Sessions Update:Ramon signs T-Wolves OS (page 310 update)

[LUKE23]

No interest in a PF that can't defend, shoot, or block shots. We will be a good rebounding team, and that is Lee's really only strength.

[Dobber-16]

Mike Hunt is already laying the groundwork for the Bucks to not match an offer for Sessions.
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/bucks/51531337.html

Yes sir, the footings have been placed. I like Ramon, but business is business. Good luck Ramon.
It looks like an over-the-top move by the Knicks. Front load the contract. leave space for the next 2 years. The Bucks are just going in another direction, but which way? Hummm.......

[Bernman]

Right, and no one is asking to pay him $15 million a year like true 16/12 guys get paid or $12 million a year as fake potential 16/12 guys like Bogut got. $8 million. That's it. Less than Mo Williams is paid. Less than TJ Ford makes. Less than Kirk Hinrich or Cutino Mobley. About $1 million more a year than Etan Thomas or Dan Gadzuric.

And all those teams who shelled out 8 million regret the decision. Falls under the ol' 2 wrongs don't make a right saying.

Replacement level Richard was a horrible investment at $14/$15 million a year. At $8mm he'd be a rich man's Mike Miller. Ditto Michael Redd. I think people are still ripping Lee based on some perception he's going to get paid $10 or $12 million a year. $8mm flat for four years with a player option after year three is a decent deal for him and a great deal for a team signing him.

First off, Michael Redd is at a level above all the other players you mentioned. And I would give him around 8 million dollars per year if he had maintained somewhat of a clean bill of health over the years.

If David Lee makes 8 million dollars per year, he better be one of the top 3 reasons a team without a transcendent talent, ala Lebron (because he can carry a team all by himself and you just can't count on acquiring a player like that), could win a championship or seriously contend for one in the future. Do you really believe he's in that category? Say the Orlando structure from last year, for example. Dwight Howard, Rashard Lewis, and David Lee? RLR will be at best the 4th best player on the Spurs, and they may not even seriously vie for a championship next season.

[LUKE23]

Yes sir, the footings have been placed. I like Ramon, but business is business. Good luck Ramon.
It looks like an over-the-top move by the Knicks. Front load the contract. leave space for the next 2 years. The Bucks are just going in another direction, but which way? Hummm.......

West, Vegas.

[europa]

Alan Hahn from New York Newsday's latest Tweet:

I'm told no offer sheet imminent on Sessions/Knicks. They're still interested, but not at the full MLE.

https://twitter.com/alanhahn

Time to change the title again. "Knicks back in? Also Clips. But neither at Full MLE"

Too many sources saying the Knicks aren't going to make a play. If that changes, I'll edit the title. For now, it's still looking like the Clips or bust.

[europa]

NY Times says the Knicks signing Sessions is "unlikely." Here's a quote from Wells trying to salvage what little market value his client appears to have presently:

“Nothing’s changed,” Wells said Thursday. “We’re still talking to teams, and the Knicks are one of them. We’re trying to get something done sooner rather than later and go from there.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/24/sport ... nicks.html

[Bernman]

Alan Hahn from New York Newsday's latest Tweet:

I'm told no offer sheet imminent on Sessions/Knicks. They're still interested, but not at the full MLE.

https://twitter.com/alanhahn

Time to change the title again. "Knicks back in? Also Clips. But neither at Full MLE"

Too many sources saying the Knicks aren't going to make a play. If that changes, I'll edit the title. For now, it's still looking like the Clips or bust.

There was ESPN, and what else besides regurgitation of that article?

2 independent sources, Alan Hahn and Gery Woelfel, reported that the Knicks were still interested.

Here is the most recent update on Sessions from his agent via an NY Times article, “Nothing’s changed,” Wells said Thursday. “We’re still talking to teams, and the Knicks are one of them. We’re trying to get something done sooner rather than later and go from there.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/24/sport ... nicks.html

Once again it comes down to what you desire to believe, and that would be that the Knicks aren't interested, which would increase the chances Ramon ends up in a Bucks' uniform.

[YouthMovement]

And then an accompanying list of how many teams played as many possessions per game as the Knicks did last season.

Shawn Marion put up 22/12/2blk/2Stl in D'Antoni's system, but hasn't had near the impact on a game since the two parted company.

Zach Randolph was on pace to average 21/12 before he got traded out of D'Antoni's system.

Biedrins was at 14/13 in the same amount of minutes. I think you can extrapolate because the minute difference is under 5. 14/13 wouldn't qualify him for Lee's 16/12 club, but he wouldn't qualify for Biedrins' 14/13 club either. 16/12 is kind of an arbitrary standard.

Moral of the story is often a player has reached the vicinity of that statistical level in one of the modern day run and gun systems.

Randolph averaged 24 and 10 in Portland and 17 and 10 under Isiah Thomas...Shawn Marion averaged 19 and 10 and 21 and 10 the two years before D'Antoni came. You say he was on pace to average 21/12 yet that was through 11 games. In the 39 games he played in Dunleavy's half court system in LA, he averaged 21 and 9. Get your facts straight.

[europa]

NY Times says Sessions signing with the Knicks is "unlikely." Both ESPN and David Aldridge have reported the Knicks are backing off.

Right now, there are several respected reporters saying the Knicks are out and Wells/Woelfel saying they're not.

I'm going with the majority on this one.

[GrandAdmiralDan]

I still think a Gadz-Sessions for Thornton isn't a total wipeout deal. Hammond then has full MLE for this summer and next summer if he wants.

Who is even left that we would want at the MLE?

Ramon Sessions?

Gad + Ramon for Marcus would be amazing

Whoa, hold it right there. There is no way I package GAD and Ramon. That would DECIMATE this board. GAD's knowledge of the financial side of the NBA is worth at least a 2nd rounder. Well, maybe not in next year's draft but still. Too much to give.

I'm flattered
But yeah, a 2010 2nd might be asking too much. 2011? 2012? I'm easily worth one of those

And it speaks volumes about how good Sessions was playing that the Bucks stayed in the playoff race as long as they did with him as the starter and the team without Bogut and Redd.

Yeah the bucks appreciated ramons effort so much theyre willing to award him an extension .....oh wait ... nevermind .

It's probably still a little early in the game to say they don't appreciate him. Not offering an extension when he's a RFA anyway just makes good business sense, especially when he has an inflated sense of self value (as most athletes do).

Sessions wasn't eligible for an extension.

We wouldn't have been allowed to give him an extension.

[Bernman]

NY Times says Sessions signing with the Knicks is "unlikely." Both ESPN and David Aldridge have reported the Knicks are backing off.

Right now, there are several respected reporters saying the Knicks are out and Wells/Woelfel saying they're not.

I'm going with the majority on this one.

I'm fascinated by the way the filter in your mind works. The article from the NY Times said the Knicks are still talking to Sessions' agent, but you put that in the not interested category. It's unlikely Sessions ends up in LAC, the third still to be named later team (other than speculation), or even Milwaukee, by the percentages. Just because they're probably not going to extract him, doesn't mean they're not interested. Considering how high the D'Antonis are on Sessions, they'll always be interested, it just depends on what the price tag is.

[YouthMovement]

Alan Hahn and your own beat writer Gery Woelfel both said the knicks are very much still interested in Sessions. ESPN never reported that the Knicks weren't interested, they just said David Aldridge reported that. I can't remember the last time David Aldridge reported something accurately.

[Bernman]

Alan Hahn and your own beat writer Gery Woelfel both said the knicks are very much still interested in Sessions. ESPN never reported that the Knicks weren't interested, they just said David Aldridge reported that. I can't remember the last time David Aldridge reported something accurately.

He's not technically the Bucks' beat writer, but thanks for the information on the ESPN article. I thought that was a regurgitation of Aldridge's, but I couldn't locate it. So it's 3 separate sources that say the Knicks are interested, and one that says they are?

[europa]

I'm fascinated by the way the filter in your mind works.

Let me repeat the key elements here since you curiously decided to ignore them:

1. The NY Times said the Knicks signing Sessions was "unlikely."
2. David Aldridge reported the Knicks were backing out of their pursuit of Sessions.
3. ESPN reported the Knicks were backing out of their pursuit of Sessions.
4. Sessions has not received an offer sheet from the Knicks despite multiple reports earlier in the week saying he would get one.

That's enough of a majority for me at the present time to stick with the headline that is on my thread. Should something concrete arise that alters the Knicks' position with regard to Sessions, I'll update the thread title. Until then, I see no reason to disagree with two prominent NBA reporters and a major newspaper which covers the Knicks.

[europa]

ESPN never reported that the Knicks weren't interested, they just said David Aldridge reported that.

That's incorrect. Marc Stein reported the same thing tonight.

It's starting to look as though Milwaukee restricted free agent Ramon Sessions might have to settle for an offer that does not start at the full midlevel exception price of $5.9 million, with sources insisting that the Knicks are no longer chasing Sessions and that Oklahoma City is reluctant to use any of its salary-cap space to pursue the point guard.

[GrandAdmiralDan]

Let me repeat the key elements here since you curiously decided to ignore them:

1. The NY Times said the Knicks signing Sessions was "unlikely."

europa, you know as well as I do that the NY Times is a joke when it comes to sports. They're not even going to continue to even have sports at all. They're mailing it in over there. Not saying that means they aren't correct right now, but still.

2. David Aldridge reported the Knicks were backing out of their pursuit of Sessions.
3. ESPN reported the Knicks were backing out of their pursuit of Sessions.

Isn't #3 just ESPN reporting that David Aldridge reported that?
(ETA: Apparently not. You just mentioned Marc Stein reported it separately)

4. Sessions has not received an offer sheet from the Knicks despite multiple reports earlier in the week saying he would get one.

This is probably your strongest evidence, but even this is not real strong.

There are just so many conflicting reports here from multiple sources, and it seems to go back and forth every few hours over the last couple days. I wouldn't be comfortable stating anything anymore as being likely to be the case, apart from the fact that nothing has actually happened yet.

[europa]

GAD, as I posted Marc Stein has his own report saying the Knicks are no longer interested. He does not cite Aldridge as any credible reporter would do if he was simply parroting another person's report.

And if we're going to toss out the NY Times, that's fine. Then we might as well toss out Woelfel on this subject too since it seems pretty apparent to me his info is coming straight from Wells. Woelfel was wrong about the Pacers. He overplayed the Thunder's interest and he's been insisting the Knicks were going to make a big offer. Why? Likely because that's what Wells has been telling him and what Wells needs to get out there to help build up a market for Sessions.

So we toss out the Times and Woelfel. That leaves Aldridge and Stein. I'll take them and what they are currently reporting.

[BDUB_30]

Mike Hunt is already laying the groundwork for the Bucks to not match an offer for Sessions.
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/bucks/51531337.html

Yep ..


I said the same thing at the deadline , ive been saying it all along ... Ramon is not the pg of the future for this team . hes not worth the money being discussed ...and the only way hes a buck is at 3 mil per ..



How did i know this ?



Because i place very little emphasis on box scores and i watch the games closely . I record every single game and i re-watch them . I can break the game down in slow motion etc etc .


Sessions isnt half the player this forum made him out to be ...and im glad we have a gm smart enough to see thru this ..

[BDUB_30]

Mike Hunt is already laying the groundwork for the Bucks to not match an offer for Sessions.
http://www.jsonline.com/sports/bucks/51531337.html

Yes sir, the footings have been placed. I like Ramon, but business is business. Good luck Ramon.
It looks like an over-the-top move by the Knicks. Front load the contract. leave space for the next 2 years. The Bucks are just going in another direction, but which way? Hummm.......

Precisley ...unlike you i dont like Ramon , but business IS business ...

[BDUB_30]

But if they can't start surrounding Andrew Bogut with some genuine talent soon, all those sound financial decisions won't amount to a hill of used basketballs. That means Jennings absolutely cannot flop. That means Ersan Ilyasova showing something, Luc Richard Mbah a Moute learning to make shots and Joe Alexander getting it together as a bridge to the future. Eventually, they must begin demonstrating their value to the Bucks or someone else as trade potential.

That's where the new regime will eventually rise or fall, not on a couple of restricted free agents.





Hunt starting to come around a bit with his writing ... Not to bad , someone has to be feeding him this stuff or hes been following me around on this forum ..