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Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense

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Sedale Threatt
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#41 » by Sedale Threatt » Sun May 24, 2009 9:48 pm

anklebreaker702 wrote:That's why I didn't ride him too hard last night. All through my posts I kept saying Pau is gassed because Phil wont play any of the other 3 players he could go to. Bynum can never be the "savior" or anything else as long as he's always nailed to the bench


But ankle, certainly Andrew bears some of the responsibility for the dog house he's apparently in right now, would you not agree? It's not a one-way street.

This isn't to defend Pau's lack of defense at all; no question he's a poor team defender, and he doesn't provide nearly the shot blocking presence for someone with his length and IQ. He's an obvious liability in that regard.

But overall, his contributions are very largely positive. He handles huge minutes night in and night out -- something you have recognized and lauded in numerous instances -- he gives us a highly efficient hub to run the offense through in the low post, and he's a quality rebounder.

It just frustrates me because we've got a guy on the roster in Andrew who would seem to have all the qualities to be an above-average defensive anchor and help negate some of our weak spots, and he just doesn't seem very interested in filling that role.

He does it in spurts, but his primary motivation obviously stems from how many points he scores, and that simply isn't what this team needs. He can't be blind to that fact because I've seen video footage during games of Phil telling Andrew to rebound and play defense and let everything else come to him.

I guarantee you that Andrew's reticence to follow that directive is a major reason why Phil doesn't trust him right now. I mean, here we are trying to win a championship and Andrew's people are apparently calling the front office to complain about playing time and, presumably, touches.

WTF is that?
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#42 » by kevin_405 » Sun May 24, 2009 10:07 pm

If u have read either the Last Season or Maverick u will understand how Phil works.. He takes the whole season to work with the role players to get a chance to contribute during key moments so that they are ready come crunch time.

For the last 2 years Bynum has been MIA due to injuries during the critical stretch.. This year in the playoffs his starts have not been great and usually he is in foul trouble or has not played with enough intensity on defense. All these lapses are because of inexp and the long layoff..

Phil doesn't trust him period.. and LO and Pau are huge on the defensive end in the 4th Q for us.
Phil will never play Bynum in the 4th Q until he sees all of the above mentioned or if LO and Pau are in foul trouble.

It is for the same reason Farmar is still in phils dog house over Sasha and Fish, although Farmar is doing much better in the limited min compared to Bynum..



anklebreaker702 wrote:That's why I didn't ride him too hard last night. All through my posts I kept saying Pau is gassed because Phil wont play any of the other 3 players he could go to. Bynum can never be the "savior" or anything else as long as he's always nailed to the bench
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#43 » by Verbal » Sun May 24, 2009 11:12 pm

kevin_405, you're a solid contributor to this Lakers Forum - you must post more! :D

I agree w/ most of what you said about your assessment on Gasol.

It's ridiculous to nail Gasol on the cross when he's part of the minority that isn't in my doghouse.

Your observations on the rest of the team is spot-on as well!

Farmar has to just suck it up and follow orders.

If he doesn't like Phillup and the coach is still here next year, he can bolt for New York or something.

I'll even support him - as long as we win the championship this year.

LAKERS GLORY!
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#44 » by Verbal » Sun May 24, 2009 11:19 pm

Erik Eleven wrote:Good to see you back, but can we have the good old V back, please? What did they do to you?


I don't know what the hell you mean.

But I do know you don't like throwing punches and getting jabbed back. ;)


What they did to me can be read or heard sometime in the future if I decide to publish it or if some thieving ass dead men steal it or accuse it upon me (usually behind my back, whe n I'm not around; afterall, when the Sun shines, ROACHES AND RATS HIDE!)


Maybe we'll eventually be cool again.

I'm not a politician like you carry yourself to be, and I don't intend to be.

If you take offense to the truth I kick, I won't apologize.

And like miles likes to say, "That is all."

:wave:


ps- OFF THE RECORD, I know what you mean now... you're thinking weapon 11, aint chu? YOUKNOWIT! HAHHAHAHA. =]
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#45 » by Verbal » Sun May 24, 2009 11:21 pm

ST- Phil and Bynum seem to have "resolved" their differences via the media already.

The goal is the championship.

Nothing will get in my/our way. 8-)


WEST5IDE!

"ALL THE TIME - ANYTIME!"
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#46 » by kevin_405 » Sun May 24, 2009 11:33 pm

Thanks for the compliment...

BTW Kobe is fired up to bring us home.. there is no stopping us now..


Verbal wrote:kevin_405, you're a solid contributor to this Lakers Forum - you must post more! :D

I agree w/ most of what you said about your assessment on Gasol.

It's ridiculous to nail Gasol on the cross when he's part of the minority that isn't in my doghouse.

Your observations on the rest of the team is spot-on as well!

Farmar has to just suck it up and follow orders.

If he doesn't like Phillup and the coach is still here next year, he can bolt for New York or something.

I'll even support him - as long as we win the championship this year.

LAKERS GLORY!
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#47 » by EHL » Mon May 25, 2009 7:42 am

That's who Gasol is, it has always been his biggest flaw. But frankly, Gasol is the least of the Lakers' problems. Where the hell is Bynum? Talk about not sacking up. Even if he gets it together for the Finals, the Lakers were (and could still be) very close to losing a series.
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#48 » by Showtime:Part2 » Mon May 25, 2009 10:21 am

the only time bynum seems to get a rebound nowadays is when it falls right into his lap.
Warspite:

Prince + filler for Kobe Bryant
To be honest the way Prince has played and with Kobes injury/age/mileage Im not sure I would do that deal either. Still Prince is more important and he wins the head to head battles with Kobe.
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#49 » by SashAlex » Mon May 25, 2009 10:39 am

Erik Eleven wrote:Who else has noticed how he stands still down there, lets bigs and smalls run around him and then reaches in lazily from behind for the block attempt, something which almost always fails? It happens on pretty much every attack to the rim when Gasol is in the game.

I've been outraged over this lack of defensive will from him down low all season long, but I thought it had to do with him staying out of foul trouble and staying healthy while Andrew was out, so I never said anything about it here before. It's bothered me all season, but this is the playoffs, excuse time is over.

We're talking uncontested dunks! It's the playoffs, and all players who attempt a dunk or layup should either be knocked on their ass, blocked extremely hard or wrapped up for the foul to prevent the shot attempt. No easy buckets allowed, period. Again, it's the playoffs — every possession counts like the last.

Until Gasol starts playing defense like a true big man in the post, I'm going to predict for the record that we won't win the Championship. Our biggest detriment is still our inability to execute the post entry pass, kick-out and re-post, and off-the ball movement, but our low-post free pass Spanish Yield defense is nothing short of embarrassing.

Check the sack, Pau. ¿Donde esta el Fuego?


EE, you know how much I respect you, but...we traded Kwame Brown, Javaris Crittenton, Marc Gasol. A. McKie :lol: and two late 1st round picks. We traded these guys for a versatile C-PF that made us contenders again, and, as much as I love Bynum, we wouldn't be up there only with Drew.

Man, he's a consistent 20+10 guy, and even with lack of defensive effort at times, that's huge for a team with Kobe Bryant. Not to mention the fact that he is a great 1st option when Kobe sits down.

You can't ask for more from him, he's got what he's got. He's Pau Gasol, he's not Kevin Garnett for whom Wolves were asking Lamar and Bynum. We could give some of our core players for Pau too if Memphis weren't that helpful. :D
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#50 » by Showtime:Part2 » Mon May 25, 2009 10:52 am

usually i see pau coming over to help on melo and either odom/bynum forgetting to rotate down low... there were 3 straight plays where jr smith drove the lane, pau helped, and smith dished for a wide open dunk. i also don't see much wrong with his low post defense. if u see the way they've been calling big guys in this series -- nene, bynum, odom --- gasol is actually playing quite smart. given that the two boneheads known as odom and bynum can't seem to stay out of foul trouble, pau is doing a terrific job.
Warspite:



Prince + filler for Kobe Bryant

To be honest the way Prince has played and with Kobes injury/age/mileage Im not sure I would do that deal either. Still Prince is more important and he wins the head to head battles with Kobe.
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#51 » by Verbal » Mon May 25, 2009 12:53 pm

EHL!

I haven't seen you in years. :o

Good to have you back on this board!
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#52 » by Polvoron » Mon Jun 15, 2009 10:53 am

slifersd wrote:Pau Gasol could very well be the worst low post defender in this playoffs

LOL.
slifersd wrote:Personally, I think there is no chance of us winning a championship or become as good a team as we can be without Bynum getting a ton of minutes at center. Sure, he is not playing at 100% and has his problems on offense, but the one thing I did notice whenever he is playing is that we protect the basket so much better.

Personally I think you don't watch the games.
This or you have the basketball IQ of a watermelon.
Kilroy wrote:And I have my doubts that we can ever win a championship if Gasol plays center for us for anything more than spot minutes...

I disagree.
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#53 » by anuroc » Mon Jun 15, 2009 8:30 pm

hehehe, it seems you were waiting several weeks with the axe ready
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#54 » by Kilroy » Mon Jun 15, 2009 9:01 pm

Kilroy wrote:And I have my doubts that we can ever win a championship if Gasol plays center for us for anything more than spot minutes...

I disagree.[/quote]

I'm as high on the victory as the next guy... But I still stand by what I said... I still have my doubts.

Sure Gasol played great for the last 6 games of the post season and he always got his numbers. But you have to admit he had a hell of a time getting there... He got pushed around a lot, and the minutes Bynum layed his weight on Howard helped him stay fresh.

My post had little to do with Gasol's game or his skill-set... It was directed at the makeup and effectiveness of the team...

Gasol is awesome and I believe a Gosol/Odom combo is good enough to get us to WCF... But I think we need a bruiser inside that can body-up the biggest guys in the league and not get pushed around.

I don't want Gasol to be that guy, becuase I like him lythe and fast on his feet.

Bynum needs to step up and be that guy for us. Anything else from him is gravy... Until you start looking at his paycheck.
Never have rice at Hanzo's house...
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#55 » by Erik Eleven » Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:30 pm

He's played better defense since. Consistently, too. He finally manned up, and so did the entire team — as a true team.
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Re: Calling Out Gasol's Low Post Defense 

Post#56 » by Erik Eleven » Mon Jun 15, 2009 11:57 pm

Bynum wasn't going to be all that this post season. It was pretty obvious, to those of us that saw him put up 26-13 in January, that he did not come back at full strength after injury. We could not have afforded for Pau to keep on not picking up the slack in the paint. Hence this thread. Three weeks back, he wasn't playing the way he played in the last two games, period.

Defensively, he should keep doing next season what he finally has been doing the last few weeks — playing hard team defense, helping, rotating, staying down, boxing out etc. Pau was absolutely key in this championship win. His low post defense in the two last games was not only legit — it was that of a worthy NBA champion.

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