg this season-- then contract expires.. free up space to sign LBJ in 2010.

[Dexmor]

Yeah this one is a no brainer. When you have 0 scorers you have to shoot more even if your a pg. We don't have a real scorer on the team. We got energy guys and hustle guys who score that way but that's all.

[BigSlam]

Define what "pass 1st" means.

Is Paul pass first? What about Nash? Kidd?

I mean, Paul averages 11 assists per game, but also takes 13 shots a game. Nash is around 8 assists per game but 11 shots. Sure, Kidd only takes 7 shots per game, but that probably has more to do with him having a history of being a poor shooter/scorer so playing more to his strengths (eg passing and rebounding).

As far as DJ is concerned, he's everything and a little more of what I thought he might be. It's not about making a zillion passes a game for me, it's about making the RIGHT pass and the RIGHT time (which he doesn't always do, but more often than not does). It's also about passing the ball to the right guy, in the right place at the right height where he can best catch it etc.

Watch when DJ passes the ball. His attention to detail in this regard has always been impressive to me. Plus his creativity is also impressive - when passing or shooting.

Remember, he's only a 1/4 way through his 1st NBA season so he's only touching the surface at the moment IMO.

[SamBone]

no but I like what he gives us

[W_HAMILTON]

I don't know what to think of him lately, since he hasn't been playing well since he got that ankle injury (which also coincided with my sig/avatar debut, hmmm....).

As for being a pass-first PG, he's not in the sense that Knight was, where he would dictate and dominate the offense. Chris Paul is the same way, and Augustin hasn't shown to dominate the offense like those two types of pass-first PGs do.

At the same time, he looks natural running the offense, and he makes some great passes and makes some great plays, which is a good sign for someone as young as he is. The fact that he has looked much better offensively than anyone thought makes up for the fact that he isn't as "pass-first" as many of us thought he would be. There's nothing he's done to make me think he is a shoot-first PG, though. Just not quite as pass-first as I thought.

The only thing I've been disappointed with him is his turnovers, some of which seem to happen for no reason at all. It's one thing to turn the ball over trying to force a pass, but he has quite a few turnovers out near the 3pt line, where he'll lose the ball, or get stripped trying to split two defenders, etc. Hopefully that is something he'll work on.

[Dexmor]

I agree with bigslam on his post. I think there is really 2 types of pg's and it's not pass first or score it's real pg's or sg's to short to play there natural position and or short scorers who happen to be good passers like a Marbury. Marbury is a guy who can average 8 assists but is not a true pg he is a scorer.
It is about knowing when to pass and when to shoot and who to pass to. In that aspect even if Paul averaged 25 points and 8 dimes he would still be a true pg and DJ is a true pg.
Felton is not so much. He is a guy who if he was 6'5 he would be Jamal Crawford. If DJ was 6'5 he would still be a pg.

[SamBone]

both DJ and Ray have similar numbers. Both score about the same ppg(Ray scores .5 ppg more but plays about 8 more minutes) both shoot about 40% from the field (DJ slightly higher then Ray but DJ is much better from 3) and Ray averages 6 assists were DJ is only a little over 4 assists. Neither are playing like a true PG. I would love for us to have a PG that averages 8 assists no matter what they score as long as they don't shoot under 35% and/or take 15 shots a game

[freakon0mics]

He looks like a pass first pg to me. I don't know what others see, but I've seen him since his days in Texas and his game has always been pass first score second. The team he's on now needs him to be a scorer and I see him being more aggressive at that first instead of passing. He realizes that he is probably going to be the fastest guy out on the court in any given time and LB is looking to exploit defenses with that.

[SamBone]

Maybe I expect too much, but I can not call a guy that only 3 times this season has recordeded 8 or more assists a "pass first point guard". To me, a "pass first PG" gets double digits (or close) almost every game. Even stiff "pass first pg's" like duhon has had 20+ assist games. DJ may not start, but he does play 30 minutes a game and is the 30th ranked PG in assists, and ranked 21st in shots taken. Too me, that is not a pass first PG

[BigSlam]

Maybe I expect too much, but I can not call a guy that only 3 times this season has recordeded 8 or more assists a "pass first point guard". To me, a "pass first PG" gets double digits (or close) almost every game. Even stiff "pass first pg's" like duhon has had 20+ assist games. DJ may not start, but he does play 30 minutes a game and is the 30th ranked PG in assists, and ranked 21st in shots taken. Too me, that is not a pass first PG

I wonder who he is on the court with the most - meaning, is he on the court with Hammer as Hammer is clanking shots?

Regardless, as I posted earlier, for me it's more about the passes he is trying to make, where he is putting the ball when he passes it and who he passes it to more than the number of assists per game at this stage.

That and the poise he shows for such a young kid.

[SamBone]

Maybe I expect too much, but I can not call a guy that only 3 times this season has recordeded 8 or more assists a "pass first point guard". To me, a "pass first PG" gets double digits (or close) almost every game. Even stiff "pass first pg's" like duhon has had 20+ assist games. DJ may not start, but he does play 30 minutes a game and is the 30th ranked PG in assists, and ranked 21st in shots taken. Too me, that is not a pass first PG

I wonder who he is on the court with the most - meaning, is he on the court with Hammer as Hammer is clanking shots?

Regardless, as I posted earlier, for me it's more about the passes he is trying to make, where he is putting the ball when he passes it and who he passes it to more than the number of assists per game at this stage.

That and the poise he shows for such a young kid.

You are correct, who you are on the court with makes a huge difference, but again to me, a "pass first PG" shooting 40% should pass to the clanking sg (Hammer) who is shooting 43%! I am not knocking DJ, I really like his game (before ankle injury) I just think he shoots more then I would like and should pass more. that is my definition of a "pass first PG". But please remember I am not knock DJ at all

[spectre_]

Eh..."pass first". What is a "pass first" PG? Steve Blake? Brevin Knight? "Pass first" is overrated.

I don't want the PG dominating the ball for 16 seconds out of the shot clock...I want a everyone touching the ball and I want everyone to be a threat to score. Right now Diaw is racking up big assists and the other guys are getting them too. TEAM GAME.

DJ has great court vision...he can find the open guy on a drive whether it's Mek 3 ft away or Hammer on the perimeter, and it'll be in great position. He can hit the deep ball. He can score while driving. I'd much rather have that than a "pass first" PG.

If you want to discuss what's lacking then you need to bring up his defense and sometimes questionable decisions, mainly while he's trying to dribble in the half court. I think the latter will correct itself in time; the former is much more of a concern.

[doc.end]

I agree wih spectre on that one. Just being a "pass-firs" doesn't work, you have to be the player. And I especially like he can adjust and be anything from 3 shots taken against Grizzlies and carrying the team like against Bulls when he proved he can be a go-to guy when team needs him to be. Of course he is having less stellar games but generally he is a great surprise.

Actually I wasn't that thrilled before the draft like many of you here because DJ was hyped as a pure pass first way too much. Luckily he is not second Brevin Knight (not that he was that bad but he wasn't the answer at pg spot).

Assists can lie very easily. Only the guy making the last pass on a team play is credited with the assist no matter what happened before and who disrupted the defense. As long as the team is averaging lots of assist as a team (one man fastbreaks aside) I am happy because it is usually indicates that the offensive flow is good.

[Dexmor]

Yeah the Bobcats have alot of problems but DJ is not one of them. Plus he is a rookie playing with not the most talented players playing hurt off the bench with limited pt. You expect 11 assists a game? Is he on your fantasy team?