Martin OFFER ideas

[KF10]

I'm not saying this is THE way to go either...but to me now we are finally talking about a way to improve our situation. One max player buys us an 8th seed.

What do you think we will do in 2010? Is it all hype for us? Or we are going to eventually overpay a 2nd tier talent like Johnson and build pieces around the Evans/Martin/Johnson core?

For me, I want the Kings to push for JJ in 2010 hard. I believe he would be a terrific fit here. He becomes our go to guy. Most people here does not think Martin is the guy. Having a great 1-2-3 lineup, will pay dividends at the end.

[koos]

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachi ... eId=kwonao

probably the most realistic trade someone thought of on another board

Houston get Martin

Sacramento gets Rudy Fernandez, Brian Cook

Portland gets Shane Battier

Battier brings veteran leadership that Portland lacks. They are already loaded at the 2 guard with Roy, Webster, and Batum/Outlaw may play some time at the 2 guard.

Sacramento gets a young exciting player in Fernandez (24 yrs old), very cheap contract 1.1 MIL.. Brian Cooks contract is expiring at 3.5 MIL

Houston gets their starting SG


or this trade... Kings would get Bayless

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachi ... eId=lm2mzg

[Inc]

Uhh.. Kings get raped in both of those trade.

[ezekielbear]

Evans should get quite a few FT''s a game if he is indeed a starter. In the 6 range or so this year. He's going to have to until he picks up his shot.

The only reason to trade Martin is for another "star"...which really just isn't going to happen. He's relatively cheap considering the production he produces and we've yet to really see him next to any legit talent. He's no #1, but, most guys aren't.

[KF10]

Good lord. Kings get bashed on both of the last deals. Rudy does not merit Martin's value. Even less for Bayless.

[ICMTM]

I'm not saying this is THE way to go either...but to me now we are finally talking about a way to improve our situation. One max player buys us an 8th seed.

What do you think we will do in 2010? Is it all hype for us? Or we are going to eventually overpay a 2nd tier talent like Johnson and build pieces around the Evans/Martin/Johnson core?

For me, I want the Kings to push for JJ in 2010 hard. I believe he would be a terrific fit here. He becomes our go to guy. Most people here does not think Martin is the guy. Having a great 1-2-3 lineup, will pay dividends at the end.

I just know it won't be until 2016 until Tyreke Evans is going to be in his prime so building young and through the draft will be as ecxiting as watching my toenails grow. I'm making an assumption Evans will be a star.

I also know Spencer Hawes and Jason Thompson don't look like they will be regulars to the all-star game year after year. I don't think Martin will be an all-star so my question is how do we get all-star players? I'm not sold that this is the answer:

Hawes
Thompson
Greene (or put your fav 3 here)
Martin
Evans

We've got to flip this some how and move one of the three (Martin Hawes Thompson) IMO. I'd like to see us in a position to acquire more talent. One way is with cap space. Will it be the best way? Maybe? Do I think this deal is the best deal? Probably not. I'm just saying a deal that says hey this is what we are trying to do would work for me. Standing pat hasn't worked and patchwork fixes haven't either.

[KF10]

I just know it won't be until 2016 until Tyreke Evans is going to be in his prime so building young and through the draft will be as ecxiting as watching my toenails grow. I'm making an assumption Evans will be a star.

I think from now until the duration of Martin's contract is a significant showing of what will the franchise will do. Will they have Martin be part of a larger picture? OR we eventually trade him and put bank on Evans/Thompson/Hawes core to suceed?

I would like to believe that Petrie is in a tough position because of that. In my personal preference, I hope we will make something happen in the duration of Martn's contract. It would be a shame that we are not successful to some extent within 3-4 years. And as well as using up Martin's prime years into something mediocre. Richmond anyone?

I also know Spencer Hawes and Jason Thompson don't look like they will be regulars to the all-star game year after year. I don't think Martin will be an all-star so my question is how do we get all-star players? I'm not sold that this is the answer:

Hawes
Thompson
Greene (or put your fav 3 here)
Martin
Evans

Assuming Evans is a star in 2-3 years(like a 20/5/6 player) and Martin developed into a more consistent overall player (like a 25/5/4 player) by 2 years. I would like to believe that the backcourt (at the very least) is pretty damn good. And Thompson will be this (17/9 player) and Hawes (15/9/3 player). The team would be easily playoff caliber IMO. And we can easily build from there.

*I know to much assumptions haha*

We've got to flip this some how and move one of the three (Martin Hawes Thompson) IMO. I'd like to see us in a position to acquire more talent. One way is with cap space. Will it be the best way? Maybe? Do I think this deal is the best deal? Probably not. I'm just saying a deal that says hey this is what we are trying to do would work for me. Standing pat hasn't worked and patchwork fixes haven't either.

Or do we take advantage of a disgruntled star that wants out or something? i.e. Amare, Boozer (just simple examples. I'm not advocating anything) We can't hope to land a franchise player like a Webber on our laps. I think the chances of that will happen is pretty slim anyways.

Either way, we need to see something happen relatively soon IMO. If not, I do not see this team be very successful for a while...

[SacTownKings4Life]

Patience people! Patience!
You do NOT go from the bottom to the top overnight. It's a process.

My better judgement is telling me that we most likely are NOT going to sign anybody of significance due to one simple fact...
Who WANTS to come to Sacramento? I mean, really ask yourselves that. Who wants to come here?
How many Vlade Divac's are there in the league right now?
You DO realize that we only had ONE (count em, ONE) major free agent signing thoughout the ENTIRE 8 YEAR PLAYOFF RUN.

Bibby? Traded for Jason Williams, who was drafted.
Christie? Traded for Corliss Williamson, who was drafted.
Peja? Drafted.
Webber? Traded for Mitch Richmond, who initially was traded for Billy Owens, who was drafted. Which leaves only...
Divac as the lone free agent signing. THROUGH 8 YEARS!

Oh, and just for the record, Artest (our biggest star since webber) was ALSO traded for. And after he resigned, he IMMEDIATELY stated that it was the biggest mistake of his career.

Does anybody see a pattern here? SACRAMENTO DOES NOT GET FREE AGENTS!
It's been nothing but drafting, trades, and player resignings.
The only way we are ever going to get back to contention is one of two ways.
Either we develop our young talent REGARDLESS OF HOW LONG THAT MAY TAKE, or we just so happen to stumble into another Webber-like trade.

If you wish to put all your cards into a miracle trade to save the day, be my guest.
Meanwhile, I will be waiting patiently until our youth matures. I've been a Kings fan since 93 - 94. I've been through the bad times. PLENTY of them. This is nothing to me. I am optimistic though, because we appear to have FAR more potential for future greatness then we had back then.
Only time will tell though. Don't be so quick to jump off the bandwagon or push the panic button every year that we don't make the playoffs.

[ICMTM]

Patience people! Patience!
You do NOT go from the bottom to the top overnight. It's a process.

My better judgement is telling me that we most likely are NOT going to sign anybody of significance due to one simple fact...
Who WANTS to come to Sacramento? I mean, really ask yourselves that. Who wants to come here?
How many Vlade Divac's are there in the league right now?
You DO realize that we only had ONE (count em, ONE) major free agent signing thoughout the ENTIRE 8 YEAR PLAYOFF RUN.

Bibby? Traded for Jason Williams, who was drafted.
Christie? Traded for Corliss Williamson, who was drafted.
Peja? Drafted.
Webber? Traded for Mitch Richmond, who initially was traded for Billy Owens, who was drafted. Which leaves only...
Divac as the lone free agent signing. THROUGH 8 YEARS!

Oh, and just for the record, Artest (our biggest star since webber) was ALSO traded for. And after he resigned, he IMMEDIATELY stated that it was the biggest mistake of his career.

Does anybody see a pattern here? SACRAMENTO DOES NOT GET FREE AGENTS!
It's been nothing but drafting, trades, and player resignings.
The only way we are ever going to get back to contention is one of two ways.
Either we develop our young talent REGARDLESS OF HOW LONG THAT MAY TAKE, or we just so happen to stumble into another Webber-like trade.

If you wish to put all your cards into a miracle trade to save the day, be my guest.
Meanwhile, I will be waiting patiently until our youth matures. I've been a Kings fan since 93 - 94. I've been through the bad times. PLENTY of them. This is nothing to me. I am optimistic though, because we appear to have FAR more potential for future greatness then we had back then.
Only time will tell though. Don't be so quick to jump off the bandwagon or push the panic button every year that we don't make the playoffs.

When we were winning people wanted to play here.

I've been a Kings fan since 85' and nobody thought the Kings could be a winner so the "bad times" weren't bad because we didn't know any better. Now we do, and we (especially board regulars) know enough about how the NBA works that we can rebuild.

If the Kings wait to win there won't be a fan base to support the team.

[Krimzen]

I also know Spencer Hawes and Jason Thompson don't look like they will be regulars to the all-star game year after year. I don't think Martin will be an all-star so my question is how do we get all-star players?

If your really lucky, maybe you catch a team that is willing to trade an all-star in their prime for your collection of talent/picks/capspace, but it is exceedingly rare. Even more rare for a smaller market team is signing an all-star who is a free agent. So we are probably going to have to get star players the same way everyone else does, lotto picks and a little bit of luck.

I'm not sold that this is the answer:

Hawes
Thompson
Greene (or put your fav 3 here)
Martin
Evans

I agree, I am not sold on that either.

Fortunately, we have at least a couple years more of likely high-mid lotto picks. We have a lot of capspace that could make us a player in facilitating a trade and pick up another asset. We will have some younger talent that may become trade-bait down the road if we determine we need a change at a certain position.

We've got to flip this some how and move one of the three (Martin Hawes Thompson) IMO.

We've GOT TO? No, we don't. The chances of any deal coming along in the very-near future that would improve the team significantly going forward are minuscule.

I'm just saying a deal that says hey this is what we are trying to do would work for me. Standing pat hasn't worked and patchwork fixes haven't either.

I guess the difference is that I don't see any imminent need to make any moves, other than doing everything humanly possible to dump Nocioni to free up SF minutes for the young players there.

Petrie and his crew need to be keeping an eye on what is going on around the league in case some good deals pop up, but this season is going to be very important in seeing what some of the younger guys can do with even more minutes, and how they begin to fit together. That in turn, will help guide the team in what it needs to do in the draft and free agency going forward to get even better.

I am not opposed to trading Martin for the "right deal", because I would be willing to trade just about any player short of a true superstar for the "right deal". The chances of a proper return for him right now are not good, so we should see how he fits with the other younger guys in the meantime.

If the Kings wait to win there won't be a fan base to support the team.

Who says trading Martin will make that happen? Yes, fans want a winner. Building a winner takes time and patience, by the fans and by the front office. The whole reason we are in this mess now is that Petrie tried to keep a winner going by signing free agents and acquiring veteran players when we lost our top talent instead of blowing it up with young talent. Except for half a year with Bonzi/Artest where we had some excitement, that dragged on the mediocrity while fan attendance steadily fell. I think that the direction your advocating will take the team backwards, not forwards. Competing for an 8th seed in the playoffs might help a little, but it doesn't guarantee anything as far as the arena goes.

[SacTownKings4Life]

When we were winning people wanted to play here.

I've been a Kings fan since 85' and nobody thought the Kings could be a winner so the "bad times" weren't bad because we didn't know any better. Now we do, and we (especially board regulars) know enough about how the NBA works that we can rebuild.

If the Kings wait to win there won't be a fan base to support the team.

Yeah sure, EVERYBODY want to play with a winner. See Lakers & Celtics...

But still, name me ONE other big name player who WILLINGLY signed here... (resignings don't count)

So goes the life of a fair-weather fan base, I guess.

What I'm saying is that the odds of another Vlade Divac signing or a Chris Webber deal are not very good for us at this point in time.
Now that we suck again, nobody BIG TIME is going to want to play here. ON TOP of the fact that there's nothing to do here anyway.
Do you honestly think we even have a ghost of a shot at Lebron or Wade or Bosh or anybody of that caliber? ...

If somebody doesn't show some semblence of patience, we will NEVER become anything close to the team we once were. People need to realize that those days are gone, and they are never coming back. At least, not in that same exact way.

As it was, we were EXTREMELY lucky that a bunch of discarded pieces from various teams were able to come together the way that they did.
Webber was a bad boy.
Bibby was nobody special.
Vlade was OK at best.
How many people even heard of Doug Christie or Bobby Jackson or Jon Barry (ect.) before they came to Sacramento?
Fans PROTESTED the drafting of Peja & Hedo.

I'm not confident that same scenario is going to play out again for us verbatum.
We as fans need to move on from 2002 and worry about 2012 (or something like that). IE, the future.