Trade Recaps

[HeavyP]

Trades we've done since the season has started:

In the Majors:
INF: Yuni and Cedeno for Jack Wilson and Hannahan
SP: Washburn for Luke French and Ian Snell (I figure both are major league players)
OF: Balentien for Langerhans

In the Minors:
Inf: Jeff Clement, Mike Morse
P: Nathan Adcock, Brett Lorin, Aaron Pribanic, Justin Souza
For
P: Derrick Saito, Dan Cortes, Robert Manuel, Mauricio Robles

The actual trades:
Yunieski Betancourt for Derrick Saito and Dan Cortes (Big win for the M's)
Mike Morse for Ryan Langerhand (Big win for the M's)
Jack Hannahan for Justin Souza (It's at least been a win, but I think it's closer to a wash.)
Ronny Cedeno, Jeff Clement, Nathan Adcock, Brett Lorin, Aaron Pribanic for Jack Wilson and Ian Snell (in terms of talent maybe small win for Pitt, however I believe it is closer to a wash)
Wladamir Balentien for Robert Manuel (Win for us?)
Washburn for Luke French and Mauricio Robles (Win for us)


Lovin' it.

[Sweezo]

Even with being a little unhappy about sending so many young pitchers to Pitt...I guess you look at it as a whole and see Jack Z. is using other trades to add pitchers and be in a position where he can trade some guys off. Like he's not just cleaning house with the M's and bringing in his own guys...he's doing it up and down the organization.

Next year's team will have some young pitchers that may be tough to rely on, but we actually have legit starting options. I'd rather be in this position that relying on bringing old vets that have seener better days and hope we strike gold, or feel forced to overpay known innings-eaters.

[BlackMamba]

thanks HeavyP, i was trying to find a place that would have all the trades done to see the outcome and a balance.

at first i didn't understand, but seeing this and with Sweezo's post i'm getting how Jack Z is handling the team and i think he's really showing that he's in seattle looking to make this team better and into a real contender and showing others how it's done without giving big contracts and then flushing that money down the toilet.

this is really looking good for the M's future and the trades didn't make seattle loose big time prospects or actual star team players.

[Bulltalk]

Let's just rename this the "I Heart Jack Zduriencik" thread. After the abomination of the Bavasi era, I would have been content with a merely competent and unexciting GM. Instead, it seems we've got a guy who REALLY knows what he's doing, and isn't afraid to do things.

You can certainly nit-pick individual moves he's made, or how he's made them; but from my perspective, I think he's won most every trade he's made, or at the very least they've been quite intelligent trades; and if Ian Snell becomes a solid starter for us next year, he may have run the table so far in these departments. This is before you even get into his FA signings, his rather promising draft this year, and his first choices of our new on-the-field management team.

I've gone from being a despondent M's fan coughing on fumes to being a rationally hopeful and excited M's fan in a matter of about 8 or 9 months. He acts with conviction. We were a weak hitting team. What does he do? He strongly biases our draft towards position players, and signs a promising young outfielder/hitter in the international draft. Check! Our starting rotation begins to look vulnerable for next year. What does he do? In a couple of trades he brings in French and Snell, two promising starters who at the very least begin to allay such concerns. Check! We get a little worried that our young pitching prospects might be getting a little thin down on the farm. What does he do? He brings Danny Cortes and Mauricio Robles to our team. Check! There's the fear that not only will Balentien find no place on our team, but that we might lose him for nothing. What does he do? He makes a trade that brings us the 2008 minor league Double A relief pitcher of the year. Check! We all hate Yuni. What does he do? He trades him for a couple of pitching prospects in a favorable financial deal that still leaves me shaking my head. Check!

I'm really curious to see what this guy will do with the salaries of Washburn, Bedard, Beltre, Batista, Griffey, and Sweeney coming off the books?

[Ex-hippie]

I pretty much agree with HeavyP's assessment, except with respect to the Balentien-Manuel trade. Some arguments in favor, and the rejoinders:

"He had been DFA'd and they were about to lose him for nothing." Well, obviously, the team shouldn't have DFA'd him in the first place without having a definite plan for him. A lot of people thought a trade had already been worked out. Were they in such a hurry to get Michael Saunders up? It couldn't have waited a few more days?

"He hadn't been performing and this wasn't a sell-high opportunity." Yeah, but a low-upside minor leaguer who doesn't fill an organizational need is more than just selling low; it's throwing Wlad away.

"He was a righty pull hitter and didn't fit with the team or the stadium." But fair market value should be determined on what someone else would be willing to give up, not intrinsic value to the team that already owns him. Plus, he may not have fit with the team's plans, but neither does Robert Manuel; they've got tons of more talented righty relievers in the system.

All in all, I think the team could have gotten more for Wlad. If nothing else, throw him in to facilitate an acquisition they couldn't have otherwise pulled off.

[Ex-hippie]

Even with being a little unhappy about sending so many young pitchers to Pitt...I guess you look at it as a whole and see Jack Z. is using other trades to add pitchers and be in a position where he can trade some guys off.

Yeah, and although some of those pitchers had been getting good reviews in the minors, especially Lorin, I never heard of any of them as being integral parts of the minor league system. During his tenure, GMZ has brought in Maikel Cleto, Daniel Cortes, and now Mauricio Robles, plus he inherits Aumont, Pineda, Ramirez, etc. It's a position of organizational strength, relatively speaking, and he was able to use a few of them to get what he wanted.

As Dave Cameron pointed out, it makes sense for an organization to stockpile young arms because of uncertainty and attrition. The likely scenario is that one of the three becomes a useful major league pitcher someday -- whereas Ian Snell can be a useful major league pitcher today, and the team still has a decent-sized stockpile. I'm okay with that tradeoff.

[Sweezo]

I'm OK with it now. The Snell/Wilson moves was one of those moves where you couldn't tell what GMZ was thinking w/r/t Washburn...since they were adding veterans, I wasn't sure if the move was designed for an ill-fated stretch run or for the future.

Which is, in hindsight, completely to GMZ's credit. If he makes a move to add a shortstop that is a complete 'we're selling,' maybe his posturing with Washburn rings completely and he doesn't get the same trade from the Tigers.

GMZ traded off young arms...for young arms which are MLB ready.

The Balentien trade is the only one that sticks out as a bit illogical, but we've all seen Balentien play. Anyone think he puts it together and makes us regret it under Dusty Baker's tutelage? Kinda doubt it.

[Napoleon7]

Overall very good moves. Strong decisive moves by JZ.
AND HevyP thanks for the recap.

[Ex-hippie]

A friend/colleague who's a Mets fan came by my office today and said "I want to thank you for Sean Green." In case anyone missed it, last week, Green entered a tie game, threw a wild pitch, walked a batter, then threw another wild pitch and lost the game. Then, yesterday, he entered a 7-7 game against St. Louis with two out in the top of the 10th and the bases loaded. His first pitch hit the batter, breaking the tie. Then Albert Pujols came up, and next thing you know, the game was 12-7.

I swear, at this point I wouldn't mind trading Putz, Green, Reed and Valbuena for Franklin Gutierrez by himself. It's gravy that the team got Mike Carp, next year's starting first baseman. And Maikel Cleto, one of their better pitching prospects. And Jason Vargas, who appears to be a credible fifth starter. And Endy Chavez, who was an asset in left field. And Eziquiel Carrera, who shows promise. And Aaron Heilman, who was turned into two major leaguers in Ronny Cedeno and Garret Olson. That could go down as one of the greatest trades in franchise history.

[TTown]

The Washburn deal is even more of a home run when you think back to last year when most were hoping we could dump him to the Yanks strictly to get out of some/most of his contract. It didn't matter what we got back, as long as he was gone. This year, we bring back a pair of potential starters.