Tonight, the proof is in the pudding!

[Amel]

the reason why we need to sign Artest and let go of TCrack

give Artest 3-4 years, 10-15 mil a year, and get rid of TCracks salary

and btw, sign that kid Randolph, he's gonna be a bad ass

[T-Wack]

Insightful, as always, Amel.

[Baller 24]

Artest and McGrady play better without each other on the court, Artest coming off the bench was playing great, but you said the same thing last season before the 22 game winning streak, but the impact is impact, and 30% winning percentage without him is quite high, give it some time.

Artest is also inconsistent, oh wait I wrote that entire paragraph before checking the username, *checks username* oh ok, post marked down as irrelevant.

[sook]

sorry to say but artest took some (Please Use More Appropriate Word) ass shots. He palyed the same way he did vs NY and philly, his shot was just falling stop popping a boner this soon

[Guy986]

We do play better as a team without Tmac. At the very least EVERYBODY played hard.

[sook]

We do play better as a team without Tmac. At the very least EVERYBODY played hard.

if we can swing him for rip then sure. T-Mac is here to stay.

[Iggyemu]

I completely disagree. McGrady isn't the answer. But neither is Artest. He takes too many long 3s...doesn't do enough work in the paint which is supposed to be his strength. I see them both as players with the same amount of weakness...just different weaknesses.

I just don't see this guy as a long term solution for this team. He is a lot more inconsistent than I thought. I have been disappointed with him this season. His defense isn't as great but it has been solid. His offense...unless he is making his 3 point shot he isn't playing well offensively. He was 4-5 tonight on 3s. He shot well in Detroit from 3. He didn't against the Knicks and Sixers. You don't invest in a guy that can't have an offensive impact unless he is making 3s. You might as well sign Mike Miller if thats the case.

[MaxRider]

Artest and McGrady play better without each other on the court, Artest coming off the bench was playing great, but you said the same thing last season before the 22 game winning streak, but the impact is impact, and 30% winning percentage without him is quite high, give it some time.

Artest is also inconsistent, oh wait I wrote that entire paragraph before checking the username, *checks username* oh ok, post marked down as irrelevant.

T-Mac and Artest played pretty well against Detroit without Yao
the problem is those 3 don't know how to play with each other
they need to play and figure out themselve

[Amel]

We do play better as a team without Tmac. At the very least EVERYBODY played hard.

thats the reason we cant pass the first round and be a serious contenter

TCracks attitude on the court does not give anyone a reason to make it further

he brings this lazy attitude with him and lures everyone into it

[coolblade587]

Didn't out 22 game winning streak start last year at this time with Golden State being the first Victim? I feel one coming.

[TMACFORMVP]

^^
And T-Mac missed that game too, lol.

But really this game didn't prove anything. A stretch of 20 plus games where we're healthy will prove how good this team can really be, but I agree T-Mac's mentality won't lead us places, but let's not kid ourselves pretending Artest will.

[YoungMoney23]

We do play better as a team without Tmac. At the very least EVERYBODY played hard.

thats the reason we cant pass the first round and be a serious contenter

TCracks attitude on the court does not give anyone a reason to make it further

he brings this lazy attitude with him and lures everyone into it

Bad attitude or not, He's been the only thing thats kept us in the playoffs the past 2 years

[Baller 24]

We do play better as a team without Tmac. At the very least EVERYBODY played hard.

thats the reason we cant pass the first round and be a serious contenter

TCracks attitude on the court does not give anyone a reason to make it further

he brings this lazy attitude with him and lures everyone into it

Stop the hate, seriously. McGrady gets blamed on his first round hate way to much, he's been there every year putting up solid statistics. 6th in playoffs PER, 4th in playoffs PPG, 30/7/7 against the Mavericks, 27/7/7 against the Jazz, and 29/13 (Where he assisted on every shot except like 4 the entire game) in game 7 against the Jazz where both superstars were at fault. Yet you blame him for the lack of role players not showing up? Battier shooting 33%, Barry shooting 20%, Wesely shooting under 30%, James shooting under 30%----really? Even in Orlando, he's been a fabulous playoff performer, quit the hate, or try and get a hold of Daryl Morey, it's getting ridiculous and irreverent.

[franchise73]

We do play better as a team without Tmac. At the very least EVERYBODY played hard.

thats the reason we cant pass the first round and be a serious contenter

TCracks attitude on the court does not give anyone a reason to make it further

he brings this lazy attitude with him and lures everyone into it

Stop the hate, seriously. McGrady gets blamed on his first round hate way to much, he's been there every year putting up solid statistics. 6th in playoffs PER, 4th in playoffs PPG, 30/7/7 against the Mavericks, 27/7/7 against the Jazz, and 29/13 (Where he assisted on every shot except like 4 the entire game) in game 7 against the Jazz where both superstars were at fault. Yet you blame him for the lack of role players not showing up? Battier shooting 33%, Barry shooting 20%, Wesely shooting under 30%, James shooting under 30%----really? Even in Orlando, he's been a fabulous playoff performer, quit the hate, or try and get a hold of Daryl Morey, it's getting ridiculous and irreverent.

Finally someone who has common sence. very well put baller

[Iggyemu]

thats the reason we cant pass the first round and be a serious contenter

TCracks attitude on the court does not give anyone a reason to make it further

he brings this lazy attitude with him and lures everyone into it

You have said some ridiculous things on this board..this IMO tops it. The reason we don't win in the playoffs is not because we play lazy or don't play hard. Its b/c we lack the talent to match up with more talented teams. Everybody plays hard in the playoffs. Everybody. Thats when talent has to take over. This team didn't have the talent in the past. Now they may have the talent now but everyone is inconsistent that it makes whatever we have on paper worthless.

In his time in Houston out of the 3 playoff series this team has been in McGrady didn't do what was needed to win in 1 series and in one game in that series. That was Jazz game 6 when we had a chance to close em out and they were shooting bricks in the 4th. Where a more determined player would take over...McGrady did not. Instead he let his teammates try to win it and they could not. He essentially cost us that series within that one stretch. Other than that....everyone else on this team including Yao have been wildly inconsistent in the playoffs.

There are so many problems with this team thats simply unfair to heap it on one guy. When Okur was giving Yao trouble...or the small line up of Dallas rendered him useless. Where is the blame for that? When Alston, Wesley, Sura and the numerous PGs we had could not contain the other teams PG in Deron Williams and Jason Terry...where is the blame for that? You heap all of that McGrady? Are you stupid?

Now this is just silly on your behalf. There is noway one person is the sole reason this team has not won a playoff series. And the way you make it sound is like he is the reason those other guys struggle. Thats completely ridiculous. This not a league of children. Those guys are men that get paid just like he does. Those guys live in mansions just like he does. There are expected to perform just like he does.

Everyone on this board knows we can't win with McGrady. Most of us also know that we can't do it with Artest and some of us are unsure whether we can do with Yao. In other words....this team is filled with losers who are struggling to become winners. And what we see..is that manifesting itself and no one man is the blame for that. You have to be called out for idiotic posts like this. Plain and simple...

This team right now consist of these things. Yao works hard but he is soft. McGrady is tough but doesn't work hard and not mentally strong. And Artest refuses to buy into a team concept. Guys like Alston, Brooks are wildly inconsistent on both ends of the floor to be counted on to pick the 'mediocre 3' up. You wanna tell me and anyone else that one man is responsible for the downfall of this team. What the hell is wrong with you?

[aznkillabeezZz]

no need for a long explanation. As good as artest is, he's undersized , has trouble scoring against bigs. Tmac isn't the answer either. He's in a worse condition than the other playoffs he's ever been on. Yao isn't an answer either, he's too clumsy, slow, low stamina and turnover prone. We have three streaky shooters at best. Yao being the most consistent. We might get out of the first round, narrowly, if ever. But we won't pass the 2nd round with this lineup.

[langer]

It is hard to tell, or it is too early to conclude anything. But, I believe Ron could lead this team to the final. TMAC? sorry, he would never become a leader of a chairmanship.

[Baller 24]

It is hard to tell, or it is too early to conclude anything. But, I believe Ron could lead this team to the final. TMAC? sorry, he would never become a leader of a chairmanship.

Yet his playoff numbers state other wise, despite not being out of the first round, McGrady has been a fabulous playoff performer, he's been there; don't blame him for his teammates messing up and IMO both Yao and McGrady are at fault in '07, they both could have saved this team, but they didn't, choked.

[Amel]

thats the reason we cant pass the first round and be a serious contenter

TCracks attitude on the court does not give anyone a reason to make it further

he brings this lazy attitude with him and lures everyone into it

You have said some ridiculous things on this board..this IMO tops it. The reason we don't win in the playoffs is not because we play lazy or don't play hard. Its b/c we lack the talent to match up with more talented teams. Everybody plays hard in the playoffs. Everybody. Thats when talent has to take over. This team didn't have the talent in the past. Now they may have the talent now but everyone is inconsistent that it makes whatever we have on paper worthless.

In his time in Houston out of the 3 playoff series this team has been in McGrady didn't do what was needed to win in 1 series and in one game in that series. That was Jazz game 6 when we had a chance to close em out and they were shooting bricks in the 4th. Where a more determined player would take over...McGrady did not. Instead he let his teammates try to win it and they could not. He essentially cost us that series within that one stretch. Other than that....everyone else on this team including Yao have been wildly inconsistent in the playoffs.

There are so many problems with this team thats simply unfair to heap it on one guy. When Okur was giving Yao trouble...or the small line up of Dallas rendered him useless. Where is the blame for that? When Alston, Wesley, Sura and the numerous PGs we had could not contain the other teams PG in Deron Williams and Jason Terry...where is the blame for that? You heap all of that McGrady? Are you stupid?

Now this is just silly on your behalf. There is noway one person is the sole reason this team has not won a playoff series. And the way you make it sound is like he is the reason those other guys struggle. Thats completely ridiculous. This not a league of children. Those guys are men that get paid just like he does. Those guys live in mansions just like he does. There are expected to perform just like he does.

Everyone on this board knows we can't win with McGrady. Most of us also know that we can't do it with Artest and some of us are unsure whether we can do with Yao. In other words....this team is filled with losers who are struggling to become winners. And what we see..is that manifesting itself and no one man is the blame for that. You have to be called out for idiotic posts like this. Plain and simple...

This team right now consist of these things. Yao works hard but he is soft. McGrady is tough but doesn't work hard and not mentally strong. And Artest refuses to buy into a team concept. Guys like Alston, Brooks are wildly inconsistent on both ends of the floor to be counted on to pick the 'mediocre 3' up. You wanna tell me and anyone else that one man is responsible for the downfall of this team. What the hell is wrong with you?

very well

but wait until we get to the playoffs, you'll see Mac limping and playing with 50%

he should have gotten us to the second round long time ago, he did not, nor will he

I bet ya, that Yao trust more Artest or even Von of doing a decent job when it comes to giving all

Yea, Yao is limited, doh, he is 7'6, you will never see a 7'6 that agile

TCrack can do it all, well bring us to the second round...

The guys who will get us to the second round are Scola, Artest, Brooks, Von and the rest of the bench

[moofs]

-1 Thread, but probably iggy's best post ever.