Minnesota/Houston off-season trade

[john2jer]

I first want to preface this with, I'm not entirely sure your forum's rules on posting trades. I haven't visited here often. Just curious what Rockets' fans' opinion on a T-Mac trade would be.

Rockets give: Tracy McGrady and future top 10 protected first(2011?)
Wolves give: Mike Miller, Brian Cardinal, and Mark Madsen

I posted this on the trade forum, but that thread hasn't really gotten much for responses.

Why for the Rockets? They save about 3mil in 2009, plus add a talented veteran swingman who would provide great depth behind Artest, Battier, and Wafer. Mike Miller's 3pt shooting is down a bit this year, this has been attributed to Jefferson being a left block post player which doesn't mesh well right Miller's style. But Mike Miller is 3rd in 2pt%, the leading rebounding guard in the league, and also plays some point forward, and does a great job with ball movement, which is important if you don't have a true dominant PG. Not totally familiar with the Rockets, but if I remember correctly Aaron Brooks can shoot, and probably would mesh well with Miller's passing. Also Miller is a great locker room presence, doesn't demand the ball, and would be a huge improvement over McGrady when it comes to chemistry. I can see Miller dumping the ball to Yao in the high post, v-cutting to an open spot off the double team, catching and burying a three, or making the pass to a cutting Artest for the dunk. Miller would be great for Adelman's offense. All three contracts coming in are expiring as well, so if they decide to go in a different direction at the end of the season, they can without harm. Also Cardinal and Madsen can be paired at the deadline to bring in someone on a longer deal if desired at up to 12mil per. Or they could add either Landry or Cook and go after Vince Carter if that's their desire. Although that probably leads to Artest or Battier playing some minutes at the 4. Is that possible? Or even using Miller and Cardinal to get Carter would probably be more desireable for the Nets. So at the end of the day, their no real risk for the Rockets here, they basically have their team that's playing well now, and add in a great shooter who also happens to help out with rebounding, passing, and chemistry. Plus the potential to bring in someone after December 15th, maybe an upgrade at the point? Also leaves the Rockets sitting at about 36mil committed to 2010, so they still have around 12-18mil, depending on draft picks, MLE, and where the cap ends up, to make a big signing in 2010.

Why for the Wolves? If the sign all their draft picks, they're sitting at 15 contracts, and no room to sign someone with the MLE. This consolidates some of their expirings, allowing them to sign a MLE as well. Costs them 3mil, but that's made up by the excitement the casual fans would get from the front office making a move at a legit former star, plus the future pick is nice in their rebuilding effort. If McGrady comes back in January, prolly around the same time Jefferson does, the Wolves would have a great team to make a second half run at a play-off spot, especially if their rookies pan out, along with the MLE player.

Not too sure on the Rockets depth chart, but something like this?
Rockets depth chart:
C - Yao/Dorsey
PF - Scola/Landry
SF - Battier/Miller
SG - Artest/Wafer
PG - Brooks/Lowry

Wolves depth chart when everyone's healthy:
C - Jefferson/Mullens(#18)
PF - Love/Smith
SF - McGrady/Gomes
SG - Foye/Brewer
PG - Evans(#6)/Telfair

[john2jer]

Minnesota is actually taking on roughly 3mil in salary here, and Miller/Cardinal/Madsen are all expiring as well. It's a lot easier to move three expiring contracts for 9.8, 6.8, and 2.8 than it is to move one for 22mil.

So again, Wolves are taking on the salary, they're taking on the tougher contract to move, and they're taking on the guy who's out until probably at least New Year's. That's why Houston should include the protected future first.

Let me state it again, I did in the original post, but I'll say it again. EVERYONE involved in this trade are regular expiring contracts. No options, no ETOs, no unguaranteed deals, straight one year contracts that expire at the end of next season.

EDIT: Bah, now I look stupid because the T-Mac/Santana fan deleted his post.

[HTown_TMac]

At first I thought No, but after thinking about it. We can get so much better after this trade, and then shipping the other 2 contacts out for a good player with a longer deal.

[john2jer]

At first I thought No, but after thinking about it. We can get so much better after this trade, and then shipping the other 2 contacts out for a good player with a longer deal.

That was basically my thinking for the Rockets.

For the Wolves, we won't be bringing any of those guys back anyways, maybe Miller, but I doubt it. This gives us a chance to look at McGrady, bring in a star wing player which we've never really had, and if it doesn't work out, we move on after the season. The Wolves have a ton of great expiring contracts, but due to Jefferson's injury, our cap space in 2010, and our developing pups, we're not in a position to bring in any big long term free agent at the beginning of the season. So this brings in a star player, on the cheap, and he comes back when Jefferson does, so our pups can develop, and we have a chance of being a good second half of the season team. Plus, Wolves fans would die for a first round exit right now, and McGrady's the king of that. Sorry, I had to.

[HTown_TMac]

Nice jab at T-Mac, but we would seriously have to think about this. And if we can somehow keep our team as is after the summer minus Barry, we could be better than the Lakers. Our bench would be the best in the league.

[TMU]

Minnesota is actually taking on roughly 3mil in salary here, and Miller/Cardinal/Madsen are all expiring as well. It's a lot easier to move three expiring contracts for 9.8, 6.8, and 2.8 than it is to move one for 22mil.

So again, Wolves are taking on the salary, they're taking on the tougher contract to move, and they're taking on the guy who's out until probably at least New Year's. That's why Houston should include the protected future first.

Let me state it again, I did in the original post, but I'll say it again. EVERYONE involved in this trade are regular expiring contracts. No options, no ETOs, no unguaranteed deals, straight one year contracts that expire at the end of next season.

EDIT: Bah, now I look stupid because the T-Mac/Santana fan deleted his post.

Sry, I deleted it because I didn't read your post carefully. I always thought Brian Cardinal had two years left in his contract.

The upcoming playoffs should be an indication of whether or not the Rockets should take this deal. If we fare well in the playoffs, there's a high chance that we'll resign Artest and the 1-year Mike Miller rental could help us contend in the following season. However, if our expectation isn't met i.e.: another first-round exit, we won't resign Artest and we'll opt to restructure our backcourt. If such is the case, I don't want to see us waste that pick considering we won't be able to extend Miller's contract due to cap issues. Overall, I think we're better off trading McGrady for a different package and keep that pick for future development.

EDIT: Wish Mike Miler had two years left in his contract instead of one.

[Young_Star11]

Why do we have to give up a 1st?

T-Mac at the worst is an expiring.

Minny would be shedding their expirings too.

Will T-Mac ball in 09-10?

Gotta see how we do post-season first.

[MaxRider]

i'll rather have T-Mac sitting at home than doing this trade

[john2jer]

Obviously only for minor stretches, and against certain teams without lightning quick point guards, I could see the Rockets using a line-up of Yao, Scola, Battier, Artest, and Miller. Miller can run the point a little, and that size would just dominate teams. Adelman's offensive system, and running things through Yao makes it possible.

And I don't know if that was more of a jab at McGrady or a jab at the sorry state of the Wolves right now.

Literally the Wolves have 0 bad contracts right now. Cardinal is definitely an expiring.

I figure a lot has to do with this year's play-offs. You're tied for that 3rd seed right now, which I figure is kind of big, because it means not having to face the Lakers until the Conference Finals, and most teams are either battling injury bugs, or are very young. Houston's homecourt advantage would be big getting them into a battle with the Lakers to go to the Finals.

Miller just adds one more gunner and rebounder to contend with the Lakers' length next year. If they man up with Bynum against Yao, Bynum gets eaten alive. If they try to double down, Yao just passes over the top to Miller spotting up to bury the three. Plus, you know that Kobe's going to take the "easier" defensive assignment and guard Miller, meaning Wafer and Artest can slash and bully their way to easy buckets against slower or smaller defenders, and Kobe won't be free to play off and help, like he tried with Rondo last year.

[john2jer]

Why do we have to give up a 1st?

T-Mac at the worst is an expiring.

Minny would be shedding their expirings too.

Will T-Mac ball in 09-10?

Gotta see how we do post-season first.

You give up the future first to save 3 million and get production, instead of paying someone to stay home. Miller, Cardinal, and Madsen at worst are three expirings that can be moved easier to bring back production, and at worst Miller is one of the best rebounding guards in the league, and someone who can spread the offense and improve ball movement in an offense that requires it. The reports I've seen said that McGrady could be out 6-12 months as of the end of February, but is doubtful for the beginning of the season. So that means the earliest he'd be back would probably be Christmas, but probably not until closer to the all-star break. Likely he wouldn't be coming back all systems go, either, though. Plus hasn't it been stated over and over that the Rockets are better without him, and he hinders good chemistry? Miller is the opposite of that and brings great chemistry, and is willing to do whatever the team needs.

i'll rather have T-Mac sitting at home than doing this trade

You'd rather have 22 million sitting at home than saving 3 million and getting solid production out of it? That's kind of like I'd rather have a broken down Porsche in garage that can't get me to work than perfectly fine Silverado that'll get me to work. Um, ok...

[YoungMoney23]

Personally I'd rather send him to the bucks for RJ

[MaxRider]

i'll rather have T-Mac sitting at home than doing this trade

You'd rather have 22 million sitting at home than saving 3 million and getting solid production out of it? That's kind of like I'd rather have a broken down Porsche in garage that can't get me to work than perfectly fine Silverado that'll get me to work. Um, ok...

i don't know the exact amount but pretty sure Les can get more the 3M back from insurance if T-Mac sit the whole season

[Young_Star11]

I'm not going to give up a first rounder for a year of Mike Miller, as good as he can be.

Take out the first rounder and I'm interested.

[King Roosk]

No thanks.

[aznkillabeezZz]

an injured tmac could beat any of those scrubs left handed and blindfolded. And im not even that high on big mac.

[BaYBaller]

I would do it but I have no idea why MEM would do it. We're not better w/o a healthy T-Mac but the question is if he'll ever be healthy again, especially next season which is his contract season. It is doubtful HOU will resign T-Mac.

If all contracts in the deal are indeed expiring we only lose out on a very likely late first round pick which is more than made up by production from Miller and smaller expirings which is big because even though T-Mac is expiring as well his contract is so big it isn't easy to structure trades around it. Besides knowing Morey he'll probably flip those expirings for Lebron or something.

[moofs]

Doesn't look like a bad trade to me. This trade would depend heavily on how we're able to cross over our roster to next year, however.

[Iggyemu]

Morey not gonna give up more draft picks. But these are the types of trades Morey will try to find for McGrady sans the draft picks of course.

Now it may also be more beneficial to us to keep him if he can prove he is healthy. We know he'll be motivated b/c its his contract year....if he can come back relatively healthy its probably more beneficial to keep him and just let the contract expire.

[Guy986]

Take out first round pick i'll do it. Otherwise no.

[albatrosskismet]

Take out first round pick i'll do it. Otherwise no.

I second that. A first-round pick is too much.