Gilbertology -- toned down?

[Ruzious]

I don't know guys. While the young players do need leadership, I'm wary about the idea that all you need to do is add some crusty veteran, and this guy will somehow take over the locker room and everyone will be whipped into shape. I think ultimately, a team takes the personality of the coach and the best player. And for better or worse, it's gonna be Gil that affects the kids the most. But when you're basically not on the team, there's a vacuum. It's surprising to me that Caron didn't step up and take over.

[TheSecretWeapon]

We need some vets in here who have won something.

Agreed.

We need a Stephen Jackson badly to set the tone.

Don't agree. There's a reason Jackson has played for 5 NBA teams. He's a decent player, but he's one of those chronic complainers/coach killers. Wiz don't need someone like him -- he's not good enough to make it worth putting up with his personality. He does play hard, but I'd stay away from him.

[miller31time]

Jackson seems to have finally "gotten it". Being named team captain, IMO, really helped him understand that he needs to set a tone both on and off the court.

I don't have the inside knowledge you have, TSW, but from an outside perspective, he does look like he's moved away from his old habits and mannerisms and moved into a more professional level.

For the right price, I wouldn't mind him on the Wizards.

[Dat2U]

The idea that Gil's blogs, or his other antics, don't "affect the play of the team" seems ridiculous to me. This team is built around Gilbert Arenas. Everyone knows that (from the popcorn vendors on up). Since that is the case, he sets the tone for the team. I contend that certain teams have a culture of defense/winning. I would further contend that when a player enters that system, they get more than casual nudges to d up (from the owner, through the locker room, and down to the popcorn vendor). I would not doubt that the "culture" in the locker room with our youth is a reflection of Gil. I also would not doubt that if we brought tougher vets and a tougher coach in here, you would see a very different type of development out of our players -- in part, because of the change in culture.

But, let's take it down to specifics. When the guy you base your entire team around makes outrageous predictions, that then don't come true, can you imagine the impact that has on the team (on hundreds of levels -- both interpersonally and within the group dynamic)? How can that not, in some respect (and perhaps in an epidemic respect), affect the play of the team?

I think in alot of cases, its the coach that sets a tone for the team. I look at Pops in San Antonio. I don't see a real vocal veteran in that lockeroom. Pops seems like the loudest voice to me. I love how he treats Duncan the same as he treats Oberto or George Hill. He holds everyone accountable and puts the team over individuals and look at what you have. Although they have Duncan, San Antonio isn't the most talented team, but all the parts fit. And all the parts work together as one.

I also look at Phil Jackson in LA, Jerry Sloan in Utah, Nate McMillan in Portland and even a Rick Carlisle in Dallas and I see strong willed coaches that demand accountability, preach defense and implore team over individual. What did we have in DC? Eddie Jordan, who spent most practices teaching his offense, talking about the "big three' and preferring activity over achievement. Tapscott seems enamored with veterans over the young guys no matter how bad the vets are. All I know, none of the stuff both Eddie's have done are really conducive to winning.

Regarding Gil, I think alot the extra-circular stuff, blogs, self-promotion or whatever was embraced by the organization. They were just as desperate for Gil to be a star as Gil was. They gave carte blanche to Gil and allowed him to do whatever he wanted. They made sure his friends got re-signed. In other words, they've let the immate run the asylum. I think it was a huge mistake in hindsight and it only stunted Gil's growth into becoming a leader. He was never held accountable, so how in the world would you expect Gil to hold others accountable?

[MJG]

Jackson seems to have finally "gotten it". Being named team captain, IMO, really helped him understand that he needs to set a tone both on and off the court.

I don't have the inside knowledge you have, TSW, but from an outside perspective, he does look like he's moved away from his old habits and mannerisms and moved into a more professional level.

For the right price, I wouldn't mind him on the Wizards.

Considering the fact that he's a week shy of 31 and is paid almost $9 million per for another four years, I don't think I'd take him if we could have him for free, personality problems or no.

[barelyawake]

Considering the fact that he's a week shy of 31 and is paid almost $9 million per for another four years, I don't think I'd take him if we could have him for free, personality problems or no.

Needs in player next to Arenas:
Tall enough to play SG.
Lockdown defends PG/SG, and hopefully SFs too.
Distributes like a point guard.

Those are the musts... Then, there are the shoulds:
Hopefully, can create his own shot.
Hopefully, can hit the trey.
Hopefully, has championship experience.

I know of three players (in the entire NBA -- besides Kobe) that meet the above requirements:
Richard Hamilton, Ginobili and Stephen Jackson.

And maybe three other players who don't have championship experience who fit the above. None of whom are available except Hinrich.

[TheSecretWeapon]

Jackson seems to have finally "gotten it". Being named team captain, IMO, really helped him understand that he needs to set a tone both on and off the court.

I don't have the inside knowledge you have, TSW, but from an outside perspective, he does look like he's moved away from his old habits and mannerisms and moved into a more professional level.

For the right price, I wouldn't mind him on the Wizards.

See here's the thing. The guy finally found happiness being the "leader" of a team that's 25-47. We're talking about a guy who will 31 years old next week, who's owed $35.4 million through 2013, and who finally "got it" when given the chance to shoot as much as he wants for a bad team.

[yungal07]

Jackson seems to have finally "gotten it". Being named team captain, IMO, really helped him understand that he needs to set a tone both on and off the court.

I don't have the inside knowledge you have, TSW, but from an outside perspective, he does look like he's moved away from his old habits and mannerisms and moved into a more professional level.

For the right price, I wouldn't mind him on the Wizards.

See here's the thing. The guy finally found happiness being the "leader" of a team that's 25-47. We're talking about a guy who will 31 years old next week, who's owed $35.4 million through 2013, and who finally "got it" when given the chance to shoot as much as he wants for a bad team.

And I'd probably stay away from a guy who has a tattoo of jesus holding a pistol on his chest. That goes for anyone in any facet of life.

[miller31time]

Jackson seems to have finally "gotten it". Being named team captain, IMO, really helped him understand that he needs to set a tone both on and off the court.

I don't have the inside knowledge you have, TSW, but from an outside perspective, he does look like he's moved away from his old habits and mannerisms and moved into a more professional level.

For the right price, I wouldn't mind him on the Wizards.

See here's the thing. The guy finally found happiness being the "leader" of a team that's 25-47. We're talking about a guy who will 31 years old next week, who's owed $35.4 million through 2013, and who finally "got it" when given the chance to shoot as much as he wants for a bad team.

My counter would be that the Warriors were a playoff team 2 years ago (even beating the #1 seed Mavericks in the playoffs) and were basically a 50-win team last season.

I blame Jackson for the Warriors' struggles about as much as I blame guys like Butler and Jamison this season - ie: not much at all.

[Induveca]

We need some vets in here who have won something.

Agreed.

We need a Stephen Jackson badly to set the tone.

Don't agree. There's a reason Jackson has played for 5 NBA teams. He's a decent player, but he's one of those chronic complainers/coach killers. Wiz don't need someone like him -- he's not good enough to make it worth putting up with his personality. He does play hard, but I'd stay away from him.

Jackson is the worst influence possible. He's still an active member of the Bloods gang in Texas.......he still wears red bandanas, a red warriors cap, red jackets, even has a red Range Rover (don't believe me, do a search). The guy is the definition of trash.

I gave him the benefit of the doubt, but sure enough there are pictures of him out there from this year in his all red outfits, red cars.....drinking Grey Goose out of the bottle in VIP with fellow friends all dressed in red. He's still doing his gang thing.

But here's the coup-de-grace.....

"Stephen Jackson arrived at Golden State's media day yesterday showing off some new ink. Some fascinating new ink. That covers most of his chest.

With a church window as the background, two praying hands are inked on his sternum - and they're holding a gun. "

Tayshaun Prince for Butler would be an excellent deal for us.............low key guy who can do it all. He has been playing strictly for championships since his days at Kentucky.

[barelyawake]

Where ya'll see "thugishness," I see toughness. And toughness is what we G.D. need on this team.

Of course, I would love Prince. I've only said that for years. I put "Prince-like SF" in Websters.

[TheSecretWeapon]

I dunno -- when I think of Jackson's play, "tough" isn't a word that comes to mind. Except if it's used in sentences like, "Jackson is tough to coach" or "Jackson is tough to get along with." He's a decent player, but he's never impressed me as being particularly tough.

I think we can all agree that Prince is someone we'd love to have on this squad.

[barelyawake]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/w ... son.notes/

[Induveca]

From 2009. Need anymore evidence he's still supporting his gang in Texas? The red/white (Bloods) and diamond Texas shaped bling? Keep this guy away.........I grew up around too many people like him. They never change.

[Ced67]

The idea that Gil's blogs, or his other antics, don't "affect the play of the team" seems ridiculous to me. This team is built around Gilbert Arenas. Everyone knows that (from the popcorn vendors on up). Since that is the case, he sets the tone for the team. I contend that certain teams have a culture of defense/winning. I would further contend that when a player enters that system, they get more than casual nudges to d up (from the owner, through the locker room, and down to the popcorn vendor). I would not doubt that the "culture" in the locker room with our youth is a reflection of Gil. I also would not doubt that if we brought tougher vets and a tougher coach in here, you would see a very different type of development out of our players -- in part, because of the change in culture.

But, let's take it down to specifics. When the guy you base your entire team around makes outrageous predictions, that then don't come true, can you imagine the impact that has on the team (on hundreds of levels -- both interpersonally and within the group dynamic)? How can that not, in some respect (and perhaps in an epidemic respect), affect the play of the team?

I think in alot of cases, its the coach that sets a tone for the team. I look at Pops in San Antonio. I don't see a real vocal veteran in that lockeroom. Pops seems like the loudest voice to me. I love how he treats Duncan the same as he treats Oberto or George Hill. He holds everyone accountable and puts the team over individuals and look at what you have. Although they have Duncan, San Antonio isn't the most talented team, but all the parts fit. And all the parts work together as one.

I also look at Phil Jackson in LA, Jerry Sloan in Utah, Nate McMillan in Portland and even a Rick Carlisle in Dallas and I see strong willed coaches that demand accountability, preach defense and implore team over individual. What did we have in DC? Eddie Jordan, who spent most practices teaching his offense, talking about the "big three' and preferring activity over achievement. Tapscott seems enamored with veterans over the young guys no matter how bad the vets are. All I know, none of the stuff both Eddie's have done are really conducive to winning.

Regarding Gil, I think alot the extra-circular stuff, blogs, self-promotion or whatever was embraced by the organization. They were just as desperate for Gil to be a star as Gil was. They gave carte blanche to Gil and allowed him to do whatever he wanted. They made sure his friends got re-signed. In other words, they've let the immate run the asylum. I think it was a huge mistake in hindsight and it only stunted Gil's growth into becoming a leader. He was never held accountable, so how in the world would you expect Gil to hold others accountable?

I agree that its mostly the organization to blame for "Gil being Gil." I think your absolutley right that they where just as desperate for him to be a star as he was. But I also think that as far as the coaches are concerned, the players on a team take after the best player and the coach, maybe the best player more. Of that list that you gave Pop has Duncan. I don't think that team is as professional as it is without Duncan there. He's a large part of the reason they have 4 rings and without the 4 rings Pop doesn't have the credibility that he currently does. Duncan allows Pop to set the tone for the Spurs because Duncan himself follows Pop. If Duncan just all of a sudden started fueding with Pop, Pop is more than likely the one leaving, this is a players league. When the best player on a team is doing everything right, i.e. leading, defending, playing team ball, no one else has any excuses. Same can be said for Kobe, Deron Williams and Brandon Roy. Brandon Roy stepped up as a leader in his 2nd year when he got in Zach Randolph's face about complaining or something. He did that in his second year. Its one thing for Jamison to step up and be a leader, but until Gil decides to step up and be a leader, to be serious, professional and defend. This team is going to be in the same spot it currently is when healthy.

Look at the best teams around the league. KG, Lebron, Kobe, Duncan, Paul, Deron Williams, Brandon Roy, Billups....All of these teams have a defined leader who sets the tone. George Karl has been in Denver for a few years now, but it wasn't until Chauncey Billups got there that there was a level of professionalism infused along with team play and defense. We need our Chauncey Billups. Only problem is that is can't be a PG because Gil has that spot.

[Ced67]

Where ya'll see "thugishness," I see toughness. And toughness is what we G.D. need on this team.

Of course, I would love Prince. I've only said that for years. I put "Prince-like SF" in Websters.

I agree with the "toughness" thing. This team has none of it. I know Haywood will be back, but remember before last season Haywood was known to many has Brenda, even last season he wasn't tough, he just knew where to be on the floor and he was long. Toughness has been a huge problem with this team for a while and unless we get Blake Griffin, its not going to improve. We'll win 40-45 games and at best get beat in the second round to Cleveland in a 1-4(or 5) match up. Look at Boston and Cleveland. They've got tough gritty players all over their rosters. I would love to have a Leon Powe.

I would also like to have Stephen Jackson. He is a tough player. When he got to GS he was the main one to turn things around there with his leadership. I think the fact that the got rid of Baron Davis, Matt Barnes brought in Maggette and are now having problems wit Monte are the main reasons why things are screwed up there, its chemistry. Stephen Jackson is probably one of 2-3 great compliments to Gil, because its so difficult to properly compliment a shooting PG who takes as many shots as Gil. The others would probably be Joe Johnson and maybe Brandon Roy and thats about it.

Remember, Stephen Jackson at 6'8 was the guy guarding Dirk and shutting him down in the first round upset a couple of years ago. He set the tone for GS. If they would have kept Baron Davis and a good chemistry guy like Barnes they would probably be doing a lot better. From what Im hearing they can't stand Corey Maggette, especially earlier in the season because he shoots the ball every time he touches it and doesn't play defense. Sounds familiar.

[RhythMic-]

As this dreadful Wizards' season draws to a close, I selfishly tried to enlist the three-time NBA all-star in some I-told-you-so vindication after he returned my call, get the franchise player to go off on the haters now in hiding. You know who his main target was?

Himself.

That's right, Arenas pointed the finger at Agent Zero for not helping develop the young players on the team, for not getting Nick Young, Dominic McGuire, Javaris Crittenton, JaVale McGee or Andray Blatche to progress enough during an 82-game gift of an opportunity -- though he said McGuire worked for everything he got.

"Nick, Javaris, JaVale -- I felt personally that they didn't get better this season due to the fact I wasn't around," Arenas said. "All of us are at fault, but I blame myself for them three not getting better."

Arenas said he has committed to spending most of the summer working out with Young, Crittenton and McGee, to "teach them what I know."

The hardest part of this season, Arenas said, was disconnecting from a team he felt helpless around. It got to the point where he begged team physicians three times to give him a clean bill of health so he could play -- in November, which he now realizes would have set back his recovery. He finally knew that focusing on his own recovery would be his greatest contribution.

"I was like: 'I can't watch this. This isn't basketball,' " he said. "Earlier in the season, I'm even cussing Antawn [Jamison] and Caron [Butler], telling them to get on the young players, 'Y'all need to do something, what the [expletive] are you doing?' But after a while when you don't play, everyone tunes you out. You can only get in their heads so much when you're not on the floor with them."

That definitely sounds like he's maturing to me.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 04082.html

[fishercob]

The man clearly still says what he thinks, even if he isn't blogging. Per Ivan:

Specifically, Arenas pointedly questioned the work ethic and professionalism of some of the team's young players, while naming rookie center JaVale McGee, second-year guards Nick Young and Javaris Crittenton, and fourth-year forward Andray Blatche.

According to team insiders, Blatche was particularly upset and declined to do interviews after yesterday's practice because of it. However, it's worth recalling that other veterans on the team, including co-captains Antawn Jamison and Caron Butler, have made similar, albeit more tactful, comments over the course of the season. Jamison addressed the issue yesterday.

"There's a certain way you say it," Jamison said. "And let's be honest: Some of it is not their fault. This is the first time a lot of guys have been in this situation and the expectations were very high of those guys. Granted they didn't perform the way we would've liked, but you can say that about some of the vets. We didn't perform the way we expected. It's all right to beat 'em down but you still have to give 'em a pat on the back and let 'em know that we still love you guys. Those are the things that will hopefully make them better. The most important thing for our young guys is to know that this should be the most serious summer of their careers because you never know what's going to happen."

Where are the Jamison haters? Gilbert's throwing the young players under the bus right? This makes you sick to your stomach, right?

It seems to me that Gil agrees with Jamison/Caron/Tap's frustration with the kids' inconsistency of production/professionalism this year. The main difference is that Gil named names. It clearly stings a lot more. I wouldn't be surprised if it elicited better results from the kids, though.