Long Term Plan? (merged threads)

[hands11]

Songaila is a very good backup at the 4. If development were not a concern, I'd rather I've Songaila on the court than McGee. McGee's great and he shows flashes, but they're called flashes because most of the time he is completely lost on defense. But playing Songaila against second-unit PFs will probably net much more good than bad.

But developing our talent is a concern, so I hope McGee does get his share of minutes.

I believe most fans here love McGees potential but I think some miss that there really isn't any rush to play him next year a lot if he isn't ready. The kid is really young. We have time to bring him along if he isn't learning enough to earn the minutes outright.

Basically. We have time and we have option as far a McGee goes.

If he earns it great. play him.
If not, your right, we would be better off with The Song on the court.

[dnk]

Songaila is a very good backup at the 4. If development were not a concern, I'd rather I've Songaila on the court than McGee. McGee's great and he shows flashes, but they're called flashes because most of the time he is completely lost on defense. But playing Songaila against second-unit PFs will probably net much more good than bad.

But developing our talent is a concern, so I hope McGee does get his share of minutes.

I believe most fans here love McGees potential but I think some miss that there really isn't any rush to play him next year a lot if he isn't ready. The kid is really young. We have time to bring him along if he isn't learning enough to earn the minutes outright.

Basically. We have time and we have option as far a McGee goes.

If he earns it great. play him.
If not, your right, we would be better off with The Song on the court.

Agreed. And McGee getting minutes was also a little bit of bitterness about this season. Once he saw where this season was going, I think McGee should have started to play more consistent minutes.

Next season, it's definitely different because we'll be in a spot to try to contend for a decent playoff seed, and if McGee's a liability, you're absolutely right, he shouldn't get too many minutes he hasn't earned.

[LyricalRico]

^ Guys like McGee and Pesh should definitely get plenty of minutes next season - if not with the Wiz, then in the D League. I'm tired of seeing guys wasting away on the bench instead of gaining experience.

That's another benefit to not having EJ as the coach anymore - we no longer have to worry about whether or not our D League team runs the Princeton. Now that we have an actual NBA coach who will run an actual NBA offense, we'll be free to send players down because what they'll learn in the NBDL will be even more relevant to what they'll be doing when they get called back up.

[lupin]

Pech won't be eligible for the D-League next year. What a waste.

[hands11]

As for McGee, I think EG picked pretty well for the 18th pick ( me happens to be one of the few that had him on my short list McGee or Hibbert . He may eventually end up in the top 5 of that class but that's the dice you roll and why you can get someone like him on the cheap. Look at how much more developed the top picks ended up being. I think people will look back at what a talented draft class this was.

http://www.nba.com/draft2008/board.html

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/r ... od=1&set=0

Rose isn't even phased by his first playoff game. He is mentally and physically developed to contribute in his first year. Lopez also have an NBA ready body and post moves. But in another year or two, I think McGee is going to be at the cream of this crop. But we know he was a project coming in. Hell, even his mother says she isn't even sure he has stopped growing.

If that is true, I wouldn't play him heavy minutes just based on that. Medically, I'm pretty sure that's a good idea. The cartridge in your joints is softer when your growing so to much sports can cause bones to take a heavier pounding. I remember that happening to me when I was younger. It got so bad to have to stop sports for like 2 months and had to use crutches until the swelling went down.

Now that's an extreme example of someone over doing while in a growth spurt at the age of 15 but the basic principle is still there. I not saying that is what they were doing but it would be one factor. I think main ones were he was lost on defense and he took some OP crazish shots to often. If it wasn't for his freakish length, speed for his height and leaps, he would have looked like total trash. He has no NBA game, just freakish raw talent. Can't wait to see what he looks like after a summer of NBA instruction and hitting the weights.

[CrankyTodd]

Where I think we have a log jam is at PF. Blatche, McGee, OP, DSong - They are all really PFs
If you add AJ, thats another. Even Etan is really a PF but he is strong enough to hold his own at Center. Kind of like DSong does. So while we have several players who can main the center behind
Haywood - AB, DSong, Etan, and McGee, what we are missing is a legit back up center. I can see McGee doing it in a couple years when he gets stronger, but he won't really be ready next year. I think he can transition to PF first easier then center. He is already a shot blocking force in the post and he has the 3rd hight AFG % on the team behind DSong and AJ.

I agree strongly with this point. We all saw the difference when Haywood returned to the lineup. He's the only legitimate post defender on the team. Everyone else is just masquerading as a low post defender. We do indeed have a frontcourt log jam, and yet we still don't have a backup big bodied veteran defender down low. Some people will have to be moved. If that means giving up some of our developmental players in return, so be it, particularly if we win the Griffin sweepstakes.

[nate33]

I don't think backup center is a real concern. Very few teams have a quality big-bodied backup center. They make due with a long power forward (like Blatche) or a strong player who doesn't have center size (like Songaila).

Our backup center won't have to defend Yao or Howard because Haywood will be in the game when Yao/Howard are in. Our backup center will be guarding Tony Battie and Luis Scola. I think Blatche, Songaila and McGee can handle it.

[CrankyTodd]

I don't think backup center is a real concern. Very few teams have a quality big-bodied backup center. They make due with a long power forward (like Blatche) or a strong player who doesn't have center size (like Songaila).

Our backup center won't have to defend Yao or Howard because Haywood will be in the game when Yao/Howard are in. Our backup center will be guarding Tony Battie and Luis Scola. I think Blatche, Songaila and McGee can handle it.

That's all well and good until your starting center goes down with an injury and you realize the cupboard is bare, as happened this year. Assuming this team is looking to compete next year (and all signs point towards that), a defensively minded backup center goes a long way towards shoring up a team composed of perimeter scoring talent.

[LyricalRico]

I don't think backup center is a real concern. Very few teams have a quality big-bodied backup center. They make due with a long power forward (like Blatche) or a strong player who doesn't have center size (like Songaila).

Our backup center won't have to defend Yao or Howard because Haywood will be in the game when Yao/Howard are in. Our backup center will be guarding Tony Battie and Luis Scola. I think Blatche, Songaila and McGee can handle it.

That's all well and good until your starting center goes down with an injury and you realize the cupboard is bare, as happened this year. Assuming this team is looking to compete next year (and all signs point towards that), a defensively minded backup center goes a long way towards shoring up a team composed of perimeter scoring talent.

Great! Now all we need to do is go down to the "Defensive Minded Big Man" store and pick one up!

[pancakes3]

ideally yes, but with salary cap, roster limitations, and just lack of overall talent i don't think backup center is all very high up on the priority list. also, not even the top teams have good true centers on their bench. The Celtics have no true center other than perkins, cavs have lorenzen wright, and the magic have adonal foyle. The lakers get away with it by sliding gasol over to the C spot but if Odom wasn't there to step in to fill the forward spot vacated, they'd be stuck with Mbenga as their starting Center. Yes we got exposed this year because of a lack of depth at C, but i don't think it means we should run out and drop 6 million dollars on a center who'll be seeing only 10 mpg.

we should be looking to clear the useless cogs (Stevenson, Etan, James, Opec) for more useful cogs.

[yungal07]

Do we then nab Thabeet (assuming we get hosed with a crap pick) and trade McGee? I'm not sold on Thabeet being better than Javale, but at least you know you'll get good defense and rotations from Thabeet. McGee also might hold as much value on the open market because he's young and cheap.

[hands11]

I don't think backup center is a real concern. Very few teams have a quality big-bodied backup center. They make due with a long power forward (like Blatche) or a strong player who doesn't have center size (like Songaila).

Our backup center won't have to defend Yao or Howard because Haywood will be in the game when Yao/Howard are in. Our backup center will be guarding Tony Battie and Luis Scola. I think Blatche, Songaila and McGee can handle it.

Here is my concern. I really don't care what most teams have because most teams won't win it all. Only one team will. That means you have to do a few things.

- You have to have a team that will get to the playoffs - I think we already have that.
- You need a team that will do well in your division/conference because home court really helps.
- You need a team that can beat the team that is in your way - Cleveland, Boston, Orlando but primarily, Cleveland.

While we have beaten up on Boston and Cleveland with what we have, I would like some extra dept behind Haywood because as we have seen, if he goes down, the whole thing falls apart.

Cleveland has a lot of big player. As things stand, I think the combination of Etan, DSong, AB and a more seasoned McGee can fill that who behind Haywood. But if Etan isn't there, we need something to replace him. This is where it great to have someone like Matombo sitting on the bench. Because if Haywood goes down, Z and V are going to be a handful for AB, McGee, DSong, and Etan. Because besides Z and V they have Joe Smith and Wright plus LB is big for his position and they have other big bodies.

So if we are healthy, I think we are ok. Personally, I think Etan is really important as a back up power center until we get his replacement.

[doclinkin]

Great! Now all we need to do is go down to the "Defensive Minded Big Man" store and pick one up!

You laugh but if we land the 3rd pick you'll likely see the franchise pass and trade away the top new model from Defensive Minded Big Man store. And we'll have to hear about it for years to come if he pans out as the Deke Mutombo 2.0.

On another topic: I'm liking more the idea that Sam Cassell will help tutor the young pups. Gilbert can learn a few nasty tricks and low cunning from the guy. Not sure Nick Young will pick it up, but even a guy like DMac could stand to benefit. Sam also will help tutor the pick and roll game and demand real picks from the Bigs, so even there Nick Young should eventually benefit.

I like the chances of a tape-watching ball student like Javaris Crittenton to develop with an offseason of Dr Hoops Dave Hopla. Hopefully the front office holds onto him... But Hoops + workaholic Gilbert + crafty veteran Sam Cassell could prove to be a scholarship to Guard University for an earnest student like JCritt. This should be an interesting offseason for him, for a guy who was desperate to play his first couple years.

[nate33]

ideally yes, but with salary cap, roster limitations, and just lack of overall talent i don't think backup center is all very high up on the priority list. also, not even the top teams have good true centers on their bench. The Celtics have no true center other than perkins, cavs have lorenzen wright, and the magic have adonal foyle. The lakers get away with it by sliding gasol over to the C spot but if Odom wasn't there to step in to fill the forward spot vacated, they'd be stuck with Mbenga as their starting Center. Yes we got exposed this year because of a lack of depth at C, but i don't think it means we should run out and drop 6 million dollars on a center who'll be seeing only 10 mpg.

we should be looking to clear the useless cogs (Stevenson, Etan, James, Opec) for more useful cogs.

+1

Sure, we could use a high quality backup center. For that matter, we could use a high quality backup PG and SF. But we have to prioritize. We don't have the luxury of paying a high quality backup center so that we don't miss a beat if Haywood gets hurt. If Haywood gets hurt again, we're screwed. That's just the way it is. Just about everybody else (except Portland and Cleveland) is in the same position.

[CrankyTodd]

I don't think backup center is a real concern. Very few teams have a quality big-bodied backup center. They make due with a long power forward (like Blatche) or a strong player who doesn't have center size (like Songaila).

Our backup center won't have to defend Yao or Howard because Haywood will be in the game when Yao/Howard are in. Our backup center will be guarding Tony Battie and Luis Scola. I think Blatche, Songaila and McGee can handle it.

That's all well and good until your starting center goes down with an injury and you realize the cupboard is bare, as happened this year. Assuming this team is looking to compete next year (and all signs point towards that), a defensively minded backup center goes a long way towards shoring up a team composed of perimeter scoring talent.

Great! Now all we need to do is go down to the "Defensive Minded Big Man" store and pick one up!

I have to admit that made me laugh.

[hands11]

I don't think backup center is a real concern. Very few teams have a quality big-bodied backup center. They make due with a long power forward (like Blatche) or a strong player who doesn't have center size (like Songaila).

Our backup center won't have to defend Yao or Howard because Haywood will be in the game when Yao/Howard are in. Our backup center will be guarding Tony Battie and Luis Scola. I think Blatche, Songaila and McGee can handle it.

That's all well and good until your starting center goes down with an injury and you realize the cupboard is bare, as happened this year. Assuming this team is looking to compete next year (and all signs point towards that), a defensively minded backup center goes a long way towards shoring up a team composed of perimeter scoring talent.

Agree. Defensive presence is the key. A strong body who is able to rebound from the center position and hit free throws. Now if they had some offense also, that would be nice but I think that is harder to find. But that isn't the key since we can get the offense from other positions. It isn't as hard to find a player with experience and the size to play the position and rebound. Etan is kind of that kind of player but over paid for what we need and he isn't a good free throw shooter. But Etan is who we currently have and he may still be here when the season starts. At least we have something until we can find that better fit.

This is where my skills dwindle. I know what kind of player I would want, but I don't know all the players and their specific situations as well as other here do.

http://www.nba.com/statistics/player/Ef ... r.offset=0

http://www.nba.com/fantasy/draft_kit/ce ... s1_15.html
http://hoopshype.com/free_agency.htm

The player doesn't have to be old as long as they have a solid mature basketball mind. It would seem to me they would more likely then not be someone who have been there and won something. Someone maybe winding down their career that wants to be on a team making a run. Someone who could even possibly add something to Haywoods game. Someone like Morning.

[hands11]

Do we then nab Thabeet (assuming we get hosed with a crap pick) and trade McGee? I'm not sold on Thabeet being better than Javale, but at least you know you'll get good defense and rotations from Thabeet. McGee also might hold as much value on the open market because he's young and cheap.

Those two things should not be connected. JaVale is going no where right now.

I was looking at Thabeet to fill this role. I'll admit, I don't watch a ton of college ball but from what I saw in limited minutes of NCAA post season ball, I wasn't that impressed with Thabeet. But if he is really as talented as some think and he is a really 7-3 defensive presence, shot blocker who hits free throws, I wouldn't be surprised if EG considers him.

You can never have to much talent at center. Grab it while you can, you could always trade an asset later. But if he is really that great a defender, it may be worth a look. I trust EG know more then we do about the kid.

Haywood, Thabett, McGee and Blatche with Thablett taking Etan's spot. That could set us up nicely for the future.

I posted about this earlier in this thread. I could see a scenario where we get someone like Thabeet and he isn't on the active roster the start the season until we figure out what to do with Etan. Since we are allowed 15 roster spots but only 12 active.

I wouldn't be surprised to see something like that or Rubio staying overseas. It's going to cost us about 4 million. The cap does kick in till later in the year, so we have a window to figure out what we want to do.

I think this is the main reason Abe said they can go over the cap. EG said as much. He said, we don't want to be forced to pass up on talent in the draft.

This is going to be the most interesting off season we have had in a long time.

[nate33]

Yeah, we'll be set up real well. Will have Haywood and a bunch of redundant, inexperienced 7-footers who have no idea how to play basketball. By the time all of those young guys develop (if they ever do without significant playing time and veteran mentors), they'll all be finished with their rookie scale contracts and we'll have to pay a fortune to retain them.

McGee and Thabeet are both projects who play the same position. It would be insanity to retain both when we have so many other more pressing needs.

[hands11]

Yeah, we'll be set up real well. Will have Haywood and a bunch of redundant, inexperienced 7-footers who have no idea how to play basketball. By the time all of those young guys develop (if they ever do without significant playing time and veteran mentors), they'll all be finished with their rookie scale contracts and we'll have to pay a fortune to retain them.

McGee and Thabeet are both projects who play the same position. It would be insanity to retain both when we have so many other more pressing needs.

Ahh. The insanity argument. That's an oldie but a goodie.

So many other pressing needs ?

Our only other need is health and a back up PG which we may already have.

[LyricalRico]

^ Our only needs are health and a backup PG? Wow, what team have you been watching?

The only reason we're debating the backup C spot is because we don't have a reliable option there. If we did, we wouldn't be having this conversation. Also, regardless of how much we may like McGuire, the Wiz still have below average options for a starting SG. And even with the flashes Nick Young has shown, we still lack a reliable bench scoring option. Yeah he averages 10ppg but he gets that average by scoring 16 one night and 4 the next I don't call that "reliable". Not to mention that he doesn't fill up any other statistical categories.

So let's see...in addition to health and a backup PG we need:

- a defensive backup center
- an above average starting SG
- a reliable bench scorer who can also do other things

Unless we picked up Antonio McDyess, Kevin Martin, and Trevor Ariza without my knowledge - this team still has a lot of work to do. And having Thabeet and McGee compete for DNP-CD's isn't going to help.