College players thread/ Draft Related thread

NewWolvesOrder · Post #1341 » by **NewWolvesOrder** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:36 pm

revprodeji wrote:I agree, but that is the reason why he is a poor-man. Similar skill set but not that level.

well I just disagree, I don't see JJ as a top tier player, he's very good, borderline allstar, but not a superstar, so i don't undertand why a highly skilled player with prototypical nba body like Turner cannot match JJ's level, maybe you never saw him play? :dontknow:

Post #1342 » by **revprodeji** » Wed Mar 25, 2009 11:53 pm

So if someone disagrees with you then you assume that they have never seen him play? I am sure you will bring value to these boards.

JJ is one of the top "next level" swing players. Not at the Kobe/Lebron level, but at the Brandon Roy level.

Better than Ray allen/Vince carter/Iggy/Gordon/Deng/Granger/Wallace/

Same level as Roy

Not as good as Wade/Lebron/Kobe

He is a legit star.

Turner has many of the same gifts. Similiar body type, but is not at that level. Hence the "poor man". His ceiling is Joe Johnson/Grant hill but he is more likely going to not be at that level.

If Turner was near that level than he would clearly be up there with Griffin and Rubio.

Jonathan Watters · Post #1343 » by **Jonathan Watters** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 12:06 am

revprodeji wrote:
Henderson is considered a more pure scorer. A Jrich/Finley type. Turner would be a poor man Joe Johnson. Great if he puts it all together but Jalen Rose if he does not.

Warren does nothing for me and should not be on the draft board.

Jalen Rose if he doesn't put it together?

Sounds like the #1 pick to me!

NewWolvesOrder · Post #1344 » by **NewWolvesOrder** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 12:11 am

revprodeji wrote:So if someone disagrees with you then you assume that they have never seen him play? I am sure you will bring value to these boards.

JJ is one of the top "next level" swing players. Not at the Kobe/Lebron level, but at the Brandon Roy level.

Better than Ray allen/Vince carter/Iggy/Gordon/Deng/Granger/Wallace/

Same level as Roy

Not as good as Wade/Lebron/Kobe

He is a legit star.

Turner has many of the same gifts. Similiar body type, but is not at that level. Hence the "poor man". His ceiling is Joe Johnson/Grant hill but he is more likely going to not be at that level.

If Turner was near that level than he would clearly be up there with Griffin and Rubio.

JJ was drafted 10th in a weak draft(2001), he was considered one of those players thal do alot of thing well but none of them great, he developed his game with time and made a name for himself in NBA, so denying the possibility of Turner doing the same seems ignorant to me.

and Griffin and Rubio have higher ceiling than JJ, and i don't think it's just my opinion.

Post #1345 » by **revprodeji** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 1:02 am

james harden wrote:JJ was drafted 10th in a weak draft(2001), he was considered one of those players thal do alot of thing well but none of them great, he developed his game with time and made a name for himself in NBA, so denying the possibility of Turner doing the same seems ignorant to me.

and Griffin and Rubio have higher ceiling than JJ, and i don't think it's just my opinion.

I do not think anyone thought JJ would put it together like he did. Boston pretty much gave up on him. In phx he is mostly a scorer. I am not denying Turner could do the same thing, just saying it is unlikely.

Jonathan Watters wrote:Jalen Rose if he doesn't put it together?
Sounds like the #1 pick to me!

To a large extent Jalen Rose was a long time 6th man journeyman. First 4-5 years was nothing special. Did not develop as a pseudo-star until much later.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... eja01.html

Jonathan Watters · Post #1346 » by **Jonathan Watters** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:21 am

revprodeji wrote:
Jonathan Watters wrote:Jalen Rose if he doesn't put it together?
Sounds like the #1 pick to me!

To a large extent Jalen Rose was a long time 6th man journeyman. First 4-5 years was nothing special. Did not develop as a pseudo-star until much later.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... eja01.html

I'm not about to try and argue this since I can't convince anybody around here that the sky is blue once they've said that it is neon green, but if you think he's Jalen Rose if he doesn't put it together...

He ought to go #1. No doubt about it.

And for the record, I think if he does put it together he'll be Jalen Rose. No more. People comparing him to Joe Johnson are insane, he's not even close to Johnson as an athlete.

Sure, he plays a little like Brandon Roy and we're all dying for a Brandon Roy clone. But Brandon Roy he's not...

big3_8_19_21 · Post #1347 » by **big3_8_19_21** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:37 am

I'm going to have to side with Watters on this one. Career averages of roughly 14, 4 and 4 on 44% from the field for a guy that "never really got it together" would be incredible. If that's the WORST case scenario and you can only go up from there, we should be praying for him.

Krapinsky · Post #1348 » by **Krapinsky** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 4:51 am

Jonathan Watters wrote:[
I'm not about to try and argue this since I can't convince anybody around here that the sky is blue once they've said that it is neon green, but if you think he's Jalen Rose if he doesn't put it together...

He ought to go #1. No doubt about it.

And for the record, I think if he does put it together he'll be Jalen Rose. No more. People comparing him to Joe Johnson are insane, he's not even close to Johnson as an athlete.

Sure, he plays a little like Brandon Roy and we're all dying for a Brandon Roy clone. But Brandon Roy he's not...

I think it's too early to make conclusions like this when projecting Turner. He's only a sophomore and improved greatly in the last year, while Roy didn't start putting it together until his senior year. Obviously the top 5 teams in the draft in 2006 (?) didn't think Brandon Roy would be Brandon Roy, so it's really just too early.

Maybe it's just his looks, but if Turner ever develops an outside J, then I see a little T-Mac in him only with less athleticism than McGrady when he was in his prime. Come to think of it, that's probably pretty close to Jalen. I'm with Watters there though, Jalen was pretty good in his Indiana days.

Frozen316 · Post #1349 » by **Frozen316** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:12 am

http://realgm.net/src_feature_pieces/75 ... ke_forest/
From that Teague sounds pretty good.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Jeff-Teague-5293/
But from that not so good.

Post #1350 » by **revprodeji** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:17 am

The fact that he lost his duties as primary ballhandler worries me.

Frozen316 · Post #1351 » by **Frozen316** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:26 am

I saw that Mullens fell to us on draftexpress so make a combo, Thabeet and Mullens, X and Mullens, Thabeet and X, X and Y

Krapinsky · Post #1352 » by **Krapinsky** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:29 am

revprodeji wrote:The fact that he lost his duties as primary ballhandler worries me.

Your worries are unfounded. He "lost" his duties b/c Smith returned from injury. FYI Smith had started at PG for two seasons before returning from injury half way through the season.

Read up:

"Wake Forest's 11 returning letterwinners have combined to play in 480 games and make 272 starts. Senior Harvey Hale is the Deacs' most experienced player, having seen action in 95 career contests, while junior Ishmael Smith has made a team-high 61 career starts entering this season.

The Back Court

Wake Forest returns every member of its back court from last season, giving the Deacons a deep and talented lineup to work with. Wake's back court is highlighted by one of the quickest guard tandems in the country in Ishmael Smith and Jeff Teague.

"Our two guards have a chance to be one of the best back courts in the country," said Gaudio. "I don't know if there's a quicker back court in the nation than Ishmael Smith and Jeff Teague. And you throw Harvey [Hale] and Gary [Clark] in that mix, and I think we have a chance to be very good there this year."

Smith, who has started at point guard for the Deacons since day one of his freshman season, returns to run the offense for Wake Forest. The 6-0, 175-pound junior has played in 61 career games and made 60 starts. Last season, Smith averaged 8.6 points and 3.4 rebounds per game. He led the Deacs in assists for the second straight season with an average of 4.7 per game.

Last year Smith developed a reputation as a clutch performer, as he was able to hit big shots for the Deacs late in games. Smith hit identical game-winning jumpers in the waning seconds against Virginia Tech and Miami and had clutch shots late against Clemson and Virginia.

Smith will be slowed during the 2008-09 preseason after breaking his left foot in mid-September. The Concord, N.C. native is expected to recover in time for the Deacons' season opener on Nov. 14."

http://wakeforestsports.cstv.com/sports ... 08aaa.html

Krapinsky · Post #1353 » by **Krapinsky** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:57 am

^^^I didn't mean to come off like such a jack off.

Devilzsidewalk · Post #1354 » by **Devilzsidewalk** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 1:09 pm

Dr.Krapinsky wrote:^^^I didn't mean to come off like such a jack off.

its too late. Jack off.

Krapinsky · Post #1355 » by **Krapinsky** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:38 pm

Devilzsidewalk wrote:
Dr.Krapinsky wrote:^^^I didn't mean to come off like such a jack off.

its too late. Jack off.

You're a jack off for calling me a jack off. So there.

BOOM goes the dynamite!

Devilzsidewalk · Post #1356 » by **Devilzsidewalk** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 3:49 pm

Dr.Krapinsky wrote:
Devilzsidewalk wrote:
Dr.Krapinsky wrote:^^^I didn't mean to come off like such a jack off.

its too late. Jack off.

You're a jack off for calling me a jack off. So there.

BOOM goes the dynamite!

I feel sad and owned

Frozen316 · Post #1357 » by **Frozen316** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:33 pm

http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wireta ... for_draft/

Devilzsidewalk · Post #1358 » by **Devilzsidewalk** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:44 pm

almost certainly a lotto pick, good choice by him

horaceworthy · Post #1359 » by **horaceworthy** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 9:55 pm

Translating Matta's words:

"I did my darndest to make him stick around next year. Fooled around with his minutes, didn't run anything other than a couple lobs for him, had him running out to challenge outside shooters instead of protecting the rim and rebounding, but dagnabbit, the kid decided to go pro anyway. What more can I do to get a 7 footer to stick around more than one year?

AQuintus · Post #1360 » by **AQuintus** » Thu Mar 26, 2009 10:00 pm

horaceworthy wrote:Translating Matta's words:

"I did my darndest to make him stick around next year. Fooled around with his minutes, didn't run anything other than a couple lobs for him, had him running out to challenge outside shooters instead of protecting the rim and rebounding, but dagnabbit, the kid decided to go pro anyway. What more can I do to get a 7 footer to stick around more than one year?

Sounds a lot like Jordan at Texas AM last year.