New twist on LAC/ATL

SportsFan215 · Post #1 » by **SportsFan215** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 1:35 am

Smoove/Claxton/Hunter for Kaman/Ricky Davis/Novak

Why for ATL?
They get a legit center to move Horford to PF, and they get rid of Claxton's contract for useful expirings.

Why for LAC?
They get younger, and Smoove would fit in with the Clips better than Kaman does.

Note: Kaman could be swapped with Camby if ATL wanted him more, but I thought Kaman still has more value.

Thoughts?

parson · Post #2 » by **parson** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:03 am

I wouldn't be very happy. First of all, Smoove is worth more than Kaman. Secondly, Davis is a negative -- a huge negative -- to me. Third, it doesn't make the team better. I'm assuming that you're trying to improve the team chemistry. Kaman/Horford only works over Horford/Smoove if Horford is much, much better at the 4, and I'm not so sure he will be.

For us to do this, I'd want something substantially more (more than the Clips are willing to pay, I'd bet) such as their 1st, unprotected, this year.

Go over to the Clips board and see how little they like Kaman. Oh sure, they'll want as much as they can get in any trade concerning him, but they really dislike him.

Maybe talking about trades right now is just bad timing, considering the injuries to Smoove (ankle seems to still be bothering him), Marvelous (shoulder), Horford (knee) and - I believe - Joe.

tontoz · Post #3 » by **tontoz** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:29 am

Smith can be very annoying to watch at times but i can't see trading him unless it is for Bosh.

SportsFan215 · Post #4 » by **SportsFan215** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:32 am

First of all Ricky Davis could be easily swapped with Jason Hart if you want. Second how can you say the Clips should give their unprotected first? That very well could be the #1 pick next year, the way the Clips are heading. So basically you are saying Kaman/(Blake Griffin)/etc for Smoove and taking back Speedy's contract.

johnny878 · Post #5 » by **johnny878** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:13 am

Its not like speedy's contract is THAT **** where the hawks have to trade away a great young player to unload it.

next year is speedy's last year under contract for what 5 mil? Definetely doesnt making up the difference in value between Kaman and smith.

plus who the wants ricky davis.

parson · Post #6 » by **parson** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:16 am

Smoove can be a star in this game. In case anyone hasn't noticed, even with his bad ankle, his game is still growing. He's added a drive-to-the-basket game. Kaman is a good guy, nothing more.

Kaman for Smoove is an absolute steal for the Clips. We would need more -- and not just fillers.

td00 · Post #7 » by **td00** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:48 pm

I don't know if Kaman does anything for us, even if you give up Solo and Claxton.

Kaman does not seem like a longterm solution at the 5. You might as well go for a Brad Miller or Dalembert if you are considering Kaman. These guys are just gonna be too expensive.

Camby might be a better fit seeing that he expires next year. He still hurts us at the cap level.

Big men are needed now, but not sure there is enough to give in return to improve.

SportsFan215 · Post #8 » by **SportsFan215** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:21 pm

Kaman could definitely be replaced with Camby.

How about this:

Clippers Get: J. Smith/Wallace/Claxton
Clippers Give: Camby/Randolph/Thornton

Hawks Get: Camby/Felton/May
Hawks Give: J. Smith/Pachulia/Claxton

Bobcats Get: Randolph/Thornton/Pachulia
Bobcats Give: Wallace/Felton/May

raleigh · Post #9 » by **raleigh** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 8:49 pm

The Hawks aren't trading Smith for Camby. That makes no sense on any level.

Smith -for- Kaman can at least be argued...

Skyhawk1 · Post #10 » by **Skyhawk1** » Thu Jan 15, 2009 10:57 pm

parson wrote:Smoove can be a star in this game. In case anyone hasn't noticed, even with his bad ankle, his game is still growing. He's added a drive-to-the-basket game. Kaman is a good guy, nothing more.

Kaman for Smoove is an absolute steal for the Clips. We would need more -- and not just fillers.

I could not disagree more with you. Smith will NEVER be a star in this league for one simple reason, he does not play the game within his limits. Tell me how a PF with his rebounding skills, shot selection, and offensive game can be a star in this league. Anyway, I do not see the Clippers interested in him at all. They got to pay Z. Randolph big money and J. Smith will not take them much further than they are now. As much as I'd love for us to get C. Kaman, or even Camby, I do not see it happening though.

Rip2137 · Post #11 » by **Rip2137** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 12:14 am

mrhonline wrote:The Hawks aren't trading Smith for Camby. That makes no sense on any level.

Smith -for- Kaman can at least be argued...

Chris Kaman is Camby with even worse defense and can't rebound as well. If Camby/Smith takes no sense, Kaman/Smith makes even less sense.

Rip2137 · Post #12 » by **Rip2137** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 12:16 am

Skyhawk1 wrote:
parson wrote:Smoove can be a star in this game. In case anyone hasn't noticed, even with his bad ankle, his game is still growing. He's added a drive-to-the-basket game. Kaman is a good guy, nothing more.

Kaman for Smoove is an absolute steal for the Clips. We would need more -- and not just fillers.

I could not disagree more with you. Smith will NEVER be a star in this league for one simple reason, he does not play the game within his limits. Tell me how a PF with his rebounding skills, shot selection, and offensive game can be a star in this league. Anyway, I do not see the Clippers interested in him at all. They got to pay Z. Randolph big money and J. Smith will not take them much further than they are now. As much as I'd love for us to get C. Kaman, or even Camby, I do not see it happening though.

Ben Wallace was a star in this league off of nothing but weakside shotblocking and rebounding and NO offensive game.

Josh Smith healthy is a 17/8/4 assist/2-3block/1-2 steal guy. Those are star numbers even if you don't like the guy.

SportsFan215 · Post #13 » by **SportsFan215** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:24 am

So would you guys even do a mutli-team deal with ATL getting Camby/Felton/May for Smoove/Claxton/Zaza?

Smoove > Camby but you guys could use a real center.
Zaza = May
Claxton <<<< Felton

Skyhawk1 · Post #14 » by **Skyhawk1** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 8:01 pm

Rip2137, B. Wallace played within his potential. You never saw him come out with crazy plays or things he could not do. That's what makes him a valuable player. He's got a team concept game and he exceled in those categories you mentioned above. J. Smith isn't special at anything, there's many PFs in the league who can't block, get steals, dish it out as J. Smith can, but they're by far better all around players because of the little things they do for their team.

parson · Post #15 » by **parson** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:04 pm

Skyhawk1 wrote: J. Smith isn't special at anything,

I couldn't possibly respond without laughing, so I'll just quote it for emphasis. (By the way, care to name all those who reached 500 blocked shots EARLIER than Smoove?)

But, Skyhawk, take each of your criticisms and ask yourself if Dominique Wilkins comes to mind? See, some things are youth-related and can be overcome. Smoove's got the talent others just dream about.

Rip2137 · Post #16 » by **Rip2137** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 11:21 pm

Skyhawk1 wrote:Rip2137, B. Wallace played within his potential. You never saw him come out with crazy plays or things he could not do. That's what makes him a valuable player. He's got a team concept game and he exceled in those categories you mentioned above. J. Smith isn't special at anything, there's many PFs in the league who can't block, get steals, dish it out as J. Smith can, but they're by far better all around players because of the little things they do for their team.

A: You obviously have never watched Ben wallace play if you are saying he never played outside of his potential.

B: I mean, thats pretty laughable to say he doesn't do alot of things for this team. You have to ignore watching the game AND the stats to say that.

And I went a little short with the list.

Guys like Penny Hardaway, Shawn Kemp and others also became stars in the league without ever putting up monster numbers or much better numbers than Smith. Its not numbers. Its winning. To say Smith won't be a star in the league is just plain silly.

johnny878 · Post #17 » by **johnny878** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 5:17 am

Rip2137 wrote:
mrhonline wrote:The Hawks aren't trading Smith for Camby. That makes no sense on any level.

Smith -for- Kaman can at least be argued...

Chris Kaman is Camby with even worse defense and can't rebound as well. If Camby/Smith takes no sense, Kaman/Smith makes even less sense.

Camby is damn near 50 years old. Thats why it makes no sense. Why would you trade a very young promising player for some one who will be collectin social security in 3 years.

SportsFan215 · Post #18 » by **SportsFan215** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 8:36 pm

^ Maybe because he is leading the league in rebounding and is 2nd in the league in blocks behind Dwight Howard! Yeah, he is 35, but he is a 2010 expiring on a declining contract, and can give the Hawks a good chance at making a run in the playoffs.

Plus in my offer you guys would be getting Raymond Felton basically for the right to get rid of Speedy Claxton!

Gold Chain · Post #19 » by **Gold Chain** » Mon Jan 19, 2009 5:31 pm

You are undervaluing Smith.

No player on the Clippers, bar Al Thornton, is worth him.

SportsFan215 · Post #20 » by **SportsFan215** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 1:49 am

Does this look better for ATL?

Clippers Get: J. Smith/Cook
Clippers Give: Camby/Thornton

Hawks Get: Thornton/Haslem/Blount
Hawks Give: J. Smith/Zaza/Claxton

Heat Get: Camby/Zaza/Claxton
Heat Give: Cook/Haslem/Blount