REBUILD TOO SOON?

[KF10]

Well, I expected a bit more than that, you know? We waited and waited for a deal to come up and that was it? I remember all of those Cav/Mia rumors several years ago. The Cavs offered everyone except James to obtain Bibby but we declined...

Oh well. At least, we did create cap flexibility though...=/

[deNIEd]

Well, I expected a bit more than that, you know? We waited and waited for a deal to come up and that was it? I remember all of those Cav/Mia rumors several years ago. The Cavs offered everyone except James to obtain Bibby but we declined...

Oh well. At least, we did create cap flexibility though...=/

And Beno took away half that flexibility

[KF10]

Well, I expected a bit more than that, you know? We waited and waited for a deal to come up and that was it? I remember all of those Cav/Mia rumors several years ago. The Cavs offered everyone except James to obtain Bibby but we declined...

Oh well. At least, we did create cap flexibility though...=/

And Beno took away half that flexibility

Yeah, I guess. I don't understand why we signed him in a 5 yr contract. I expected a 3 yr duration on MLE level based years. That would have been good for me at least. I don't know why we just jumped the gun and signed him and expected Beno to be the future PG.

[King Baller]

What I'm saying is every indicaton was that the Kings core group could still compete with some tweaking.

is someone agreeing with me?

Man, I loved that team. I hated it when CWebb was injured and was not the same player any more. Chris was great for the Kings. Vlade was pretty much done when he signed with LA. Christie was done to. Bobby was hurt a couple times and looked to be done.

So Petrie tried the trio of Bibby, Miller and Peja. But the magic was gone and so was the defense. They added Shareef and he had a few good games but his tank was empty. To keep that trio together would have required giving Peja the huge deal he got from the Hornets. Peja signed with the Hornets and missed the next season due to injury.

Hindsight is 20/20, I am just saying it LOOKED like that squad could compete post Webber-Vlade-Christie-BJax. But is was really just a mirage. So while I loved those guys I think Petrie has done a pretty good job. I don't think it was his idea to get rid if Adelman. Those Maloof guys also had input in the Artest deal and signing Musselman and Theus.

In the end I think Bill Walsh had it right. Better to trade a guy a year to soon than a year to late.

KB

[pillwenney]

I don't think the attendance has anything to do with the economy because the arena has been half full for a few seasons now. It hasn't been to this extent, but the people of Sacramento have stopped showing up ever since the arena deal on the ballot.

As far as the Kings themselves they have a 70M salary this season and aren't competitive. I'm not going to say the Kings should have started rebuilding earlier but it was a good 18 months it seemed where the team had NO direction. Nobody knew if we were going to go young, with vets, etc and I think that's what killed us.

That's just not true. The sellout streak was still going into Mussleman's tenure. Even if those numbers were fudged, the attendance was still quite good. Last year, I would say it was about average--much, much better than this year. Last year, some games would at least still sell out and the arena was still getting decent, albeit not great numbers. This year, it's like Atlanta when the Hawks sucked.

I didn't mind the package, but I felt that, for the package we got (clearly to clear capspace) it should have triggered Miller's departure as well.

I've said this time and again. It wasn't about cap space, it was about the luxury tax.

[SacKingZZZ]

I've said this time and again. It wasn't about cap space, it was about the luxury tax.

And everyone else has said this, if the luxury tax was such a worry the Kings wouldn't have signed Mikki Moore to the deal they gave him in the first place. I'm pretty sure the Kings would have found another way to get under the tax had Beno not been here, no Bibby trade.

[pillwenney]

I've said this time and again. It wasn't about cap space, it was about the luxury tax.

And everyone else has said this, if the luxury tax was such a worry the Kings wouldn't have signed Mikki Moore to the deal they gave him in the first place. I'm pretty sure the Kings would have found another way to get under the tax had Beno not been here, no Bibby trade.

The team was looking to compete when signing Mikki. When they realized that wasn't going to happen, they decided they had better get under the cap. Not to mention that Mikki was really movable if need be,

Seriously, anybody that doesn't think the luxury tax is important to this team is just plain kidding themselves. It's why we traded Skinner for Pot/Monia. And that was just to get a few hundred thousand under. Keeping Mike instead of trading for the expirings and Shelden and re-signing Beno would have cost the team about an extra $12million this year--and this in a year where they're already losing a ton of money.

[SacKingZZZ]

The team was looking to compete when signing Mikki. When they realized that wasn't going to happen, they decided they had better get under the cap. Not to mention that Mikki was really movable if need be,

Seriously, anybody that doesn't think the luxury tax is important to this team is just plain kidding themselves. It's why we traded Skinner for Pot/Monia. And that was just to get a few hundred thousand under. Keeping Mike instead of trading for the expirings and Shelden and re-signing Beno would have cost the team about an extra $12million this year--and this in a year where they're already losing a ton of money.

I don't think anyone here is saying that it isn't, just that you don't trade one of your top 3 players to simply get under the tax threshold. That Skinner trade? Now that's a move you make to simply get under the tax threshold. Mike Bibby to Atlanta? Not so much. Sure it did factor in, but my guess is that is the Beno situation (tax implications the next year considered I'm sure and his success at PG filling in for Bibby most importantly) factored in even more. Hence, no Beno, no bueno. The rumors were the Kings wanting a PG prospect in return for Bibby, that all changed when Beno showed up so what Petrie was willing to settle for obviously changed. At the time we needed a young big at PF so we came, we saw (or didn't) and conquered that trade...yep.

[pillwenney]

[

I don't think anyone here is saying that it isn't, just that you don't trade one of your top 3 players to simply get under the tax threshold. That Skinner trade? Now that's a move you make to simply get under the tax threshold. Mike Bibby to Atlanta? Not so much. Sure it did factor in, but my guess is that is the Beno situation (tax implications the next year considered I'm sure and his success at PG filling in for Bibby most importantly) factored in even more. Hence, no Beno, no bueno. The rumors were the Kings wanting a PG prospect in return for Bibby, that all changed when Beno showed up so what Petrie was willing to settle for obviously changed. At the time we needed a young big at PF so we came, we saw (or didn't) and conquered that trade...yep.

You do make the trade when the team isn't going to be worth going into the tax for, and that team wasn't. Mike was one of the only options, really. If we had kept him, and not re-signed Beno, we'd be way over the tax--even a little I think if we had never signed Mikki (albeit it would be much closer then--and it's possible I'm wrong).

If Beno hadn't been around, and we couldn't have gotten a PG prospect for Mike, sure Mike might not have been moved. But I guarantee you that the team would have done everything in their power to get back under the tax. The point is that Mike likely wouldn't have been moved if finances weren't such an issue.

[SacKingZZZ]

You do make the trade when the team isn't going to be worth going into the tax for, and that team wasn't. Mike was one of the only options, really. If we had kept him, and not re-signed Beno, we'd be way over the tax--even a little I think if we had never signed Mikki (albeit it would be much closer then--and it's possible I'm wrong).

If Beno hadn't been around, and we couldn't have gotten a PG prospect for Mike, sure Mike might not have been moved. But I guarantee you that the team would have done everything in their power to get back under the tax. The point is that Mike likely wouldn't have been moved if finances weren't such an issue.

I think you're absolutely right about that.

I happen to think Mike Bibby would have been moved regardless since Beno would have most likely left had Mike still been here. That and he had been on the market for like 2 years already. We offered Beno a guaranteed starters spot, still almost lost out to the Clippers anyway.

[pillwenney]

I think you're absolutely right about that.

I happen to think Mike Bibby would have been moved regardless since Beno would have most likely left had Mike still been here. That and he had been on the market for like 2 years already. We offered Beno a guaranteed starters spot, still almost lost out to the Clippers anyway.

If Mike had been here,we probably wouldn't have worked too hard to keep Beno. Regardless, we may have looked to move Mike, but for something that filled the team needs. This was almost entirely a cap move, and it had a lot to do with the fact that moving Mike's contract was going to be the easiest way to get under the tax. The only other possibly viable option would have been Brad, but that would have really been a much harder sell to other teams.

[SacKingZZZ]

If Mike had been here,we probably wouldn't have worked too hard to keep Beno. Regardless, we may have looked to move Mike, but for something that filled the team needs. This was almost entirely a cap move, and it had a lot to do with the fact that moving Mike's contract was going to be the easiest way to get under the tax. The only other possibly viable option would have been Brad, but that would have really been a much harder sell to other teams.

I don't think it even factored in at all, Petrie has supposedly liked Beno for a long time. He almost drafted him and tried to trade for him multiple times, he was going to do what it took to keep him.

[pillwenney]

If Mike had been here,we probably wouldn't have worked too hard to keep Beno. Regardless, we may have looked to move Mike, but for something that filled the team needs. This was almost entirely a cap move, and it had a lot to do with the fact that moving Mike's contract was going to be the easiest way to get under the tax. The only other possibly viable option would have been Brad, but that would have really been a much harder sell to other teams.

I don't think it even factored in at all, Petrie has supposedly liked Beno for a long time. He almost drafted him and tried to trade for him multiple times, he was going to do what it took to keep him.

Sure, and that's why he initially signed him, but I think that if the salary had cleared in some other way, moving Mike wouldn't have been nearly as big of a priority. I don't think he was obsessed with keeping Beno or anything. He just thought he could be a viable option for us.