Dahntay Jones

Joekickass2008 · Post #1 » by **Joekickass2008** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:30 pm

Rumour on Twitter from Stephan Smith saying the C's are trying to grab Dahntay Jones from the Nugs. How do we feel about this?

BillessuR6 · Post #2 » by **BillessuR6** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:38 pm

If he could defend SF`s sure but I see no need for him. We signed him in 2007 but he couldn`t make the team I see no reason to go after him now. We have much bigger needs that back up SG...

humblebum · Post #3 » by **humblebum** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:42 pm

I like Dahntay Jones, very tough player and solid on defense. Not sure he fits alongside Rondo or that he adds a whole lot more than a healthy TA. But he's a solid player and couldn't hurt. Don't think he's a great matchup against opposing SF's though.

Avalanche · Post #4 » by **Avalanche** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:00 pm

is he a free agent or are we trading for him?

hes solid defensively, and seems like he can knock down the three... but really only from the 2 spot

-edit- just checked, appears hes a FA... i wouldnt really want to spend any of the MLE on him, especially before we talk with guys like sheed, marion etc and see where they are at

jfs1000d · Post #5 » by **jfs1000d** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:07 pm

sign me up.

leper-con · Post #6 » by **leper-con** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:15 pm

If this is true ....say good bye to tony Allen.
he will be getting moved during draft time.

Marley2Hendrix · Post #7 » by **Marley2Hendrix** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:16 pm

well for all you Terrence Williams lovers, you know that he comes in at 6'6.25" with a 6'9", coincidentally enough Dahntay Jones shares those same pre-draft measurements (he was slightly shorter w/o shoes on).

He's a smarter Tony Allen with a slightly better, more consistent 3 ball. He's a FA

Avalanche · Post #8 » by **Avalanche** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:18 pm

looking at the stats, i actually thought he shot more 3's...

If hes cheap id bring him in, 6'6 with a big wingspan is actually bigger then i thought also

I wouldnt want to over-pay for a guy like him though

Post #9 » by **sully00** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:28 pm

Thought we should have kept him two years ago he does some nice things, but he is not a SF and he is only a fit for the C's if TA is a gonner.

gocelts · Post #10 » by **gocelts** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:33 pm

It's a good debate here. Tony Allen used to actually be MUCH BETTER than this guy but unfortunatly we have to think of TA now and the talented team he's on. As Tony's game (within our system) and body (knee's and ankles) have regressed over the years, Dahntay's emergence in the playoffs and skill set makes makes him a great canidate for our current team.

That said...I would rather see Walker get some burn at the back up SG, and we go for a bigger SF......if this signing goes down I would assume that TA AND Walker are going to be traded.

Post #11 » by **sully00** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 11:55 pm

Bill Walker is not a SG, he can't handle the ball the way you want him to and he doesn't have 3 pt range at this point. I am a big fan of the kid but I think he is going to be a lot like Ruben Patterson as a player which will be fine as long as he is only like him on the court.

humblebum · Post #12 » by **humblebum** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:01 am

The only way Walker should get minutes next season is if he beats out one or two newly acquired veteran backups or if there are injuries at the wing positions.

As far as Walker's position, I think it's a bit early to say frankly. His development will depend on his work ethic because he has all of the physical tools. And from the little I saw this past year Walker has a chance to be a Cory Maggette type player who's more of a slasher and scorer but a guy who can also stick the mid-range and long two point shots, while mixing in the three in the middle-later stages of his development.

But it's all up in the air as of now and that's why I'm hoping that Danny doesn't plan on relying too heavily on contributions from Walker this coming season, at the SG or SF.

Avalanche · Post #13 » by **Avalanche** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:01 am

Surely Jones would be after part of a MLE wouldnt he? im just not sure hes worth it for us

If we could somehow get him and Sheed, or Birdman i would be happy but those 2 will likely require the full MLE and would Dahntay really take the LLE?

threrf23 · Post #14 » by **threrf23** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:09 am

IMO Dahntay Jones is Tony Allen minus the defensive ability, passing ability, and humility. He's a good athlete, not a great defender, can't shoot, not a good decision maker on the offensive end, plays with the same swagger Perk does except his game isn't good enough to warrant that.

Sure, he turns the ball over less often, but isn't that non-TO prone, and think about what Tony's stat lines would look like if he started alongside our starting lineup and wasn't called on to do much of anything on offense, and wouldn't be likely to be guarded as he wasn't a scoring threat.

Maybe I'm wrong. But this is based off of my own observation, a few years worth of statistics, the observations from other teams' fans, and that SI player poll where he was one of the "thinks he's better than he is" finalists.

humblebum · Post #15 » by **humblebum** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:16 am

Well in general tough, physical, defensive minded players are not very well liked by opponents. Beyond that, guys who take pride in their defense truly have to believe in their ability to stop their opponents from scoring so that explains some of the on the court attitude issues. I wouldn't put much stock in that poll for those reasons.

But I don't see how you could watch Jones and come away thinking that he's not a plus defender. He's physical and very athletic and he's overall just more solid offensively than Tony Allen. Now I don't think you go out and sink a big chunk of money into the guy but IMO he's better than Quinton Ross and likely more reliable than Grant Hill (due to age and injury concerns). So given the options on the backup SG-SF market Jones isn't a bad option.

But as Sully said, Jones doesn't make a ton of sense unless the Celtics plan on unloading Tony in another deal.

Post #16 » by **sully00** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:17 am

Jones has been playing on the minimum for the last two years and he avg 5 ppg as a starter somehow I don't think he is going to be going into this thing with excessive salary demands. The LLE would seem to be his high point in value.

Avalanche · Post #17 » by **Avalanche** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:28 am

if he asks for the LLE then im all for it

gives us the MLE to spend on a big man, and we can use TA in a trade

win win

Post #18 » by **Celtics_Champs** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:31 am

This was a blurb from SAS. Plus he spelt his Jones' name wrong. So I am not going to look that much into it.

Celts17Pride · Post #19 » by **Celts17Pride** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:35 am

leper-con wrote:If this is true ....say good bye to tony Allen.
he will be getting moved during draft time.

threrf23 · Post #20 » by **threrf23** » Tue Jun 23, 2009 12:36 am

humblebum wrote:Well in general tough, physical, defensive minded players are not very well liked by opponents. Beyond that, guys who take pride in their defense truly have to believe in their ability to stop their opponents from scoring so that explains some of the on the court attitude issues. I wouldn't put much stock in that poll for those reasons.

Right, but among other things consider this. He played alongside guys like Nene/K-Mart last season in the starting lineup. Nene's a really solid defender, one of the better defenders in the league. George Karl is quoted as considering K-Mart one of the best defenders in the league. Carmelo played better defense this season than he has in the past. Yet the team's defensive stats were a bit better with Jones on the bench. And his primary backup - JR Smith - an underrated defender but not good enough to not have been considered a defensive liability beginning of the season - ended up with the best defensive +/- numbers on the team.

The thing is, its not just +/- numbers and their analysis that points to him being a poor defender. His counterpart PER was worst on the team. His DRTG was worst on his team. In '06-07, looking at various defensive statistics - he was literally one of the worst defenders in the league. In '07-08, he was a slightly below average defender statistically, but didn't really play enough for the stats to mean anything. He is very foul prone, averaging 5 per 36 minutes last season, and despite that he doesn;t come away with many steals or blocks.

And if you visit a Nuggets message board, fans view his as a capable defender who contributes incosnistently when a match up is right. Not a good defender.

Bruce Bowen has the same rep, but statistically he was consistently one of the league's better or best defenders. People who watched him thought he was one of the league's best defenders. He also hit 3s and made every effort to play within himself at all times on the offensive end.

But I don't see how you could watch Jones and come away thinking that he's not a plus defender. He's physical and very athletic and he's overall just more solid offensively than Tony Allen.

When I've seen him this past season, half the time he doesn't even make an effort to stay in front of his man or to contest shots - he just watches his opponent and is careful to stay just close enough so that it isn't blatantly apparent that he can't play defense - and a player who plays like this shouldn't be so foul prone. He occasionally shows off athleticism of makes a physical play and that might be what a casual observer notices - but it doesn't make him a good or even a decent defender. Perhaps knowing the statistics beforehand hurts my ability to observe impartially, but still...