"Dodgers Could Land Washburn"

[TTown]

Top story on the Wiretap at the top of the page, but the "article" is a bit slim on details.

http://www.realgmbaseball.com/src_wiret ... _washburn/

[Ex-hippie]

I wonder what the asking price for Washburn is. The first thing I want the M's to look for is a middle infield prospects. The Dodgers have two of note. The first is Ivan DeJesus Jr., the son of the same Ivan DeJesus who was once traded for Ryne Sandberg. DeJesus was a high-end prospect but he broke his leg before the season, so he might be more available. The other interesting prospect is Devaris Gordon, also the son of a major leaguer (Tom "Flash" Gordon), who is raw but projectible and has a very high ceiling. Of course, two things the M's have in abundance is raw, projectible, high-upside prospects (Halman, Aumont, Ramirez) and prospects with broken legs (Raben), to say nothing of their prospects who are BOTH raw and have broken legs (Triunfel).

[Bulltalk]

I know this probably amounts to nothing, and I'm not sure why it would be done, but I heard Juan Pierre's name mentioned on sports radio this morning. Did anybody else hear this?

[Sweezo]

Geoff Baker mentioned Juan Pierre's name. But it sounds like nothing of substance...an article comes out saying the Dodgers could be interested in Washburn, someone notes that Pierre's salary matches Washburn's, and bingo...crappy legless rumor is born.

You'd have a hard time convincing me Pierre would mean more to this team than Washburn right now.

[jumanji]

If they didnt move him last year when they were terrible why trade him now when he's pitching well, they're in the race and they are only on the hook for another 5 or 6 mil. Keep him. Having said that dont let the bus leave without having Yuni and Beltre on it.

[Bulltalk]

Geoff Baker mentioned Juan Pierre's name. But it sounds like nothing of substance...an article comes out saying the Dodgers could be interested in Washburn, someone notes that Pierre's salary matches Washburn's, and bingo...crappy legless rumor is born.

You'd have a hard time convincing me Pierre would mean more to this team than Washburn right now.

I heard a baseball pundit (can't remember who) talking about how teams are becoming far less willing to part with good prospects in an effort to make a push for the playoffs, and possible World Series title contention. He gave a pretty convincing argument against the hope of landing anything that could be considered a top tier prospect for the likes of Bedard or Washburn.

I guess I'm preparing myself for the likelihood of being disappointed in what we might get in return for such players that we might be dangling on the trade market. And it may well not be the fault of Z. The possibility could well exist, it seems to me, that Z could end up concluding that it's better to keep certain forthcoming FA's and try to remain competitive for as long as we can, even if, at the end of the day, all we have to show for it is salary coming off-the-books at season's end.

Let's face it, Bavasi left Z a difficult mess to work with. I also find myself asking the question how important it is for management to show the team and the fans how seriously they take winning at all times? Of course, the same thing could be said of Bavasi, and we know what the result of that was under his direction. But should we not give Z a chance to show us his version of it, even if that means he's concluded that what he might have gotten in return for such trade fodder wasn't worth giving up on trying to remain competitive?

Hmmm.....I think I'm just going to sit back and watch what happens, give Z and Waku the benefit of a doubt until proven otherwise. From what I've seen out of them so far, I think they deserve that much from me.

[Ex-hippie]

I heard a baseball pundit (can't remember who) talking about how teams are becoming far less willing to part with good prospects in an effort to make a push for the playoffs, and possible World Series title contention. He gave a pretty convincing argument against the hope of landing anything that could be considered a top tier prospect for the likes of Bedard or Washburn.

You never know, though. Matt LaPorta was traded for a rental of C.C. Sabathia. Neither Bedard nor Washburn is as valuable as Sabathia, though a fully healthy Bedard could come close. It could happen if a team has a good prospect who's blocked from the majors, as was the case with LaPorta (a LF-1B on a team with Ryan Braun and Prince Fielder).

I would raise the question of whether Bedard could be a Type A free agent at season's end (I remember this coming up on a Lookout Landing thread a while back, and it was never resolved). But, since the M's evidently will just use any compensatory picks to overdraft players so they can sign them on the cheap, I won't bother.

[jumanji]

Upon further review it would seem likely, to me at least, that moving Washburn to a contender amounts to the organization trying to help the guy get to the world series. Yeah the Ms are still in it but beneath it all i think they see themselves as rebuilding.

[Ex-hippie]

Upon further review it would seem likely, to me at least, that moving Washburn to a contender amounts to the organization trying to help the guy get to the world series.

For his sake, you mean? They've been ridiculously overpaying the guy for four years; I don't think they owe him anything. And Washburn isn't exactly the kind of guy who comes to mind when you think of long-suffering players who deserve to win, like, say, Jamie Moyer.

Oh yeah, especially since Washburn already has a ring, from 2002. I almost forgot that part.

[jumanji]

Upon further review it would seem likely, to me at least, that moving Washburn to a contender amounts to the organization trying to help the guy get to the world series.

For his sake, you mean? They've been ridiculously overpaying the guy for four years; I don't think they owe him anything. And Washburn isn't exactly the kind of guy who comes to mind when you think of long-suffering players who deserve to win, like, say, Jamie Moyer.

Oh yeah, especially since Washburn already has a ring, from 2002. I almost forgot that part.

Obviously for his sake because it doesnt help the Ms and they probably woundnt get much for him. I like the way he's gone out and battled while getting basically no run support. I stopped trying to figure out who was underpaid and who was overpaid in this sport a long time ago.

[PhilipNelsonFan]

Just give us Matt Kemp. That's all I ask. LA doesn't care to use him, so might as well.

[Sweezo]

I like the way he's gone out and battled while getting basically no run support.

Why is it people seem to get extra credit in sports for simply doing their jobs when things don't work as well as they planned? There are no promises made when someone signs a contract...and I'm pretty sure Washburn knew he was in for some rough performances when he signed with the M's given the history and then current make-up of the franchise. He didn't sign with a contender, he signed with a crappy team that threw a lot of money his way.

Washburn signed a four year/$37 million contract with the M's, and over the course of his contract he's averaged about 30 appearances per year. He doesn't deserve any praise for going out once a week, throwing 100+ pitches, and cashing a $308,000 paycheck each time regardless of the outcome.

And I'm not always a fan of his 'battling' mentality. His insistence in shaking McLaren off when he was clearly out of gas meant he gave up plenty of runs and cost his team games last year when the bullpen should have been called in. Which is mostly on the manager's shoulders since a manager needs to know to make decisions and not be upset if it hurts a player's feelings, but still...

Yeah...he's a real hero.

[jumanji]

I like the way he's gone out and battled while getting basically no run support.

Why is it people seem to get extra credit in sports for simply doing their jobs when things don't work as well as they planned? There are no promises made when someone signs a contract...and I'm pretty sure Washburn knew he was in for some rough performances when he signed with the M's given the history and then current make-up of the franchise. He didn't sign with a contender, he signed with a crappy team that threw a lot of money his way.

Washburn signed a four year/$37 million contract with the M's, and over the course of his contract he's averaged about 30 appearances per year. He doesn't deserve any praise for going out once a week, throwing 100+ pitches, and cashing a $308,000 paycheck each time regardless of the outcome.

And I'm not always a fan of his 'battling' mentality. His insistence in shaking McLaren off when he was clearly out of gas meant he gave up plenty of runs and cost his team games last year when the bullpen should have been called in. Which is mostly on the manager's shoulders since a manager needs to know to make decisions and not be upset if it hurts a player's feelings, but still...

Yeah...he's a real hero.

You must really love Bedard.

[Sweezo]

I'm actually not a huge fan of Bedard, but I'm glad he's not stupid enough to pitch when injuries/fatigue make him ineffective or jeopardize his ability to take the mound next time he's scheduled to do so.

Warrior mentality among pitchers is one of those old-school platitudes that I think is extremely harmful. This team is not better when an injured Carlos Silva or tired Jarrod Washburn lies to the manager and the training staff and keeps pitching. There's a difference between being tough and being the black knight from Monty Python and the Holy Grail...

Similarly, I also don't believe this team was helped in 2007 when Raul Ibanez hid an issue he was having with his shoulder that rendered him wholly ineffective for the first four months of that particular season.

Thankfully it's not as big of an issue now because we seem to have a manager who is observant is concerned more about the team's well being than massaging a player's ego.

[BlackMamba]

what would be the Ms target? prospects or ready to play players?

[jumanji]

what would be the Ms target? prospects or ready to play players?

Teams in the hunt arent likely to give up ready to go guys, and with Washburn's age i wouldnt expect much as far as prospects go either. Bedard would probably get you something good but that lightweight is always out of the lineup so it's hard to even showcase him.