Exploring Boozer to Chicago

Post #1 » by **CellarDoor** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 2:17 pm

There are a few things that I as a Chicago fan like about Boozer for our team:
He's a legit scoring option, 2nd option at worst on our team.
He's a post scorer
He has a good jumpshot
He's a fantastic rebounder
He's expiring

There are also a few things I don't like about him:
He's a bit undersized
He's an atrocious defender
He's got injury concerns
He's got way too much acne for someone under bright lights
He's expiring

That said, I'm willing to look past the bad and explore some options for getting him. I see three legit directions to go in as far as principle goes: Deng, Hinrich, and Salmons

Deng gives them a long term answe at SF who would be a terrific fit in Sloan's flex offense. His contract and injuries are a concern, but when healthy he gives them a 2nd/3rd option, good rebounding from the 3 slot, good defense, and efficient offense.
Idea: Deng, Tyrus for Boozer, Miles

Rose/Hinrich
Hinrich/Miles
Salmons/Johnson
Boozer/Noah/Johnson
Noah/Miller/Gray

Deron/Maynor
Brewer/Korver
Deng/AK47
Milsap/Tyrus/AK47
Okur/Koufos

Hinrich gives them a versatile guard who can play next to Deron ala Fisher, behind Williams running the offense, with Maynor running the offense, with Maynor off the ball, and at SF to defend some of the scorers (Pierce, etc). His shooting and defense and overall hustle seem to fit perfectly into Sloan's plans for any team.

Idea: Hinrich, Tyrus for Boozer, Miles (note: Chicago would have to move an expiring for a PG. Perhaps James' insured contract for Antonio Daniels or Mike James?
Rose/Daniels
Salmons/Miles
Deng/Miles
Boozer/Noah/Johnson
Noah/Miller/Gray

Deron/Hinrich/Maynor
Hinrich/Korver/Brewer
Brewer/AK47/Korver
Milsap/Tyrus/AK47
Okur/Koufos

Salmons gives them a versatile wing with solid defense. He's sort of a blend between Hinrich and Deng as far as positives go. The one plus (minus?) to him is that he's very likely an expiring, so if they did not want to retain the salary in a trade of Boozer, but wanted to get value for this year, Salmons is a good way to go.

Idea: Salmons, Tyrus, James for Boozer, Miles
Rose/Hinrich
Hinrich/Miles
Deng/Miles/Johnson
Boozer/Noah/Johnson
Noah/Miller/Gray

Deron/Maynor
Brewer/Salmons
Salmons/AK47/Korver
Milsap/Tyrus/AK47
Okur/Koufos
What about it Utah fans? Chicago fans? Do any of these work?

*Note to Jazz fans* if you don't like AK's diminished role, pretend the rumored deal with Ak47 and TMac goes down, or we can try and find a third team to send tyrus to for assets.

tidho · Post #2 » by **tidho** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 3:57 pm

I like the first deal.

When I saw the title of the thread I thought 'this better at least include Deng'. I think that's fair enough value that the benefit of aligning Utah's talent correctly makes them consider it.

Chicago would start looking dangerous too.

stevebozell · Post #3 » by **stevebozell** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 3:59 pm

As a Jazz fan I like the 2nd deal best....I would love to see Hinrich on this team.

Post #4 » by **CellarDoor** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:07 pm

I think both are very good fits on Utah. I was trying to contemplate ways to get them both there for the hell of it, and I can't come up with anything. We'd need, in addition to Miles, at least one sixth man caliber wing coming back as well as a nice asset. The only thing I could figure was...

Deng, Hinrich, Tyrus for Boozer, Brewer, Miles, 2010 NYK 1st

But I feel like that's getting too much on Chicago's end without a real way to balance it.

Deron/Kirk/Maynor
Kirk/Korver
Deng/AK47
Milsap/Thomas/AK47
Okur/Koufos

/shrug.

Post #5 » by **gswhoops** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:11 pm

^^ At the very least, you'd have to remove that NYK pick from the deal.

Post #6 » by **CellarDoor** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:16 pm

gswhoops wrote:^^ At the very least, you'd have to remove that NYK pick from the deal.

Agreed, Brewer is too valuable to add it, and yet neither is valuable enough on it's own. That's why I said I didn't see a real way to balance it.

stevebozell · Post #7 » by **stevebozell** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:18 pm

Would Korver, as a decent shooter and an expiring as well, be of any value to Chicago?

Post #8 » by **CellarDoor** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:21 pm

stevebozell wrote:Would Korver, as a decent shooter and an expiring as well, be of any value to Chicago?

He would, i'm just not sure he alone would be enough to cover the depth issues in the deng+hinrich scenario.

Boozer, Miles, Korver as the players incoming leaves us like this: (assuming James for Daniels)
Rose/Daniels
Miles/Korver
Salmons/Korver/Johnson
Boozer/Tyrus/Johnson/Gibson
Noah/Miller

That's simply not enough wing depth unless we want to rely on Miles and Korver to both play 30+mpg, in which case, why get Boozer?

Smills91 · Post #9 » by **Smills91** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:23 pm

I think the fundamental flaw of any of Boozer deals is that these really don't provide Utah with what they're looking for. INSTANT cap savings. I'd imagine Detroit, OKC, Memphis and Sacramento as the 4 main targets as they're the teams that can provide salary savings THIS summer. To help the Jazz get below the lux tax and/or re-sign Paul Millsap in the process.

Post #10 » by **CellarDoor** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:27 pm

Smills91 wrote:I think the fundamental flaw of any of Boozer deals is that these really don't provide Utah with what they're looking for. INSTANT cap savings. I'd imagine Detroit, OKC, Memphis and Sacramento as the 4 main targets as they're the teams that can provide salary savings THIS summer. To help the Jazz get below the lux tax and/or re-sign Paul Millsap in the process.

Even from the quote you posted in another thread (I think the AK/1st for Martin one?) They indicated a willingness to simply be rid of him. And there are, according to loserx, some quotes running around where the Jazz have stated they would pay the tax this year (saying and doing is different, but still)

If that's the case, these deals work. If it's not, we're wasting our time. So be it. I'm not doing much at work today

Smills91 · Post #11 » by **Smills91** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:30 pm

CellarDoor wrote:
Smills91 wrote:I think the fundamental flaw of any of Boozer deals is that these really don't provide Utah with what they're looking for. INSTANT cap savings. I'd imagine Detroit, OKC, Memphis and Sacramento as the 4 main targets as they're the teams that can provide salary savings THIS summer. To help the Jazz get below the lux tax and/or re-sign Paul Millsap in the process.

Even from the quote you posted in another thread (I think the AK/1st for Martin one?) They indicated a willingness to simply be rid of him. And there are, according to loserx, some quotes running around where the Jazz have stated they would pay the tax this year (saying and doing is different, but still)

If that's the case, these deals work. If it's not, we're wasting our time. So be it. I'm not doing much at work today

Yeah but that was for expirings + assets. I think the #1 asset they can get now is cap relief. I don't see much on the Bulls roster that offers that kind of combination. Sure Boozer would fit well with the Bulls, but the Jazz IMO don't want/need much from the Bulls.

Post #12 » by **CellarDoor** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:32 pm

You don't think Deng and/or Hinrich fill needs? And We've got more expirings than most teams with Miller, James, Thomas, and likely Salmons. Anyways, not sure why i'm debating with a Kings fan when the 2 jazz fans were both receptive a a deal

Leto · Post #13 » by **Leto** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:38 pm

The value is fair but Boozer does not fit the M.O. of Paxson and Bulls bigs. For that reason, I don't think the Bulls would be interested in Boozer.

boogydown · Post #14 » by **boogydown** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:39 pm

Smills91 wrote:I think the fundamental flaw of any of Boozer deals is that these really don't provide Utah with what they're looking for. INSTANT cap savings. I'd imagine Detroit, OKC, Memphis and Sacramento as the 4 main targets as they're the teams that can provide salary savings THIS summer. To help the Jazz get below the lux tax and/or re-sign Paul Millsap in the process.

Yeah, Detroit doesn't have anymore money so they're out. OKC is another story so you may have something there. Memphis spent it on Zach Randolph, and the Kings aren't looking to spend money.

So you have OKC.

Post #15 » by **CellarDoor** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:43 pm

Leto wrote:The value is fair but Boozer does not fit the M.O. of Paxson and Bulls bigs. For that reason, I don't think the Bulls would be interested in Boozer.

My argument would be that the Paxon MO hasn't exactly been successful so far, and with Boozer expiring in a year, it's an experiment so to speak. If he plays well in the system, then we retain him. If he doesn't we lost a long-term asset for more capspace.

Leto · Post #16 » by **Leto** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:49 pm

You would have an argument but, I don't think he'll attribute any failures to be a result of his basketball philosophy. Rather, it will more likely be attrubuted to the youth of their players and a failure to execute on the floor.

Smills91 · Post #17 » by **Smills91** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:52 pm

CellarDoor wrote:You don't think Deng and/or Hinrich fill needs? And We've got more expirings than most teams with Miller, James, Thomas, and likely Salmons. Anyways, not sure why i'm debating with a Kings fan when the 2 jazz fans were both receptive a a deal

Because they're using emotions, rather than logic here. ANY Fan wants there team to get better players. But often times ignore the bottom line. The Bottom line is the Jazz WILL seek financial relief. And dealing Boozer is the quickest, easier and most substantial way of doing this.

Smills91 · Post #18 » by **Smills91** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:53 pm

boogydown wrote:
Smills91 wrote:I think the fundamental flaw of any of Boozer deals is that these really don't provide Utah with what they're looking for. INSTANT cap savings. I'd imagine Detroit, OKC, Memphis and Sacramento as the 4 main targets as they're the teams that can provide salary savings THIS summer. To help the Jazz get below the lux tax and/or re-sign Paul Millsap in the process.

Yeah, Detroit doesn't have anymore money so they're out. OKC is another story so you may have something there. Memphis spent it on Zach Randolph, and the Kings aren't looking to spend money.

So you have OKC.

I thought Detroit had about 4 million in cap space left over???

stevebozell · Post #19 » by **stevebozell** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:53 pm

Nevermind Smills....Deng, Hinrich, and Tyrus would all be attractive (and fill needs) to the Jazz in some manner.

It all depends on which combination, and what they are giving up in return.

Smills91 · Post #20 » by **Smills91** » Tue Jul 7, 2009 4:56 pm

stevebozell wrote:Nevermind Smills....Deng, Hinrich, and Tyrus would all be attractive (and fill needs) to the Jazz in some manner.

It all depends on which combination, and what they are giving up in return.

Dude. There's no way the Jazz take on Deng or Hinrich for Boozer. That not only does NOT save them money NOW, but adds future liabilities to their roster. I just can't fathom the Jazz front office(typically fairly responsible) as doing this.

Sure every team's fans hopes their team will ignore the lux tax and spend freely like Paul Allen...but not every team's owners are BILLIONAIRES, even then, Paul Allen has his limits as he doesn't want a cash trap of a business.