Mon Feb 9th GT: Charlotte Vs LA Clippers 7:00pm

[thruthefire]

I didn't say it's unfair, I said that it's stupid.

DJ's original role was to provide a spark off of the bench. When he starts, it's to provide ball handling, create shots for others but mostly still to provide efficient scoring out of the backcourt.

Felton's role (since his first day on the team) is to be the floor general.

My main point is that I think pgs that aren't a threat to score (or worse-- that are chuckers) but can pass are just as flawed as DJ Augustin type guards. Posters used to RIP on BK because he couldn't shoot and everyone knew he wanted to pass the ball. He racked up assists, but the argument went that Felton gave us a better chance to win because he could pass AND score. Years later, Felton can only do one of those things at an efficient rate, but he gets a pass because he "looks more like a pg". I just don't get what that means.

On the other end, we have a rookie pg that has completed half of a season and is 4th amongst rookies in assists but since he can actually shoot he gets knocked for "looking more like a sg". It's madness.

I don't think it's because he can shoot. Steve Nash is a hell of a shooter and I wouldn't say he looks more like a sg then a pg. When Augustin drives to the basket he looks to score first annd I don't think he runs pick and rolls or pops as well. Like I said, I love what DJ brings to the table and I would not label him a shooting guard, but he is a pure pg only by size.

And when I say Felton looks more like a pg, I mean the offense seems to run better with him at the point then with DJ at the point.

[BigSlam]

Okay. You're right. That last post finally convinced me that DJ is more of a SG than a PG and Felton is pretty much the ideal.

Well, you're saying it's unfair to compare Felton in his fourth season to Augustin in his rookie season so, I used Felton's rookie season to support my opinion.

A rookie season where Felts was the primary ball handler when he was on the court at the point? He was the only guy running and initiating the offense (other than the small amount of times he and BK were on the court together). Of course his assist numbers were higher.

Since adding guys like Boris, we are sharing the ball more and there are more people getting assists (the way it should be). We aren't going to have a dominate PG racking up 15apg in LB's system (the way it should be). Everyone is going to pull their weight.

DJ is playing in the system. He's hitting and taking his shots, he's creating for others. You just have to watch him pass to know that if he wanted to and if the system allowed he would rack up double digit assists every game, but there is no need to do that because he plays within the structure of the team.

The only difference between Felts and DJ is that DJ can hit the long ball, the mid range, drive and his FT's. They both play similar D and they both can create for others.

[Walt Cronkite]

Check out Nash's assist totals his first years in Dallas when he was getting DJ type minutes

I'm agreeing with you on your final sentence because the offense SHOULD run better with Felton at the point than DJ, he's in a contract year, etc, etc, etc, regurgitated points ad nauseam.

Hypothetically, what would everyone be saying if DJ wasn't looking for his shot and was still playing a ton of minutes on the floor with Felton?

[thruthefire]

Okay. You're right. That last post finally convinced me that DJ is more of a SG than a PG and Felton is pretty much the ideal.

Well, you're saying it's unfair to compare Felton in his fourth season to Augustin in his rookie season so, I used Felton's rookie season to support my opinion.

A rookie season where Felts was the primary ball handler when he was on the court at the point? He was the only guy running and initiating the offense (other than the small amount of times he and BK were on the court together). Of course his assist numbers were higher.

Since adding guys like Boris, we are sharing the ball more and there are more people getting assists (the way it should be). We aren't going to have a dominate PG racking up 15apg in LB's system (the way it should be). Everyone is going to pull their weight.

DJ is playing in the system. He's hitting and taking his shots, he's creating for others. You just have to watch him pass to know that if he wanted to and if the system allowed he would rack up double digit assists every game, but there is no need to do that because he plays within the structure of the team.

The only difference between Felts and DJ is that DJ can hit the long ball, the mid range, drive and his FT's. They both play similar D and they both can create for others.

In Felton's rookie season he played a lot off the ball. Felton and Knight were on the court together quite a bit. I don't know were you got "small amount of time" from. Felton averaged 30 minutes per night and Knight averaged 34. And even if we go by your opinion, I don't see how that accounts for assist to turnover ratio.

I agree with you about LB's system. Felton's assists have been down from previous seasons, but to say DJ could rack up double digit assists every night if the system allowed is a stretch for me.

And are you saying Felton can't drive or hit free throws? No doubt Augustin is the better shooter, but Felton's a very good free throw shooter and can get to the rim better than DJ. Also I would disagree with them being similar defensively. Felton's much better at staying in front of his man and can guard bigger players. His much more of a ball-hawk and a heck of a blocker for a pg.

[BigSlam]

In Felton's rookie season he played a lot off the ball. Felton and Knight were on the court together quite a bit. I don't know were you got "small amount of time" from. Felton averaged 30 minutes per night and Knight averaged 34. And even if we go by your opinion, I don't see how that accounts for assist to turnover ratio.

Look who he was playing with and the way the team played then. BB had three plays, and each of them involved the PG getting the ball to the person shooting the ball. We rarely shared the ball around, which meant that the PG's were always going to get the lions share of assists.

In his rookie season BK averaged 9 assists per game and Felts 6. The next CLOSEST was Crash with 1.8 a game.

Now we have guys like DJ, Felts, Raja and Boris all sharing the ball. This year Felts is averaging 7 a game and DJ 4 a game (in 10 less min per game) - but also, Boris is averaging 5 a game, Raja 3 a game and there are 3 other players who average 2 or more assists per game.

I can't believe you are basing assist numbers on who is a better PG. The only reason that Felts numbers might make him appear to be a better "pure point" is because his assist numbers far outweigh his shooting percentages. Felts averages 14 shots per game. It's not like he's like Rondo and only takes 8 shots per game.

I agree with you about LB's system. Felton's assists have been down from previous seasons, but to say DJ could rack up double digit assists every night if the system allowed is a stretch for me.

He averaged 6 a game at Texas without dominating the ball. He's a creative passer who makes quick decisions and puts the ball in peoples "sweet spots". It's not a stretch to think he could average double digit assists - especially considering 4 a game in only 28mpg playing 2nd fiddle to Felts.

And are you saying Felton can't drive or hit free throws? No doubt Augustin is the better shooter, but Felton's a very good free throw shooter and can get to the rim better than DJ.

Funny you should say that, because in TEN LESS mpg, DJ goes to the line 3.3 times - the EXACT same number that Felts does in ten mins more per game. The only difference is that DJ hits on 91% of them and Felts 79%.

Any way, I didn't want to get into the whole DJ Vs Felts thing again (and yet, here I am!!). I'm going to sign off now by saying that I like them both, they both have great strengths and both have weaknesses. I just don't like it when people read DJ the wrong way or paint him with a brush when he as only played 41 games. Maybe if we are still talking about the same flaws he has now in 4 years time (like splitting a double team) then you might have something, but up until then, I think there is just too much protection of Felts for people to be fair to either player.

[thruthefire]

Fair enough. Don't agree with everything you said, but no point in going back and fourth.

Oh, and Felton doesn't take 14 shots a game and it's not like DJ's shooting % is much higher than Felton's.