the play of Big Baby lately...

[MyInsatiableOne]

I've said, too, he's OK...nothing more, nothing less. But some people have him pegged as a future All-Star, a starter eventually, etc...that is NEVER going to happen, not on a contending team!

[billfromBoston]

bill, great post. I agree with nearly all of it. I do see Davis has improved the jumpshooting, but I still feel if he isn't hitting that consistently, he's useless out there. I don't see him bringing anything else to the table we couldn't get out of someone quicker or taller or a better jumper, etc. And I've been harping on his motivation just as you've touched on it...do we want a Shaq Jr who isn't in game shape until March when the rest of the team is in November? And Shaq has the cachet to do this...Baby does not...

Yes, someone "quicker, taller, and better" would be preferable to pretty much any player on the team - the trick is finding a better player at a price that you can afford - the team has 2 years invested in Davis' development and if they are going to press the re-set button on a rookie he better damn well be substantially more talented or have more upside than Daivs because building a team is about production AND timing - Davis syncs up with this group now - a younger player is unlikely to contribute comparable production quickly.

Free agency is not going to yield a player of comparable age and skill unless you are looking at getting a steal with the MLE in the form of David Lee. Its just not that simple to find productive big men at quality prices.

[MyInsatiableOne]

^Well I agree with Pete and you, bfb...yes the Celtics don't want to start all over with someone and jettison Davis, but do you want them to sink big bucks in him when he's never gonna be more than a decent 8th man off the bench? I don't...and y'all thought the Scal contract sucked?

[GuyClinch]

Yes, someone "quicker, taller, and better" would be preferable to pretty much any player on the team - the trick is finding a better player at a price that you can afford - the team has 2 years invested in Davis' development and if they are going to press the re-set button on a rookie he better damn well be substantially more talented or have more upside than Daivs because building a team is about production AND timing - Davis syncs up with this group now - a younger player is unlikely to contribute comparable production quickly.

The C's recouped that investment as rookies are low cost options. Just because you spent two years developing a guy doesn't mean you will shell out lots of money to hold onto a guy that won't play to his contract.

It comes down to a cost benefit factor. The C's this offseason would probably look up to pick up a big SF and perhaps a taller longer 5. I think they just keep one of Davis or Powe and unless the price gap is tremendous I hope its Powe we keep.

I see little evidence that Walker is going to take that job (big 3) and I am sure the C's want a Posey kind of player at a lower cost. I think Ainge has already given up on Giddens. So that leaves an opening there. Not that I am so down on those guys they have never gotten any burn. It just seems management is down on them..

For the center spot I hope somehow we land a "low upside" but serviceable NBA big man like Joel Przybilla.

[MyInsatiableOne]

Pryzbilla would be better than Davis, honestly.

Glen is fine for a pittance, but at Scal money, uh-uh...

[Athanacropolis]

Pryzbilla would be better than Davis, honestly.

Glen is fine for a pittance, but at Scal money, uh-uh...

I really don't get all of the Big Baby hate, man. Sure, he's not perfect, and he drives me up a tree at times, too, but damn! He hardly "sucks." Pryzbilla might be better, but we ain't getting the Vanilla Godzilla.

You can't deny that Davis is pretty damn good, considering he's a second-year, undersized power forward of questionable physical conditioning. He's had some great games on both ends of the floor, and I actually seem him as better than he was last year, and still improving. In two years from now, he'll probably command big bucks as a bench player. No one here is calling him a Hall-Of-Famer; if they are, they're crazy. I don't think he'll ever be an All-Star, either, but he hardly "sucks."

[GuyClinch]

You can't deny that Davis is pretty damn good, considering he's a second-year, undersized power forward of questionable physical conditioning

Yes he is the best 2nd year undersized fat PF in the NBA! We also have Scalabrine the best italian american 6'9" three point shooting with questionable physical condition. We can't lose.

[Athanacropolis]

You can't deny that Davis is pretty damn good, considering he's a second-year, undersized power forward of questionable physical conditioning

Yes he is the best 2nd year undersized fat PF in the NBA! We also have Scalabrine the best italian american 6'9" three point shooting with questionable physical condition. We can't lose.

Laugh all you want, though, there are taller players in better shape who are much, much worse. Plus, Davis plays well in the system. *shrug* I'm just not understanding the hate.

[Kids Are Alright]

With Baby, it's a matter of matchups. I'd swap him for Josh Smith or Al Holford, but it looked like Baby outscored both tonight.

He did have three TO's and only 3 rebounds compared to 10 and 8 for Smith and Holford, so he's still got a funky stat line for a "big" man.

I wish we had a tall power forward, but maybe that'll be tough to get while we're paying the three...

Actually, baby's shot isn't that much better than Mikki's, kind of a junk game for a pf. I like him better than Walter, because he does play some D, but that ain't sayin' much.

[Golabki]

I love this thread it reminds me of all the Perk threads we used to have were people would state without a doubt how he wasn't a NBA player and would never be good enough to play on a good team.

Here are the reasons people think big baby is a fringe player...

1) Physically Davis is over matched by most NBA players (he is either too slow or too short).
2) Statistically Davis has been terrible by pretty much any measure.
3) He has consistently demonstrated that he doesn't have the work ethic to get in shape.

ZERO of these three Davis facts applies to Perk. Perk came into the league very very long, very very big, and mobile for a center. Physically he was a great fit at center. Statistically Perk dominated the boards right off the bat and put up excellent blocks. Perk was soft at age 19, like every 19 year old, but (unlike Davis) he turned himself into a beast.

[sully00]

Why would you quote youself being wrong?

Perk had zero offensive game and was over 300lbs and had very limited athletic ability when he entered the league. The program the team put him on and his commitment to it is what has made him the player he is now.

Guess what the guys who counts the most apparently doesn't agree with you. The guy who signs the checks says Davis has lost 25lbs since he joined the C's and done everything the team has asked him from that standpoint. He also made it pretty clear both Davis and Leon will be back with the team.

As for the numbers 8-1 since he came back in the line up 13-3 with him in the line up since KG went down in Utah. 47% from the field 8.5ppg 4.5 rpg since Jan 1 (40 games). 50% from the field 12/6/2 as a starter. Not exactly terrible or fringe try agaIn.

[sam_I_am]

I really didn't think he had the size to be as effective as he has been. As his outside shot continues to improve he can be a very good player which I never imagined.

The only question he has to prove is whether he can maintain the level he is playing at in a playoff atmosphere.

[Havlicek17]

I am surprised that there has been so much debate about BBD.

BBD started the year out poorly, but since about the mid-year point (or since KG challenged the bench) he has played very well, and the contribution BBD has given the C's this year has been fantastic. I think the key for him on offense has been his mid range jumper. Once he started hitting that shot consistently, the opposing defense has had to step out to respect that, and it has opened up his lane to the basket. Earlier in the year he wasn't hitting the jumper consistently, and couldn't drive to the hoop at all. The defense was packed in the paint.

Although we could use a taller big to come off the bench to spell the PF and C positions. I personally would like to see us sign both BBD and Powe this offseason and look to upgrade Mikki and Scal.

[Spin Move]

BBD is a nice role player, he has a few + skills, he sets great picks, he is an above average passer for a big man, he defends the screen and roll well, his jump shot is ever improving, Also, his low center of gravity tends to bother tall power big men, in a different way then they are used to, in a rotation he can be very valuable.

He has shown the willingness to do whatever the team asks him, they turned him into a high post player which has reduced his ability to board on the offensive end, Over time though s the season a gone on he has made more and more of those jumpers causing teams to have to stretch their defenses. I don't see baby as a starter on a good team but I think he can continue to improve and be a very good sub.

With that said baby is only behind Eddie Curry in liklyhood of eating his way out of the league, well see how his weaight plays out but if he keeps it under control he is a really nice change of pace bench player to have.