should we still trade smith, to build around horford @4

johnny878 · Post #1 » by **johnny878** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:46 am

LOL. Im glad hawks fans on realgm arent running the hawks. The franchise would be so screwed building aroudn this chump

tontoz · Post #2 » by **tontoz** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:48 am

Horford could score over 15 ppg at the 4....

if he was playing against high school players.

Post #3 » by **HMFFL** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:54 am

johnny878 wrote:LOL. Im glad hawks fans on realgm arent running the hawks. The franchise would be so screwed building aroudn this chump

Actually you don't build around Josh Smith or Al Horford at the present time.

johnny878 · Post #4 » by **johnny878** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:55 am

There was honestly a 10 point swing everytime Horford stepped on the floor.

Hopefully woodson takes notice and gives Zaza more minutes next game. He has been busting his ass

betta1 · Post #5 » by **betta1** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:55 am

Trade Marvin, Speedy and Acie for Kaman.

Bibby (or Kirk H. perhaps?)
JJ
Smoove
Horford
Kaman

We'll need major shooters off the bench in addition to Flip, but we'd bang down low with the best teams out there.

johnny878 · Post #6 » by **johnny878** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:56 am

HMFFL wrote:
johnny878 wrote:LOL. Im glad hawks fans on realgm arent running the hawks. The franchise would be so screwed building aroudn this chump

Actually you don't build around Josh Smith or Al Horford at the present time.

correct. You build around Josh Smith AND Marvin Williams

Post #7 » by **HMFFL** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:10 am

johnny878 wrote:
HMFFL wrote:
johnny878 wrote:LOL. Im glad hawks fans on realgm arent running the hawks. The franchise would be so screwed building aroudn this chump

Actually you don't build around Josh Smith or Al Horford at the present time.

correct. You build around Josh Smith AND Marvin Williams

Johnny, I tend to like building around stars, but we can try building around Josh Smith, and see how that goes for the next ten years.

Miami will make adjustments before Wednesday and it's highly unlikely ZaZa will be able to rebound like he did tonight. More minutes maybe, but he needs to put his minutes to use like he did tonight.

johnny878 · Post #8 » by **johnny878** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:14 am

well, i guess the hawks are just SOL because there are no stars on the team.

Marvin and Josh are both super atheletic players that play very good D and can get to the line. All Josh needs to do is play within his skill set and all Marvin needs is for woodson to draw him up a bigger role in the offense. When Joe was out and Marvin got more touches, he was borderline unstoppable.

parson · Post #9 » by **parson** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:31 am

HMFFL wrote:Johnny, I tend to like building around stars, but we can try building around Josh Smith, and see how that goes for the next ten years.

I hear what you're saying, but I keep thinking about what he'd look like with a great PG feeding him.

Still, short of getting a better PG (which is what I really, really want), I admit we need ... something ... and I'd entertain a trade of any of our young talents for the right additive to the chemistry mix.

raleigh · Post #10 » by **raleigh** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:39 am

To be honest, I've about had enough of Josh Smith. After five years, he's simply not going to change.

He's the best athlete in the NBA at the same time as he is the dumbest player in the NBA. Tragic.

johnny878 · Post #11 » by **johnny878** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:44 am

mrhonline wrote:To be honest, I've about had enough of Josh Smith. After five years, he's simply not going to change.

He's the best athlete in the NBA at the same time as he is the dumbest player in the NBA. Tragic.

I know how you feel. He is only leading the team in ppg, rebound, and fg pct this series. Needs to step it up and lead them in assist too.

Kinda hard for him to lead the team in TO with Joe Johnson turning over the ball at such an ungodly rate.

raleigh · Post #12 » by **raleigh** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:46 am

^^^He's also leading the Hawks in stupid plays, poor judgment, and lazy man defense.

johnny878 · Post #13 » by **johnny878** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:50 am

mrhonline wrote:^^^He's also leading the Hawks in stupid plays, poor judgment, and lazy man defense.

lol, defense? His defense has been pretty darn good compared to the rest of the hawks. Especially tonight. Made HUGE plays on the defensive end.

betta1 · Post #14 » by **betta1** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:52 am

Josh Smith hate again? Lame.

raleigh · Post #15 » by **raleigh** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:53 am

johnny878 wrote:
mrhonline wrote:^^^He's also leading the Hawks in stupid plays, poor judgment, and lazy man defense.

lol, defense? His defense has been pretty darn good compared to the rest of the hawks. Especially tonight. Made HUGE plays on the defensive end.

No, no it hasn't. Smith makes a lot of highlight plays with his weakside shotblocking, but he STILL makes plenty of stupid plays on the inside.

The Hawks defense in games 1 and 4 were because they played well as a team. As a man defender, Smith is hardly better today than he was nearly 5 seasons ago.

raleigh · Post #16 » by **raleigh** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:53 am

betta1 wrote:Josh Smith hate again? Lame.

Josh Smith homerism again? Lame.

(See how easy it is to NOT make an actual argument).

betta1 · Post #17 » by **betta1** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:11 am

mrhonline wrote:
betta1 wrote:Josh Smith hate again? Lame.

Josh Smith homerism again? Lame.

(See how easy it is to NOT make an actual argument).

Except you'd have to look for an instance of homerism on my part in your case.

Lue_4_MVP · Post #18 » by **Lue_4_MVP** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:31 am

I wouldn't mind if either of them were traded to be honest, but since Josh is more talented, I'd rather trade Horford.

In 2 years I think a lot of Horford's flaws will be exposed, just as this series has sort of exposed his defense. Horford is also prone to boneheaded plays like Smith, but Woody hides him a bit so we don't see it as much.

tbhawksfan · Post #19 » by **tbhawksfan** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 10:28 am

It's very difficult to tell because we don't know what either of them would look like playing PF next to a quality C. Smoove is more athletic, but Horf has great athleticism, fundamentals and leadership type character. Smoove is fiery, but his kind of passion doesn't translate well to team play.

If we had to choose, which would you trade to bring in a quality C. Which one has the better trade value?

There are so many possibilities this summer. Marvin is a trade possibility. The Horford/Smoove situation is not optimal for the team because Horf is out of position, leaving us vulnerable at C and unable to exploit our athleticism because of lacking the BIG inside to control the boards.

If you bring in a staarting C and keep both PF's, there is still a rotation problem limiting the value of the players.

I guess I don't see our PF/C combo as a viable future plan. So, which one goes? Do we keep MW. Bibby seems to be worth a Blake and a first type S&T. We have both picks in the draft.

I know the playoffs are on, but it's never too early to think about the future.

I think I look to trade Smoove. Horford is more consistent, a much better team player and I've longed to see him at PF with a Pau Gazol type C. I also think that Smoove has higher trade value.

killbuckner · Post #20 » by **killbuckner** » Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:55 pm

I think it makes sense to trade a player when their perceived value is far above what their actual value is. I think that Josh Smith is probably valued about right, but I do wonder if people have yet to catch on to Horford's lack of ability on offense. If the Hawks don't think he will be able to start exploiting more lumbering players on offense then I think it makes sense to trade him. Some people still seem to see Horford as a potential perennial allstar type PF but I don't think that he has that kind of capability on offense. Talking about who to trade is awfully hard when we don't know what kind of offers there would be. My perception would be that Horford has a ton more value than Smith so thats probably where I would look to make a trade.