RealGM Top 100 All-Time List

[Baller 24]

Well it's a career accomplishment list. I agree though, LeBron is way ahead of his league in terms of career, and this was done before the start of the season. If LeBron win an MVP this season, I guess it wouldn't look that bad.

[Warspite]

Wow... I find it quite unbelievable how underrated Oscar Robertson is.. The man is top 5-7 in nearly every basketball circle.
IMO, Magic >> Kareem, and Kobe >> Jerry West.
Charles Barkley is also quite underrated. He's better than KG and should not be that much lower ranked than Malone.
Lebron James already cracking the top 50 is pretty laughable. (better than Jkidd, Nique and Worthy??)
Iverson barely in the top 50 is a damn shame.
Adrian Dantley is underrated IMO. Should be top 30.

Guess I'm just nitpicking.. Don't even know if it's the place to voice displeasures or not.

This a the kind of post I want to see. Theres no doubt LBJ is too high and the ballot box was stuffed for him. Once LBJ was voted in over 50% of the voters retired and never voted again. It was a consipiracy to get him in as high as possible. Those things happen in a Democracy.

I cant see how Magic could ever be higher than KAJ especialy on a career/longevity list. IMHO the differance between KAJ and Magic is as far as Magic is from LBJ. I would bet that if you took the last 500 NBA GMs and gave them a choice between the 2 Magic wouldnt get 1 vote.

AI is maybe underrated and he certainly will move up as time goes by. Dantley who is my fav player should be top 50 but 30 is rarified air and w/o a ring or MVP its hard to get there.

Charles IMHO is a top 15 player of all time but in reality the differance between say 12-25 is very small. The biggest problem with Chalres is that most people only count his play as a Sun and not as a 76er because he wasnt on TV that much.

[penbeast0]

The fact that Iverson and Nique are two of the players you feel are badly underrated tells me your criteria . . . volume scoring that doesn't help your team that much. Both are relatively inefficient volume scorers with poor defense and average at best secondary skills (if you consider Iverson to be competing with PGs, which I think you have to considering his size and skill set).

Barkley and Dantley also were downgraded by many voters as playing only one side of the court (no d) and not always being good team players though they are among the top 10 most devastating offensive players in history (unlike the overrated Nique and Iverson). Garnett v. Barkley again looks at defense as well as offense, plus team leadership and the ring to make it a clear decision in favor of Garnett.

As for Oscar, when he was playing, his peers rated he and West 1A and 1B with a lot of debate over who was better; I rate it Oscar >= West > Kobe though if Kobe wins a ring as the main man, I will have to reevaluate as we had to do for Kevin Garnett.

Finally, LeBron got there on 5.5 seasons as good as any player to ever play his position, competitive with Bird and Erving, though he doesn't have the longevity. Other players in the top 50 played less at a peak level (Walton) and several were only truly outstanding for about 5 years (McAdoo, Archibald, etc.) so I don't think it's unreasonable to have LeBron over them. I supported him at the time he went in; comparing him to the players he was up against it was a reasonable though far from clear cut choice. If you think he is grossly overrated, name 5 players that should be ahead of him then look to see if they compare in terms of peak value, team play, and two way play (LeBron is turning into a very good defender). If they are at least comparable on those counts, then longevity should hurt LeBron but if not, then it's a question of how much you weight peak v. longevity. If LeBron were injured today and never played again, I think he goes into the HOF; I don't think that's true of any of the other players with less than 8 years experience playing today . . . including DWade whose injury issues have undercut his value so far leaving him with only one truly great year rather than close to 5.

[UKfan 1]

Ok, wow absolutly no Love for Reggie Miller, I mean really, Penny i had a 4 year career Hardaway is a nominee, and Reggie cant get any love what so ever. People are nominating Chauncy freaking Billups but Reggie gets nothing, and this is coming from someone who absoultly hated Miller when he was playing. I wont comment on people before my time but as far as people i know fair amount about the people on this list that Id take Miller over are:
1. Webber
2. Rodman(yes hes a great defensive player and rebounder, but also complety insane, and if you dont have strong personalities and leaders around him, hes more likely sink your team then help it.)
3. Mutumbo and Mourning, though i can just as easily see the argument for them being in over miller as well.
4. Grant Hill(injuries)
5. T Mac
6. Iverson( I know peak is much higher, carried sixers to the finals, but overall through his career as the poseter above me mentioned hes a volume scorer that doesnt help the team much.)
7. Dirk
8. Steve Nash

Well thats it, enjoy rippeing me apart.

[Warspite]

Ok, wow absolutly no Love for Reggie Miller, I mean really, Penny i had a 4 year career Hardaway is a nominee, and Reggie cant get any love what so ever. People are nominating Chauncy freaking Billups but Reggie gets nothing, and this is coming from someone who absoultly hated Miller when he was playing. I wont comment on people before my time but as far as people i know fair amount about the people on this list that Id take Miller over are:
1. Webber
2. Rodman(yes hes a great defensive player and rebounder, but also complety insane, and if you dont have strong personalities and leaders around him, hes more likely sink your team then help it.)
3. Mutumbo and Mourning, though i can just as easily see the argument for them being in over miller as well.
4. Grant Hill(injuries)
5. T Mac
6. Iverson( I know peak is much higher, carried sixers to the finals, but overall through his career as the poseter above me mentioned hes a volume scorer that doesnt help the team much.)
7. Dirk
8. Steve Nash




Well thats it, enjoy rippeing me apart.

Unfortunetly who UKfan1 likes was not a critera for the rankings. awards, allstar games, all NBA selections and rings are important and Reggie lacks in all areas. Only 4 allstar games, no 2nd team all NBA, no rings, no awards of any kind. Hes just a great shooter that had some good games in MSG. A rich mans Del Curry.

[TheSheriff]

Ok, wow absolutly no Love for Reggie Miller, I mean really, Penny i had a 4 year career Hardaway is a nominee, and Reggie cant get any love what so ever. People are nominating Chauncy freaking Billups but Reggie gets nothing, and this is coming from someone who absoultly hated Miller when he was playing. I wont comment on people before my time but as far as people i know fair amount about the people on this list that Id take Miller over are:
1. Webber
2. Rodman(yes hes a great defensive player and rebounder, but also complety insane, and if you dont have strong personalities and leaders around him, hes more likely sink your team then help it.)
3. Mutumbo and Mourning, though i can just as easily see the argument for them being in over miller as well.
4. Grant Hill(injuries)
5. T Mac
6. Iverson( I know peak is much higher, carried sixers to the finals, but overall through his career as the poseter above me mentioned hes a volume scorer that doesnt help the team much.)
7. Dirk
8. Steve Nash




Well thats it, enjoy rippeing me apart.

Unfortunetly who UKfan1 likes was not a critera for the rankings. awards, allstar games, all NBA selections and rings are important and Reggie lacks in all areas. Only 4 a llstar games, no 2nd team all NBA, no rings, no awards of any kind. Hes just a great shooter that had some good games in MSG. A rich mans Del Curry.

Exactly. Ray Allen (who will probably make the top 100) will go over Reggie (who might not).

[penbeast0]

Reggie belongs in the top 100, either just before or just after Ray Allen (I rate Allen a hair higher). He is starting to get mentions and should make it in sometime in the 80s/90s

[ronnymac2]

We need to update this list....2 great players just added some major awards to their resumes.....

[TMACFORMVP]

I think Kobe goes ahead of the Doctor after tonight's performance.

[Warspite]

Sorry awards won during exibition games dont count.

If it did wouldnt Connie Hawkins playground and Rucker league stats count??

[ronnymac2]

Sorry awards won during exibition games dont count.

If it did wouldnt Connie Hawkins playground and Rucker league stats count??

They do count. Thus, why I'm going to nominate Rafer Alston next.

[shawngoat23]

Sorry awards won during exibition games dont count.

If it did wouldnt Connie Hawkins playground and Rucker league stats count??

They do count. Thus, why I'm going to nominate Rafer Alston next.

Skip to my Lou has nothing on The Air Up There.

[TMACFORMVP]

Alston is such an underrated defender, lol.

[Yell_42]

Tim Duncan ahead of Karl Malone?

[Yell_42]

We need to update this list....2 great players just added some major awards to their resumes.....

The All Star MVP is a major award? LOL


It is a joke of an award.

[Baller 24]

Tim Duncan ahead of Karl Malone?

4 Rings > 0 Rings
3 Finals MVPs > 0 Finals MVPs
Duncan's 2003 Team < Malone's Two Finals Teams (And Duncan Still Won a Ring)

Therefore Duncan > Malone

We need to update this list....2 great players just added some major awards to their resumes.....

The All Star MVP is a major award? LOL


It is a joke of an award.

He was joking.

[carrottop12]

Frazier is too high.

[Baller 24]

Frazier is too high.

No he's not, it's more than just statistics regarding him.

[firefox390]

The Top 20 Greatest
1. Michael Jordan
2. Wilt Chamberlain
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
4. Bill Russell
5. Magic Johnson
6. Larry Bird
7. Oscar Robertson
8. Shaquille O'Neal
9. Tim Duncan
10. Hakeem Olajuwon
11. Elgin Baylor
12. George Mikan
13. Kobe Bryant
14. Jerry West
15. Moses Malone
16. Julius Erving
17. Kevin Garnett
18. John Havlicek
19. Karl Malone
20. Bob Pettit

Factors to consider:
- Rings
- Individual honors
- Competition or difficulty of the era
- Stats
- impact in the game

[penbeast0]

Not a bad list; I don't see it as a great improvement on the one that we actually came up with as a consensus . . . about the same level of agreement with my personal list as the group one.

There are a number of arguments that can be made, to take just one . . . Elgin Baylor being at 11 ahead of Jerry West and Bob Pettit (ignoring people who weren't his contemporaries) . . . West had equivalent honors, was more efficient, played better defense, had his peak in a tougher era . . . Pettit also was rated slightly higher during the period where they were both in their peaks, had slightly more individual honors, won a ring over the Celtics which Baylor was unable to do, and was just a slightly superior player.