Laker's supporting cast - over rated ?

Moderators: Clav, Domejandro, ken6199, bisme37, Dirk, KingDavid, cupcakesnake, bwgood77, zimpy27, infinite11285

User avatar
Silver Bullet
General Manager
Posts: 8,313
And1: 10
Joined: Dec 24, 2006

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#441 » by Silver Bullet » Tue May 19, 2009 6:38 am

anklebreaker702 wrote:
Silver Bullet wrote:I keep hearing about how Kobe's supporting cast is so good, it would be insane if they don't win a title. I however don't see how they can win the title, when they have the softest players in the league from 3 to 11 (I didn't include Fisher).
Paul Gasol
Lamar Odom
Vujacic
Ariza
Walton

Which of these players would you be comfortable with taking a game winning bucket ?
Now I know Gasol is an all star, but so is Chris Bosh and the guy deserves to be an all star if the award were for the first 3 and a half quarters. But in the last 4-5 minutes of a close game, I'd rather have Jarron or Jason Collins over Bosh (at least they'd play some defense).

Ask yourself this, if it comes down to making a big bucket, who would you trust more: Mo Williams or Gasol, Boobie Gibson or Ariza.

If it comes down to grabbing a big rebound, who'd you rather have, Varejao or Gasol ?

If you needed a big stop and both Kobe and Lebron has fouled out? who would you trust more, the Lakers or the Cavs.

In every single case, I find myself picking the Cavs - even though I know, the general consensus is that Cavs have a much weaker supporting cast. I see it the other way. The Cavaliers have hard nosed tough guys, who can battle it out, whereas the Lakers supporting cast plays like a bunch of sissies when things get rough.

This is official Hateraide! The only person we call soft on the team is Gasol & that's only when he doesn't show up. Point blank period the Cavs are too Lebron dependent! The Lakers can strike from many ways & if these 22 teams meet in the finals you keep forgetting the Cavs have no inside presence whatsoever. Gasol & Bynum will dominate!


Biz Z is no inside presence whatsoever ? I'd rather have him than Bynum.
dropbowsonem_25
Senior
Posts: 526
And1: 0
Joined: Apr 29, 2009

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#442 » by dropbowsonem_25 » Tue May 19, 2009 6:59 am

odom's not soft, inconsistent maybe, but not soft
chubby_1_kenobi wrote

"Like I said, Kobe has done a number to your soul...it is tainted black with hatred"
guy1
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,814
And1: 124
Joined: Aug 22, 2007

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#443 » by guy1 » Tue May 19, 2009 5:31 pm

Bgil wrote:
Wade2k6 wrote:I love how all the blame is put on the supporting cast, but no blame is ever put on Kobe. Kobe didn't show up for game 7, his supporting cast did. And now all the sudden it's "OH WELL DID YOU SEE THE GAMES BEFORE??"

'
Lol @ the idea of Kobe not showing up. Please stop depending on box scores for your analysis.

in fact, kobe took great shots in game 7 outside of that super deep bizaro three at the end of the first half. several of his misses drew so much attention that the bigs litterally walked down the lane to recover the miss and put it back in. He fed the post beatifully, controlled the tempo, played great d, and didn't force anything. Notice that Kobe was a plus 19 or so despite not playing a ton of minutes and just coasting through garbage time.


Not saying you're totally wrong, but how the hell does Kobe get a pass that absolutely no one else would? Jordan would've never gotten it. Shaq would've never gotten it. Lebron doesn't get it. And how does it not pretty much destroy the OPs argument? The Lakers would've probably won this game even if Kobe didn't play. Thats how great the supporting cast was that night. Its not really that big of a deal that Kobe went 4-12, cause he really didn't need to do much. However, to act like Kobe had some great game, and without him they would've lost is a bit ridiculous. Pau Gasol easily was the best player of the game.
User avatar
TonyMontana
RealGM
Posts: 11,726
And1: 398
Joined: Apr 27, 2006
Location: Loungin in the Cali sun.
     

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#444 » by TonyMontana » Tue May 19, 2009 5:38 pm

anklebreaker702 wrote: Gasol & Bynum will dominate!
Image
Dat Pass
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,377
And1: 46
Joined: Feb 18, 2009

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#445 » by Dat Pass » Wed May 20, 2009 3:18 pm

Lakers frontcourt got outplayed again in the playoffs.

Nene/K-Mart/Birdman - 37pts (15-27 55%), 18 boards, 5 blocks, 4 turnovers

Bynum/Gasol/Odom - 26pts (10-20 50%), 28 boards, 6 blocks, 5 turnovers

For everyone here claiming this the Lakers have the best frontcourt in the league by far, and the Lakers supporting cast is so amazing, they continue to get outplayed by inferior competition. Agaisnt Houston, the Rockets injured frontcourt matched or outplayed the Lakers frontcourt way too many times.
Blame Rasho
On Leave
Posts: 42,166
And1: 9,895
Joined: Apr 25, 2002

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#446 » by Blame Rasho » Wed May 20, 2009 3:28 pm

I would rather be plus 10 on the boards than plus 11 with points with my bigs....
Dat Pass
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,377
And1: 46
Joined: Feb 18, 2009

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#447 » by Dat Pass » Wed May 20, 2009 3:32 pm

Blame Rasho wrote:I would rather be plus 10 on the boards than plus 11 with points with my bigs....


Yea, I was kinda thinking the same thing when I posted it.

But if the Nuggets were told that Birdman/K-Mart/Nene were going to either outplay or at least negate the production of Gasol/Odom/Bynum, I pretty confident the Nuggets would be extatic about that. The Lakers "Big 3" outside of Kobe havent shown up for these playoffs much (Especially considering the competition). At least not in the same game.
Ayt
RealGM
Posts: 59,166
And1: 15,034
Joined: Jun 27, 2005

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#448 » by Ayt » Wed May 20, 2009 5:10 pm

Ball Boy wrote:Lakers frontcourt got outplayed again in the playoffs.

Nene/K-Mart/Birdman - 37pts (15-27 55%), 18 boards, 5 blocks, 4 turnovers

Bynum/Gasol/Odom - 26pts (10-20 50%), 28 boards, 6 blocks, 5 turnovers

For everyone here claiming this the Lakers have the best frontcourt in the league by far, and the Lakers supporting cast is so amazing, they continue to get outplayed by inferior competition. Agaisnt Houston, the Rockets injured frontcourt matched or outplayed the Lakers frontcourt way too many times.


The Lakers killed it on the offensive boards. They had 17 overall, and Gasol/Bynum/Odom had 10 of them. The dominance of the Lakers bigs on the offensive glass could be the key to the series.
JordansBulls
RealGM
Posts: 60,467
And1: 5,349
Joined: Jul 12, 2006
Location: HCA (Homecourt Advantage)

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#449 » by JordansBulls » Wed May 20, 2009 5:32 pm

guy1 wrote:
Bgil wrote:
Wade2k6 wrote:I love how all the blame is put on the supporting cast, but no blame is ever put on Kobe. Kobe didn't show up for game 7, his supporting cast did. And now all the sudden it's "OH WELL DID YOU SEE THE GAMES BEFORE??"

'
Lol @ the idea of Kobe not showing up. Please stop depending on box scores for your analysis.

in fact, kobe took great shots in game 7 outside of that super deep bizaro three at the end of the first half. several of his misses drew so much attention that the bigs litterally walked down the lane to recover the miss and put it back in. He fed the post beatifully, controlled the tempo, played great d, and didn't force anything. Notice that Kobe was a plus 19 or so despite not playing a ton of minutes and just coasting through garbage time.


Not saying you're totally wrong, but how the hell does Kobe get a pass that absolutely no one else would? Jordan would've never gotten it. Shaq would've never gotten it. Lebron doesn't get it. And how does it not pretty much destroy the OPs argument? The Lakers would've probably won this game even if Kobe didn't play. Thats how great the supporting cast was that night. Its not really that big of a deal that Kobe went 4-12, cause he really didn't need to do much. However, to act like Kobe had some great game, and without him they would've lost is a bit ridiculous. Pau Gasol easily was the best player of the game.



Exactly!!!

This Lakers team is loaded from top to bottom. Inside scoring, shot blocking, rebounding, outside scoring, 3 point shooting, a stud PG in Fisher and good SG in Kobe and a lockdown defender at the SF in Ariza.
Image
"Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships."
- Michael Jordan
USA
Banned User
Posts: 5,871
And1: 455
Joined: Nov 11, 2008
       

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#450 » by USA » Wed May 20, 2009 5:37 pm

Fisher is a stud pg???

Ariza is a lock down defender???

When did this happen???
microfib4thewin
Head Coach
Posts: 6,275
And1: 454
Joined: Jun 20, 2008
 

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#451 » by microfib4thewin » Wed May 20, 2009 5:44 pm

JordansBulls wrote:a stud PG in Fisher.


I always laugh at this.
User avatar
eatyourchildren
Lead Assistant
Posts: 4,501
And1: 11
Joined: Mar 26, 2007

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#452 » by eatyourchildren » Wed May 20, 2009 6:30 pm

JordanBulls always shoots himself in the foot with his comments. Hilarious.

Stud PG in Fisher...lol. Except for all the times I wanted to throw a remote control at the tv when he gets subbed in and decides to drive it on 3 defenders during a fast break.
ugkfan2681" wrote: wrote: i dont take **** lightly im from the land of the trill home of the rockets RESPECT OK.
lakegz1
Junior
Posts: 353
And1: 6
Joined: Jan 24, 2009

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#453 » by lakegz1 » Wed May 20, 2009 6:45 pm

microfib4thewin wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:a stud PG in Fisher.


I always laugh at this.


I think he's just fantasizes about Fisher and his physique at night.
Dat Pass
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,377
And1: 46
Joined: Feb 18, 2009

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#454 » by Dat Pass » Wed May 20, 2009 6:54 pm

JordansBulls wrote:Exactly!!!

This Lakers team is loaded from top to bottom. Inside scoring, shot blocking, rebounding, outside scoring, 3 point shooting, a stud PG in Fisher and good SG in Kobe and a lockdown defender at the SF in Ariza.


You clearly havent watched the Lakers much.
User avatar
CB4MiamiHeat
General Manager
Posts: 8,694
And1: 2
Joined: Jun 13, 2004

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#455 » by CB4MiamiHeat » Wed May 20, 2009 7:01 pm

Lakers frontcourt dominated the boards...Ariza, Farmar, Fisher all made timely clutch threes..Ariza made the biggest play of the game with the steal...the bench dominated the Nuggets bench and brought the team back from double digits. After Game 7 and now Game 1 this thread is lookin worst as time goes by..
Dat Pass
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,377
And1: 46
Joined: Feb 18, 2009

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#456 » by Dat Pass » Wed May 20, 2009 7:08 pm

CB4MiamiHeat wrote:Lakers frontcourt dominated the boards...Ariza, Farmar, Fisher all made timely clutch threes..Ariza made the biggest play of the game with the steal...the bench dominated the Nuggets bench and brought the team back from double digits. After Game 7 and now Game 1 this thread is lookin worst as time goes by..


You cant be serious.. Your using yesterdays game as proof?

1. Ariza got lit the f*** up by Carmelo. Absolutely embarrassed.

2. Lakers frontcourt (Gasol/Bynum/Odom) got outscored 37-26 by the Nuggets frontcourt. (Nene/K-Mart/Birdman) That is pretty damn sad when you stop and think about it.

3. Ariza/Farmar/Vujacic/Brown combined for 4-13 from 3pt. (30%)

I think #2 speaks for itself though. Everyone creams their pants when they see Gasol/Bynum/Odom on paper, but they got beat up in last nights game, and beat up in the Rockets series.. Even when Yao went down, the Lakers were supposed to pound it inside and couldnt do it.
User avatar
Silver Bullet
General Manager
Posts: 8,313
And1: 10
Joined: Dec 24, 2006

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#457 » by Silver Bullet » Wed May 20, 2009 7:17 pm

CB4MiamiHeat wrote:Lakers frontcourt dominated the boards...Ariza, Farmar, Fisher all made timely clutch threes..Ariza made the biggest play of the game with the steal...the bench dominated the Nuggets bench and brought the team back from double digits. After Game 7 and now Game 1 this thread is lookin worst as time goes by..


Yea, anybody who uses yesterday's game against this thread is smoking something.

Fisher launched a stupid shot over three defenders every time he came in.

Gasol was invisible on offense. When he had those two free throws at 99-99, did anyone else feel he was gonna brick both ?

Odom kept launching idiotic shots over taller guys.

Same for Walton and Vujacic.

Ariza was sensible on offense, but got manhandled by Melo at the other end.

If anything, last nights game was definitive proof that the Lakers need significant changes next year, weather they win the championship or not.
User avatar
C'mon Cavs
Starter
Posts: 2,053
And1: 5
Joined: Jan 21, 2008

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#458 » by C'mon Cavs » Wed May 20, 2009 7:20 pm

Gasol was invisible on offense.


Because they didn't give him the ball. He's one of the best low post scorers in the NBA and he only got one post up opportunity that I can recall. Apparently Kobe's twisting fadeaways are the preferred shot in L.A.
User avatar
Benedict_Boozer
RealGM
Posts: 17,115
And1: 5,817
Joined: Aug 08, 2004

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#459 » by Benedict_Boozer » Wed May 20, 2009 7:28 pm

I always thought fans of a team overrated their own players, but the opposite seems to be happening in this thread...no homer love for Gasol, Odom, and Co. apparently in LA.
Dat Pass
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,377
And1: 46
Joined: Feb 18, 2009

Re: Laker's supporting cast - over rated ? 

Post#460 » by Dat Pass » Wed May 20, 2009 7:32 pm

Benedict_Boozer wrote:I always thought fans of a team overrated their own players, but the opposite seems to be happening in this thread...no homer love for Gasol, Odom, and Co. apparently in LA.


I love Gasol and Odom. But I have problems with both. Odom disappears way too many times, and usually when we need him most. And Gasol has been going up agaisnt much weaker opponents in the playoffs this year and isnt dominating like he should. He was ineffective last night, and got punked by Luis Scola a couple times in the last series.

I love both of them, but I personally feel they're a bit overrated by people around here.

Return to The General Board