How are we going to use Crawford?

[parson]

I hear so many opinions concerning how we're going to play Crawford - from being Joe's backup to being our starting PG (and, of course, somewhere inbetween).

For example, I could see us using Crawford like Joe has been playing ... and letting Joe play like Bibby. Joe would take more shots than Bibby did, but the point is the "mix" -- how we play as a team. Crawford would do the isos that Joe has been doing. Technically, I guess that'd make Crawford our PG (with Teague playing the same way).

I'm interested in y'all's opinion.

[YaBoyKD91]

Well,i personally think that he's going to be coming off the bench as our 6th man.He said in an interview that he doesnt care if he starts or not.

[Jcrawford11]

him and joe johnson should both split point duties based on who is havein the better shooting game move to the 2......6'5 and 6'7 would be a nightmare for backcourts

[killbuckner]

I'd prefer the team to stop using the term pointguard and let whichever guy is facing the poorer defender initiate the offense while the other one looks to absue the other team if the defense has to send help.

[mr_grabb]

I hear so many opinions concerning how we're going to play Crawford - from being Joe's backup to being our starting PG (and, of course, somewhere inbetween).

For example, I could see us using Crawford like Joe has been playing ... and letting Joe play like Bibby. Joe would take more shots than Bibby did, but the point is the "mix" -- how we play as a team. Crawford would do the isos that Joe has been doing. Technically, I guess that'd make Crawford our PG (with Teague playing the same way).

I'm interested in y'all's opinion.

I think you have to be daydreaming to think that we can ask Jamal to play like Joe and Joe like Bibby. It doesnt work like that. Jamal plays like Jamal, and Joe like Joe. You don't change a player like that. When Joe arrived in ATL he was asked to run the point, and it didnt work. We're not trying again.

So we're gonna have two scorers who are essentially shooting guards with above average skills for creating for others, but who would rather shoot first than pass. I think it's a problem. I think that Marvin, Smith, and Horford will get less involved on O due to the shift from Bibby to Crawford, which might make us an easier team to stop offensively.

More importantly, I firmly believe that Crawford is now a determinant factor that will drive Joe out of town. With another proven scorer on board (even is less efficient and valuable), Joe probably won't feel like staying here any more.

[mr_grabb]

I too would prefer seeing Jamal come off the bench and play something like 30 mins, and keeping Bibby to play the point for maybe 30 a night. Joe would play around 35 switching from SG to SF.

But let's face it, it's not happening. We won't have the space to resign Bibby (we have to sign a few bigs and deph players, and I don't think that Bibby wants back with Crawford on board), and we have no one else who we'd like to tun the point more than Jamal.

[JoshB914]

Craw should step into Flip Murray's role, and I think he would be perfect as a guy coming off the bench that can fill it up. Flip was often able to keep us afloat offensively with Joe and/or Bibby out of the game and there is little doubt in my mind that Crawford can fill that role perfectly.

But I still think we should be approaching the offseason in the exact same manner as we were before signing Jamal. We need a starting PG whether it be by way of resigning Bibby, dealing him for another PG, or signing a guy like Ramon Sessions to replace him.

[parson]

I think you have to be daydreaming to think that we can ask Jamal to play like Joe and Joe like Bibby. It doesnt work like that. Jamal plays like Jamal, and Joe like Joe. You don't change a player like that. When Joe arrived in ATL he was asked to run the point, and it didnt work. We're not trying again.

I'm talking about how the players are used in Woodson's system. Seems to me, our offense right now is Joe pounding the ball and looking either for his shot or for someone to dump the ball off to in the last seconds. That seems to me to be our entire half-court offense. I'm simply saying I wonder if we're going to ask Crawford to do the "pounding and looking" and for Joe to be more of a shooter (like Bibby has been for us).

So we're gonna have two scorers who are essentially shooting guards with above average skills for creating for others, but who would rather shoot first than pass. I think it's a problem. I think that Marvin, Smith, and Horford will get less involved on O due to the shift from Bibby to Crawford, which might make us an easier team to stop offensively.

More importantly, I firmly believe that Crawford is now a determinant factor that will drive Joe out of town. With another proven scorer on board (even is less efficient and valuable), Joe probably won't feel like staying here any more.

Bibby has played more like a SG than a PG for us. At least, I don't think too many folks here will argue that Bibby is a true PG. So we've already been playing that way. I think that what you're worrying about is how we've already been structured.

As for Joe getting upset at Crawford's play: I think the opposite is true. I think Joe wants someone else to carry the half-court leadership and allow him to just focus on scoring. I further think both Crawford and Teague are suited for that role opposite Joe. I've read a lot of articles concerning Joe where he seems to be happy with Crawford AND Teague.

That said, I'm still scared of Crawford, but then, I was scared of Flip Murray's reputation before this past season, as well.

[killbuckner]

I think its an open question of how well Teague will do without the ball in his hands. He had a great outside shot but did it on his own move and not in a catch and shoot situation. I see absolutely no reason why he can't take on that role but he simply hasn't been asked to do it much before now.

I think that my prefered offense very well could be a 3 wing offense. A pile of athletic combo guards, SGs, and SF's who can all exploit a weak defender 1 on 1 and also hurt a team from the outside off the ball if the opposing team collapses. Most teams have at least 1 really brutal defender out of the 3 spots and just abuse them until the other team is forced to make a change. So many teams inititate the offense from a position other than PG that I think its outdated thinking to believe the team needs a traditional PG.

The issue I have with Crawford is that he is not at all a high efficiency scorer and if I were the other team I would not at all be inclined to send help until late. Crawford does not convert a large percentage of his drives into points. I don't have a problem with going with a combo guard offense but I worry that Crawford is not the right fit.

[D21]

No one of both Joe and Crawford are on the same level than Bibby in term of 3point%, catch and shoot efficiency. We all knew we need a guy like Bibby and were able to see it once he was here.
I was against trading for Andre Miller weeks ago the Bibby trade, because of our roster needing some better shooters at that time. Now we got Evans, and with Marvin improvement, it's a different story, ad we could get benefit from a pass first PG.

But I don't see how we could get more or even the same benefit with a PG being the same kind of player than Joe. Crawford will play with ISO (and specially with the coach being Woodson), will dribble a lot, something Murray was making.

What I see in Crawford is an upgrade for Murray's role, and allowing to not use part of MLE to fill this role.
Like Mr_grabb said, split Joe's time between SG and SF, with Marvin playing the remaining time of SF, which would make Evans tradeable.
Keep Bibby and Marvin if possible, or sign and trade him and keep Evans, but we won't better without Bibby, or at least without another PG maybe not athletic like Crawford, but better shooter, or better pass first PG.

Now, if we go back to the point of the upgrade of Murray's role, like some KB said, is it worth paying 3 times what we could have paid Murray ?

I don't think so, and that's why I see justification in the Crawford trade only if you want to spend all the MLE on someone else and letting Murray walk.

But if we do that, it mean more salaries. Meanwhile, it's doable.
Right now, we are at 44M, if Bibby re-signs for 7M and Marvin for 8M, it makes 59M for Bibby-Teague-Crawford-Joe-Marvin-Evans-Smith-Horford-Morris. We can keep Zaza for 5M or sign a big for the MLE, then fill the roster with 3 minimum contracts, and maybe one BAE (or part of) instead of a minimum. We would be at 68-69M, pretty much the same than last year but nearer the tax threshold.

It would be Zaza or a MLE big, so not much of of improvement on the C position, unless we trade Marvin or Smith.

[Harry10]

easy, his natural position from college to the pros........... PG

[DirtyDez]

ATL should trade Josh Smith and Al Hortford to PHX for Amare Stoudemire, Jason Richardson and a draft pick... Talk to Amare's agent and sign an extension before he agrees to the deal and get J-Rich who's better than Jamal Crawford, Mo Evans or Flip Murray. This makes ATL instant contenders in the Eastern Conf.

[betta1]

ATL should trade Josh Smith and Al Hortford to PHX for Amare Stoudemire, Jason Richardson and a draft pick... Talk to Amare's agent and sign an extension before he agrees to the deal and get J-Rich who's better than Jamal Crawford, Mo Evans or Flip Murray. This makes ATL instant contenders in the Eastern Conf.

With Amare's injury issues/history, I'm not sure I would trade Smith straight up for him, let alone add Horford to the mix.

Now, I would love to get Nash. I doubt we have the salaries to make it work, unless we sign and trade Bibby and add future picks. Maybe Teague would have to be involved, which would probably be a deal breaker for a lot of Hawks fans.

[HMFFL]

ATL should trade Josh Smith and Al Hortford to PHX for Amare Stoudemire, Jason Richardson and a draft pick... Talk to Amare's agent and sign an extension before he agrees to the deal and get J-Rich who's better than Jamal Crawford, Mo Evans or Flip Murray. This makes ATL instant contenders in the Eastern Conf.

So we don't have to play defense?

I would be open to acquiring Amare, but not Jason Richardson (a fan).

[parson]

'Dez, you're throwing away our future. Soon, Richardson will be done (he's already overpriced) and Amare could lose his hops any year now. Barring major injury, Smoove and Horford will be very good for the next decade.

Go for the championship, fine, but if you fail, you've suffered 5 years of poor basketball for nothing. At least, with Smoove and Horford, we'll know we'll be playoff-quality. If we're going to give up those 2, we need to be certain we'll contend.

[DirtyDez]

'Dez, you're throwing away our future. Soon, Richardson will be done (he's already overpriced) and Amare could lose his hops any year now. Barring major injury, Smoove and Horford will be very good for the next decade.

Go for the championship, fine, but if you fail, you've suffered 5 years of poor basketball for nothing. At least, with Smoove and Horford, we'll know we'll be playoff-quality. If we're going to give up those 2, we need to be certain we'll contend.

Your right, Hortford and J Smith will be very good for a long time but they wont be great, If you put a dominating scoring threat down low along w/ a defensive big-man like Zaza they would dominate the paint. Amare would command double-teams which ATL has never had and free up shooters. JJ wouldn't have to create his own shot on every position. If Amare is completely healthy it would catapoult the Hawks from 'middle of the pack' to serious contenders. J Smith has potential and Hortford is an decent PF. If ATL wants to stay a 4th or 5th seed for the next few years then don't make the trade...

[johnny878]

LOL at Zaza being a good defensive big man

[parson]

...a defensive big-man like Zaza ...

Oh, if only t'were true.

[JoshB914]

ATL should trade Josh Smith and Al Hortford to PHX for Amare Stoudemire, Jason Richardson and a draft pick... Talk to Amare's agent and sign an extension before he agrees to the deal and get J-Rich who's better than Jamal Crawford, Mo Evans or Flip Murray. This makes ATL instant contenders in the Eastern Conf.

Lol. That title absolutely does not make us "contenders" in the EC.

I wouldn't want to deal Josh and Al for Amare. Although if the GSW rumors were accurate (before the deal fell through b/c of Curry) then there surely might be teams willing to overpay for him.

[_BBIB_]

If we don't re-sign Bibby he has to be our starting PG. If we do re-sign Bibby, Crawford plays the Flip Murray role.