What Should the Wizards Should Do with the 5th Pick?

[closg00]

If Ernie hadn't over-paid for Gilbert, AJ, & DS, do you think we would going so hard for the trade-down/pick dump?

[LyricalRico]

If Ernie hadn't over-paid for Gilbert, AJ, & DS, do you think we would going so hard for the trade-down/pick dump?

Last I looked, we weren't "going hard for a trade-down/pick dump". Everything credible (meaning not Tom Knott) points to the Wizards shopping the pick for a veteran who can help them win now. IMO they aren't trying to dump anything.

[nate33]

I understand why you disagree. And I'm not going to debate this. It's silly since it's never going to happen. I'll simply tell you my thinking.

Even if I conceded that McGee can play PF (which I don't), you still have Howard and Terry playing out of position.

Howard has played SG. Is he better at SF? Of course. And the only problem with SFs playing SGs is whether or not they can defend SGs. Howard has proven many times over that he can. In fact, Howard can defend 2, 3, and 4. Which means with him on the floor, you don't have to worry about switches as much. It also means we have shutdown defenders at every spot. And as I said, with SFs at SG, you increase your rebounding -- thus, increase your fast breaking ability and decrease second chance points.

Terry hasn't played PG since his days in Atlanta. Why? Because he's not a PG.

Is he more of a PG than Crit? Do you think he'd be more effective than Crit? Also, with that line-up, for a third of the time you can rotate Terry to SG with Arenas. And since Terry is such a good defender, that works as well.

Sorry but zero depth plus guys playing out of position equals disaster IMO.

Right. I didn't actually think through a trade. I was just throwing a line-up out to give a general idea. I'd MLE a defensive C etc. Or, as I said, try to keep Blatche. It really depends on how badly they want to get rid of Howard. Anyway, whatever.... not worth debating something that isn't going to happen.

I think you can make a fair argument that Josh Howard could go exist with Caron Butler in our starting rotation. I could live with a #5 plus filler for Josh Howard trade. I don't love it, but I can live with it. Jason Terry is the guy that doesn't fit. We simply cannot afford to pay a 3rd guard $10M a year.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

From Chad Ford:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/draft2009 ... aft-090610

"As we've been reporting since draft lottery night, the Wizards continue to shop the pick. A source in Washington told me that they've had a number of interesting offers. Their goal is to get back a veteran who can play right now and to shed a few million dollars off their cap if possible.

A number of teams including the Knicks, Mavericks, Rockets and Pacers are all possibilities here. If they keep the pick, they'll have a tough choice between Harden and Hill. From the intel I've received, it sounds as though Harden may be slightly ahead.
"

Wow. Chad Ford has Tyreke Evans going 4th, or possibly 2nd in the draft. Chad tends to get more accurate the closer we get to draft night, so this may well be true. I hope he's right. If Evans and Thabeet both go in the top 4, it'll guarantee that we get either Rubio or Harden.

I wish Chad Ford and Jonathan Givony and Matthew Maurer and anyone else with scouting expertise/influence would leak to Grunfeld that Jordan Hill is suck. Call me a source.

I've said guys would be great and missed here and there. But on guys I'm not at all impressed with I'm pretty good. I booed Javale draft night out of ignorance and came around a day or two later to say he's got good potential. When I saw him play I said better than good potential.

Same with Pecherov. I said Milsap over him and Shelden Williams. But seeing OPEC in summer league and when his J is dropping, I say he's potential a Mehmet Okur/Vlad Radmanovic. Not a bum.

Well, I feel like Jordan Hill is potentially just what Dat called him: Tyrone Hill

Him or who another poster called him: Dale Davis

IN A FEW YEARS .....

So right now, the Wizards had better either draft Hill wth trading one of their other potential guys in mind...

Or, do the smart thing and draft Curry or Harden or even Blair.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

It was ludicrous to come up against the cap signing Jamison and an injured Arenas. Said so before Grunfeld went and did it.

Now, it's LUDICROUS to HAVE TO trade away the pick if it's Curry.

The reason those teams that have better records and arguably better GMs want that #5 is they want a superior talent.

The smartest thing the Wizards could do if they land Curry with the 5 is hold on to him and trade somebody else.

[Rafael122]

Interesting, we worked out Terrence Williams today. He can guard 3 positions. Been a big fan of his since last fall.

Something is up. Ty Lawson, and now Terrence Williams. I think Ernie has a trade in his pocket and I think Mike James is the one being traded with the 5th pick.

[WizarDynasty]

I think we still need to not sleep on Jordan Hill. The guy's ball handling skills on perimeter are really nice for a bigman and he actually can shoot effectively with one hand. He often dunks with one hand and that's something we rarely ever saw from kwame (small hands-I wouldn't be as worried about Hill ability to catch tough passes since his hands are actually big and his hands are good enough to dribble in traffic). Also, looking at his footage he will immediately be our best post offensive man on the team. His post moves are way stronger than Haywood,McGee's, Blatche's, and Jamison's. He will be our primary post option. He has a high energy component and actually gets off the ground when making his offensive moves-31 inch vertical and 35--and he is over 6'9 w/o shoes. . Hill is a two way powerforward is already better at age 22 than Jamison is at 30.
We have Blatche locked in longterm as our backup p/f. haywood and Mcgee are locked in as our centers. Getting HIll allows us to trade Jamison and replace him with a two way p/f. He's got a real strong work ethic, very coachable, and likes to bang inside. None of our current bigs outside of Haywood like to bang inside-Hill automatically brings toughness. He immediately adds a toughness to this team that has been lacking and the kid is fluid with both hands inside the paint. Again, he immediately becomes our best post player and he is also a threat with his midrange jumpshot-Etan has poor footspeed and no reliable mid range jumper. HIll actually has dribble moves to free up his midrange jumper. He immediately becomes our best defensive re bounder since he rebounds outside of area, pushes and scraps for position unlike Javale and Blatche. What's even more impressive his is quick release in the paint.
Hill is immediately our two way p/f of the future and the comparisons to Bosh are really legit.
Obviously i like clark more than him, but hill automatically has the chance to be one of the top powerforward in the eastern conference-his motor, and defensive rebounding, shotblocking, and jumpshot..rare combinations for one player. The biggest thing that impresses me about him his that he enjoys contact where as blatche, McGee and Jamison absolutely hate physical contact and battling for position. We got blatche locked up longtime and he is an excellent backup powerforward, McGee has time to grow into a the roll of center. Getting Hill immediately solves our defensive problems on a nightly basis and Hill isn't a downgrade offensively from Jamison because he can hit the midrange jumper consistently, and his post game and quick release around the basket are far better than Jamison. And remember Jamison isn't even a great three point shooter even though he shoots uncontested three pointers. There is no way Hill should slip on our board especially when you have Jamison starting. We can immediately Trade Jamison with acquisition of Hill. Life as a wizard fan will be much better. I like Clark as our defensive small forward, but deep down i know that Hill gives us everything Jamison gives plus defense and stronger post game.
And with all the questions about his IQ, his defensive basketball IQ can't be worse than Jamison as our starting p/f on defense. A bigman with a 31 inch no step vertical mean he has explosiveness even if his lane agility shows 12.33. I see his agility definitely improving considering how explosive a leaper he is, as well as his agility when driving through crowds on his way to basket and finishing. His impact is greater than Evans, Curry, Harden. The chances of the wizards ever getting a player of Hill's size, motor, offensive interior quick release and perimeter scoring ability, hustle, rebounding, and shot blocking ability, excellent hardworking character, with an explosive vertical, and ability to finish with both hands on either side of the rim and dunk with one hand..."meaning he can palm the ball"..all of these attributes means he will never hit free agency and really is on the level of chris bosh. Deep down I like him more than Clark for this team only because the way things are looking EG will pick go with what scouts are saying instead of what's best for the team.

Clark solves our longterm problems on the perimeter. If we don't get Clark, at least get rid of Jamison by getting Hill. If we get Curry, Evans, Harden..that ensures that Jamison is logging heavy minutes nightly for at least another two years and I refuse to watch Jamison stand at the three point line and wait for everyone to give him easy assists to boost up his offensive production and then when we need a high percentage shot, we watch Jamsion do a weak running flip shot instead of getting the opposing bigs in foul trouble. And I hate watching Jamison get shot over night after night and never block a shot. We all know Jamison doesn't command a double team in the paint which is why we have to work so hard on offense. Hate watching Blatche and Jamison not banging inside and not able to secure defensive rebounds outside of their space. With Hill, that problem is solved. Picking Harden, Curry, and Evans guarantees that the nightmare will continue of Jamison continuing to log heavy minutes. Picking Hill as a high lottery ensures that he is our p/f of the future and his high lottery selection will give Saunders the freedom to heavily reduce Jamison's minutes. Hill's high motor means we won't see a huge fall off in stamina related effort like we see with our backup p/f Blatche. Picking Harden, Curry, and Evans guarantees that the nightmare will continue of Jamison continuing to log heavy minutes. I love clark since i know he is an all defensive first team perimeter nba player.

Hill is a two way p/f that lets up trade Jamison and not worry about a fall off offensively. Hill ends the Wizards defensive nightmares of allowing Jamison to log heavy minutes since Blatche has stamina, poor vertical, and defensive rebounding issues, and doesn't have a quick release in the paint like Hill. Hill and blatche is an excellent longterm solution at the powerforward spot. McGee and Haywood are excellent for our center spot. As much as I hate on caron for his defense, I think he can not worry as much when he knows that either Blatche or Hill are on the floor behind him at all times, with Haywood and McGee. Hill is the answer that brings us back to being contenders. harden, curry and evans means that we have to keep Jamison and let him log heavy minutes.

[DaRealHibachi]

I think we still need to not sleep on Jordan Hill. The guy ball handling skills on perimeter is really nice for a bigman and he actually can shoot effectively with one hand. He often dunks with one hand and that's something we rarely ever seen from kwame. Also, looking at his footage he will immediately be our best post offensive man on the team. His post moves are way stronger than Haywood,McGee's, Blatche's, and Jamison's. He will be our primary post option. He has a high energy component and actually gets off the ground when making his offensive moves. Hill is a two way powerforward is already better at age 22 than Jamison is at 30.
We have Blatche locked in longterm as our backup p/f. haywood and Mcgee our locked in as our centers. Getting HIll allows us to trade Jamison and replace him with a two way p/f. He's got a real strong work ethic, very coachable, and likes to bang inside. None of our current bigs outside of Haywood like to bang inside. He immediately adds a toughness to this team that has been lacking and the kid is fluid with both hands inside the paint. Again, he immediately becomes our best post player and he is also a threat with his midrange jumpshot. He immediately becomes our best defensive rebounder since he rebounds outside of area, pushes and scraps for position unlike Javale and Blatche. What's even more impressive his is quick release in the paint.
Hill is immediately our two way p/f of the future.
Obviously i like clark more than him, but hill automatically has the chance to be one of the top powerforward in the eastern conference. The biggest thing that impresses me about him his that he enjoys contact where as blatche, McGee and Jamison absolutely hate physical contact and battling for position. We got blatche locked up longtime and he is an excellent backup powerforward, McGee has time to grow into a the roll of center. Getting Hill immediately solves our defensive problems on a nightly basis and Hill isn't a downgrade offensive from Jamison because he can hit the midrange jumper consistently, and his post game and quick release around the basket are far better than Jamison. There is no way Hill should slip on our board especially when you have Jamison starting. We can immediately Trade Jamison with acquisition of Hill. Life as a wizard fan will be much better. I like Clark as our defensive small forward, but deep down i know that Hill gives us everything Jamison gives plus defense and stronger post game.
And with all the questions about his IQ, his defensive basketball IQ can't be worse than Jamison as our starting p/f on defense. A bigman with a 31 inch no step vertical mean he has explosiveness even if his lane agility shows 12.33. I see his agility definitely improving considering how explosive a leaper he is, as well as his agility when driving through crowds on his way to basket and finishing. His impact is greater than Evans, Curry, Harden. The chances of the wizards ever getting a player of Hill's size, motor, offensive interior quick release and perimeter scoring ability, hustle, rebounding, and shot blocking ability, excellent hardworking character, with an explosive vertical, and ability to finish with both hands and dunk with one hand..."meaning he can palm the ball"..all of these attributes means he will never hit free agency and really is on the level of chris bosh. Deep down I like him more than Clark for this team only because the way things are looking EG will pick go with what scouts are saying instead of what's best for the team.

Clark solves our longterm problems on the perimeter. If we don't get Clark, at least get rid of Jamison by getting Hill. If we get Curry, Evans, Harden..that ensures that Jamison is logging heavy minutes nightly for at least another two years and I refuse to watch Jamison stand at the three point line and wait for everyone to give him easy assists to boost up his offensive production and then when we need a high percentage shot, we watch Jamsion do a weak running flip shot instead of getting the opposing bigs in foul trouble. And I hate watching Jamison get shot over night after night and never block a shot. Picking Harden, Curry, and Evans guarantees that the nightmare will continue.

I'd do the josh howard for #5 and mike james etan Thomas in a heartbeat. Not going to find an allstar player like that on the market or after draft. Hill has poor hands so its a win win situation. Obviously Clark is the best fit but I'll take howard over Harden, Curry, evans, and derozan.

Dude, make up your mind... Does he have poor hands or not...???

btw, Griffin wouldn't even make us contenders, what makes you think Hill will...???

[closg00]

Interesting, we worked out Terrence Williams today. He can guard 3 positions. Been a big fan of his since last fall.

Something is up. Ty Lawson, and now Terrence Williams. I think Ernie has a trade in his pocket and I think Mike James is the one being traded with the 5th pick.

Ending-up with an up-grade at back-up PG wouldn't be so-bad if we can un-load James. Lawson is a winner.

[WizarDynasty]

griffin doesn't make us contenders because he isn't a defensive powerforward just like Carlos boozer can't shut down his man on defense. Make their effects felt both on offense and defense. I think we are all traumatized by Kwame Brown's poor hands put the guy couldn't palm the ball. From clips i have seen, Jordan Hill can easily dunk the ball with one hand and has excellent touch shooting one handed post up high above rim hook shots. He has excellent touch with his hands and that convinces me that we don't have a small hands kwame brown problem with hill.
But then again, i think Griffin's agility is elite and that makes him excellent guarding out on the perimeter. Upon further thought, Griffin's agility on defense might be enough to make us contenders since he has tools to be a lockdown man to man defender guarding out in space. He won't be great a post defense but he has tools that we don't really right now at the powerforward spot even on defense. Blatche has very good agility but is also a poor defensive rebounder. Griffin has excellent agility and is an excellent defensive rebounder. Boozer doesn't have the elite agility that Griffin has. So I don't know if you can say Griffin doesn't make us contenders.

[jholmbe1]

In the same Ford article that everyone is talking about, he mentions the Wizards as one of the teams considering trading up with Memphis. Seeing that Rubio has said he does not want to play for the Wizards who would we be trading up for? The only players I can think of are Thabeet or Harden. I really doubt Harden slips past OKC but I also don't see Ernie trading up in this draft.

[DCZards]

All this being said, I really would like to get a solid, veteran, AJ-type player with our pick. I really like the Josh Howard idea because he is a good player, positions be damned...

Stay away from Howard. Nice talent but he's injury-prone. Check the record. We'd be lucky to get 60 games a year out of him.

[Ji]

Interesting, we worked out Terrence Williams today. He can guard 3 positions. Been a big fan of his since last fall.

Something is up. Ty Lawson, and now Terrence Williams. I think Ernie has a trade in his pocket and I think Mike James is the one being traded with the 5th pick.

Ending-up with an up-grade at back-up PG wouldn't be so-bad if we can un-load James. Lawson is a winner.

are you crazy? We didnt win 19 games to end up with Ty Lawson

[Pollinator]

In the latest draftexpress podcast, they talk about Curry, Evans, and Flynn moving up- Curry and Evans we knew about, but Givony was saying that some of the teams are looking at Flynn as a Nate Robinson-level athlete with point guard and leadership skills. He didn't mention the Wizards by name, the closest he came to that was saying that Curry might go in the #5 spot.

He didn't mention anything about Brandon Jennings, which surprised me. Anyone see the Chad Ford article on him?

I guess all you can say at this point is that there do seem to be other players outside of Griffin- Rubio- Thabeet who teams below us are starting to get crushes on. So maybe we'll see Grunfeld make a deal. Hopefully something better than Josh Howard. That just doesn't sound like an upgrade from keeping the pick and taking best available.

[AgentOvechkin08]

That last WIzdynasty post made me put him on ignore once and for all...

Really outdid yourself on that one.

[Donkey McDonkerton]

I think Wiz D nasty is a spam bot...

[Wizards2Lottery]

WizNasty is Gilbert. He's messing around with all of us.

[pancakes3]

i, for one, am in awe of the effervescent and unbridled optimism that he posts with - Earl Clark a lebron-stopper, griffin an agile carlos boozer, jordan hill a top 5 PF in the eastern conference...

i mean, come on. don't you all wish you had some of that intoxicating koolaide to sip off of?

ps, kwame sucked because he was soft. having small hands didn't help, but they weren't the reason that he was a bust. evaluating a player based on if he can palm the ball or not is asinine. it has such a little effect on a players' overall game that it's hardly worth mentioning. in fact, the only reason that kwame's hands are now so notorious is because it was a flimsy excuse trying to deflect blame from the management/scouting. Plus - his hands aren't even that small. He can definitely palm a basketball. He just didn't have huge mitts, and I'm certain that scouts the world over were well aware of it before he was drafted.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJ_UINcg-zs

pps, a few posts ago, SOMEbody unduly gave EG the credit for drafting Kwame. that was false. f****** up basic wizards trivia and misconstruing elementary basketball elements like that is what gets some posters on this board on the ignore list.

ppps, last weekend i was drunk texted rather viciously - being called out for being too passive aggressive. i guess she had a point.


AND IN LEGITIMATE LOTTERY NEWS: the wiretap definitely muddles my existing notions on the draft.
1 - Bosh definitely not on market
2 - Thunder could pass on Rubio/Thabeet
3 - Ben Gordon unsure of Bulls commitment
4 - Griffin: curry 2nd best player.

these 4 stories squash all bosh trades, makes it less likely we luck out on Harden, makes it more likely we pick curry, and squash what's left of the Hinrich scenarios. so, net loss of 3 draft scenarios that i like...
the NBA is faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan tastic.

[MUpacersSIC]

Hi Wizards fans! Just here to see what you think of this trade:

Indiana Outgoing:
Troy Murphy
TJ Ford
52 Pick

Indiana Incoming:
DeShawn Stevenson
Brendan Haywood
Mike James
5th Pick

Wizards Outgoing:
DeShawn Stevenson
Brendan Haywood
Mike James
5th Pick

Wizards Incoming:
Troy Murphy
TJ Ford
52nd Pick


Wizards NEW Lineup:
PG TJ Ford
SG Arenas (I personally think a better position for him)
SF Butler
PF Jamison
C Blatche

That's a good starting five with Murphy (2nd or 3rd in double doubles this past season), Crittenton, Young, McGee, Songalia, and Dixon coming off the bench that's a pretty deep team. Let me know what you think of the trade. Feel free to rip it apart, or make suggestions.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

I can't think of anything Etan does that Blatche doesn't do better. Etan sucks. His only use is that he can commit 6 fouls. Unfortunately, despite his bulky appearance, he doesn't even commit hard fouls.

It doesn't matter. Etan is sure to get hurt within his first 500 minutes of action.

Before his heart surgery, Etan was a better rebounder per 36 minutes (seasons with 10 and 9) and has had a better TS% (53% compared to 51%). I'm also going to say Etan is better at staying in shape compared to Blatche. Granted, Blatche is the superior but his skill set, he should be a much better player.

Blatche is 22.

Give him one season with Flip Saunders.

For whatever reason I think Blatche's game is gonna blow up this season.